RandomAct Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 I wanna talk about entrances. Something I've been thinking about alot lately is how horrible entrances are now. Most of that is due to how WWE has to have everyone do their routine in their entrance every night with zero variation. I kinda miss how an entrance could convey the type of match your about to see, or the kind of emotion you should be feeling before the match. An example I love to use is Onita's entrance for his '99 match with Chono. Everything from the music, to Onita's shit eating grin, to the crowd reaction just made for an amazing entrance, and made me excited a match I wouldn't have cared about otherwise. I agree 100% with you on this. Especially the comments about WWE. It's one of those things where every aspect of the average WWE TV show is completely sterilized and non-spontaneous. The stupid jib camera shot on the WWE logo before Seth Rollins comes out is one that particularly gets me. I mean, every single time? Really? The HD set sucks. And it sucks even more that it's being used for PPVs too. I mean, honestly, one of the reasons I think I love NXT and Lucha Underground so much is that the presentation is just so much different from the main WWE shows. One thing I miss about WCW is the long aisle, so guys could talk shit right to the camera, slap hands with fans at the rail (or get in their faces, rip their signs, whatever). It just does not happen in WWE and it's something that really takes away from both the live and TV experiences. I think it speaks to a bigger problem in WWE, in that everything is meant for the camera, and the crowd is just window dressing. The wrestlers barely acknowledge them, and I've made the point many times that none of these could work a crowd if you put a gun to their head. There is no hand slapping, there is no heel jawing with the fans. It's all an emotionless, homogenized performance. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vincey Greene Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 I wanna talk about entrances. Something I've been thinking about alot lately is how horrible entrances are now. Most of that is due to how WWE has to have everyone do their routine in their entrance every night with zero variation. I kinda miss how an entrance could convey the type of match your about to see, or the kind of emotion you should be feeling before the match. An example I love to use is Onita's entrance for his '99 match with Chono. Everything from the music, to Onita's shit eating grin, to the crowd reaction just made for an amazing entrance, and made me excited a match I wouldn't have cared about otherwise.I agree 100% with you on this. Especially the comments about WWE. It's one of those things where every aspect of the average WWE TV show is completely sterilized and non-spontaneous. The stupid jib camera shot on the WWE logo before Seth Rollins comes out is one that particularly gets me. I mean, every single time? Really? The HD set sucks. And it sucks even more that it's being used for PPVs too. I mean, honestly, one of the reasons I think I love NXT and Lucha Underground so much is that the presentation is just so much different from the main WWE shows.One thing I miss about WCW is the long aisle, so guys could talk shit right to the camera, slap hands with fans at the rail (or get in their faces, rip their signs, whatever). It just does not happen in WWE and it's something that really takes away from both the live and TV experiences. I think it speaks to a bigger problem in WWE, in that everything is meant for the camera, and the crowd is just window dressing. The wrestlers barely acknowledge them, and I've made the point many times that none of these could work a crowd if you put a gun to their head. There is no hand slapping, there is no heel jawing with the fans. It's all an emotionless, homogenized performance. It's funny. I was watching Souled Out 98 earlier as I did other things, and I was pondering why despite clearly achieving far more success in WWE, Chris Jericho was never eeeeeeeever as good as he was in WCW. What you're talking about is exactly why. He was awesome at working the crowd and running his mouth and doing random goofy shit. Which Vince/Kevin Dunn/whoever you want to blame completely drained out of him. So I think it's a long standing problem. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Vince just needs to have edecanes standing there bopping along when guys come out. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 You know what I haven't seen in a while? A ladder match where the rules are that the object they are retrieving becomes legal once they've grabbed it and grabbing the weapon/object isn't the finish. I saw one with a singapore cane that ECW did sometime in 98 or 99, but I don't think I've seen one since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(BP) Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 You know what I haven't seen in a while? A ladder match where the rules are that the object they are retrieving becomes legal once they've grabbed it and grabbing the weapon/object isn't the finish. I saw one with a singapore cane that ECW did sometime in 98 or 99, but I don't think I've seen one since.I think the similarity to "On a Pole" matches killed that, although that was the stip for that Nash/HHH ladder match with the sledgehammer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 You know what I haven't seen in a while? A ladder match where the rules are that the object they are retrieving becomes legal once they've grabbed it and grabbing the weapon/object isn't the finish. I saw one with a singapore cane that ECW did sometime in 98 or 99, but I don't think I've seen one since.I think the similarity to "On a Pole" matches killed that, although that was the stip for that Nash/HHH ladder match with the sledgehammer. I completely forgot about that match! Hard to believe that was four years ago already. I just saw Nash on Kimmel before the Finals, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinit Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Wouldn't a ladder match be the best kind of match to cash in MITB?? No pinfall, just retrieving the belt to win the title? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 That or an Iron Man. Just whack the chanp with a chair a few times so he gets the win via DQs and then cash in once the timer runs out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyMax46 Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 The problem with Jericho is that he tried to be a heel in WCW, but he was usually always cheered because people didn't want to boo him. Jericho is convinced in his mind he was the most over heel in WCW in some interviews I've heard him do. It must be fun to live in a universe where other people remember your career better than you do, brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 The problem with Jericho is that he tried to be a heel in WCW, but he was usually always cheered because people didn't want to boo him. Jericho is convinced in his mind he was the most over heel in WCW in some interviews I've heard him do. It must be fun to live in a universe where other people remember your career better than you do, brother. Eh, he was pretty over as a heel. Watch the Goldberg angle, for instance. You might have had people popping for his silliness and Ralphus and midget Goldberg, but it was nothing compared to the pop when Goldberg mowed him down. Realistically, outside of DDP, the Goldberg-Jericho feud was probably the best feud Goldberg had in WCW (Even if it went nowhere and had no matches). Or watch the match where Ciclope unmasks as Dean Malenko and takes Jericho out; not sure there was a bigger pop in the history of that division. You don't get those kind of pops without being one of the better heels in the company. And with all the back-and-forth swerve booking and the cool-heels, there really aren't many people in WCW at the time of Jericho that you could say were more over heels than Jericho. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodzillaPerez Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Dammit, just read that Josh Alexander is retiring due to neck injuries. He's been one of my favorite wrestlers for awhile now and has had some of the best live matches I've ever seen. I probably saw him live about 30 times and he usually had the match of the night. He was just starting to break out and I could have sworn he was NXT bound in a couple years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Daniel Bryan: Just Says Yes! Yes! Yes! Is out today and I’ll by buying it. The documentary is an extended version of Journey to WrestleMania. When I first watched the original version, I said it was one of the best ever documentaries by the company and should be on a Daniel Bryan DVD Box Set. Great selection of matches. Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus from Extreme Rules 2012 is Sheamus’s best one on one match, ditto for Antonio Cesaro and Ryback in the Gauntlet match from the July 2013 RAW. Daniel Bryan vs. John Cena at SummerSlam 2013 was my Match of the Year, perfect match. The WrestleMania XXX Triple Threat main event is one of the best types of that match and an underrated match from 2014. I’d lose: Daniel Bryan vs. Big Show. Smackdown, 6th January 2012. Daniel Bryan vs. CM Punk. Money in the Bank, 15th July 2012. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton. RAW, 17th March 2014. Daniel Bryan vs. Roman Reigns. FastLane, 22nd February 2015. I’d replace with: Daniel Bryan vs. Cody Rhodes vs. Sheamus vs. Sin Cara vs. Kane vs. Wade Barrett vs. Heath Slater vs. Justin Gabriel. Money in the Bank, 17th July 2011. Hoped this would make it as it remains the greatest Money in the Bank Ladder match. Daniel Bryan/Kane/Ryback vs. Dean Ambrose/Seth Rollins/Roman Reigns. TLC, 16th December 2012. Daniel Bryan vs. Randy Orton. RAW, 24th June 2013. Daniel Bryan vs. Bray Wyatt. Royal Rumble, 26th January 2014. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BurningBeard Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I wanna talk about entrances. Something I've been thinking about alot lately is how horrible entrances are now. Most of that is due to how WWE has to have everyone do their routine in their entrance every night with zero variation. I kinda miss how an entrance could convey the type of match your about to see, or the kind of emotion you should be feeling before the match. An example I love to use is Onita's entrance for his '99 match with Chono. Everything from the music, to Onita's shit eating grin, to the crowd reaction just made for an amazing entrance, and made me excited a match I wouldn't have cared about otherwise. I get ya. One of my favourite ever entrances is Rick Martel at WM8 - I mean, it's not flashy or cool or anything (although his theme music is one of my most favourite ever) but in his entire ring walk you are effectively told/shown everything you need to know about his character just through Martel's mannerisms and his strut. It's perfect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technico Support Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Dammit, just read that Josh Alexander is retiring due to neck injuries. He's been one of my favorite wrestlers for awhile now and has had some of the best live matches I've ever seen. I probably saw him live about 30 times and he usually had the match of the night. He was just starting to break out and I could have sworn he was NXT bound in a couple years. Well that just sucks. I'd never seen him wrestle until recently, with him and Ethan Page working PWG, but I thought he was good with the limited stuff I've seen him in. Regarding entrances: the Kevin Dunn-inspired homogenization is one of the things I hope goes away when he steps down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brysynner Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 So I think I've burned out on WWE right now....is there any good wrestling available to watch via PS4/Roku/Android Device? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technico Support Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 How does watchwrestling.ch show up on an Android or PS4 browser? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 If we could do blood in WWE again, I'd love for Ambrose or Wyatt to have a Stairway to Hell match. That's probably the stip Zakk was talking about above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Do we actually know that Kevin Dunn is responsible for the homogenization, or is that misplaced blame in the vein of Niners's anti-Cena crusade? Unless I see a source of some kind, I find it much more likely that control freak Vince, where the buck actually stops, is where we should be pointing our fingers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Vince may be a control freak, but there's a decently large body of testimony that what he chooses to care about will shift about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technico Support Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 About Dunn, all we have is the word of various former wrestlers, writers, etc. But hearsay is the same as anything else we hear and take as fact. I'm sure some of it is just guys with an axe to grind but still, where there's smoke, etc. Here's former writer Alex Greenfield talking about Dunn and the look of the broadcasts, for example: WWE shows do look good, but they also look the same. There’s a homogeneity to the feel of the pro duct that stems directly from Dunn. His creative instinct is fast food: if it works, don’t muddle with it and keep Vince convinced it is the only way to do things by any means necessary. That's from this post by Greenfield, which is biased, I'm sure, but the truth is always in there somewhere. I doubt the guy is straight-up lying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trocar Slush Weasel Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 It seems Xavier Woods feels he isn't busy enough: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolfan in NYC Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I want that Power Glove shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallacy! Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 What is even the point of Bray Wyatt on the WWE roster anymore? He randomly starts feuds for no apparent reason, almost never wins, has unexplained supernatural powers but can only use them to turn the lights off and on in the arena. I get that he's an unhinged backwoods swamp weirdo, but even in kayfabe terms he's still a professional wrestler. Shouldn't he be the least bit concerned about the fact that he has never sniffed a WWE World Title opportunity? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRR Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 He's got to cleanse souls and stuff no time for belts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdangerously Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 They clearly have no idea what they're doing with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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