Eivion Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said: Oh, I'll bet he did! (Low hanging fruit). I think it's an issue with the NXT assembly line mentality, to be honest with you. This is going back a while now, but when Tay Conti started getting the hang of things during the beginning of her AEW tenure, I remember having a lot of convos here about that being a bit of an indictment on the NXT system - my gut is that similar would be in play here. Vince expected something of an assembly line while HHH understood time for growth was needed. Always thought Tay suffered from another issue which was that HHH would be afraid to test some talent when it came to longer matches (anything in that 5-10 mins. or more range). Its noticeable how HBK currently gives the women and men in NXT more shots to fail and hopefully grow than HHH. Edited August 17, 2023 by Eivion 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 Vince's perception has prob been skewed by his 2 eras of success being largely built on veterans he did not build from ground up (Hogan, Savage, Austin). I guess you can argue Dwayne was "homegrown" but is also a special case, as a third generation worker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianS81177 Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 4 hours ago, Godfrey said: It's definitely a Vince call. And sometimes it pays off, Alexa Bliss rose to the occasion and totally outpaced the tag team she was managing (Buddy and someone?) Wesley Blake. I only remember because at a NXT show I went to the crowd started a dueling chant of "Which one's Mur-phy?" and "Which one's Blake?" 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Hero Morganti Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 Also with regards to HHH vs HBK down in nxt... Shawn had a wrestling school. So probably approaches green talent completely differently. Black and Gold era NXT did reasonably well with the people who came in with a bit of experience. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 Did Shawn actually train those guys? I always thought it was Rudy Boy Gonzalez who did most of the actual work. (Not unlike the Hart Brothers school) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caley Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 I still maintain Dana Brooke could have worked out but her NXT stay was way too short. She was a heat magnet with that weird armpit rubbing flex she did and she's obviously ridiculously athletic (that flip thing she does (did?) in her entrance was super impressive). But she was just starting to lean into a muscular heel bully role in NXT and get a little less clumsy in the ring when they nonsensically rushed her to Raw to be Alexa Bliss's muscle. This was set up to fail as Brooke wasn't experienced enough or noteworthy enough to be seen as a big deal. Coupled with the fact that women like Charlotte and Nia Jax dwarfed her which kinda negated the muscle part. I thinking she'd been given another 6 months or so in NXT she might have turned out well. Evans is somewhat similar though she had more charisma than Brooke. She was pushed too far, too hard, too fast (Those endless appearances where she strutted to the ring in weird millennial updates of old-fashioned Southern clothing, while they played her annoying theme and Michael Cole repeatedly yelled "THE SASSY SOUTHERN BELLE!" haunt me!). Like when she was shoehorned into that feud with Rollins/Becky by wearing Rollins name on her tights but she had neither the stature not the ability to be at that level. But I still think the natural thing to do was just go "She's a mom, she's a vet, U-S-A! U-S-A!" and the crowd would have cheered and you could have more talented heels look down on her and basically play her as the female John Cena: cheesy but still kind of cheerable. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 21 minutes ago, odessasteps said: Did Shawn actually train those guys? I always thought it was Rudy Boy Gonzalez who did most of the actual work. (Not unlike the Hart Brothers school) I think he did oversee it cause apparently the way Bruce tells it, when they were scouting the infamous first group of guys from Shawn's school, everyone from WWE was looking at Lance Cade. Shawn told them the guy you really want is Bryan Danielson. So he CLEARLY knew what was up even if Rudy Boy did the actual training. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 (edited) If I recall correctly Shawn wasn't actually suppose to be doing anything physical at the time. One of his students (I think Bryan) mentioned Shawn's mother catching him and getting pissed at him because he was still recovering from his back injury. Edited August 17, 2023 by Eivion 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zimbra Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 (edited) I had a buddy who trained at TWA after Michaels left and apparently Rudy Boy bitched a lot about Michaels taking credit for a school he had almost nothing to do with. But it also sounds like Rudy was still salty about the split and bitched about Michaels a lot so take it with a grain of salt. E: Speaking of TWA does anyone still have a copy of the legendary post from back in the day from somebody who trained with Michael Shane talking about what a huge dipshit he was? Edited August 17, 2023 by Zimbra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted August 17, 2023 Share Posted August 17, 2023 Well, Danielson said Michaels just showed once a month or something, so there's his testimony from his book to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonial Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 Looks like Lacey Evans is opening up a restaurant in South Carolina ... Former WWE Wrestler leaves the ring, opens new cafe in Beaufort - Explore Beaufort SC Honestly, her gimmick came off as a David McLane dream scenario -- she would be a perfect fit for WOW if she wants to keep wrestling. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuerrillaMonsoon Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 Curious to see what people have as the best match shown on a promotion's B or C shows? Action Zone had that obvious clique tag match from 94. Superstars less clear. It had a really good Bret vs Backlund match that started the heel run for Bob. Pat Tanaka vs The 123 Kid from late 93 is a ridiculously good sprint. The sunset flip powerbomb to the floor spot is just ridiculous for 1993. Love to hear the nominations for WCW Pro/Worldwide/Saturday Night ..even Thunder. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Hero Morganti Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 205 probably has an ali/murphy(matthews) match that was amazing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HumanChessgame Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 2 hours ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said: Curious to see what people have as the best match shown on a promotion's B or C shows? Action Zone had that obvious clique tag match from 94. Superstars less clear. It had a really good Bret vs Backlund match that started the heel run for Bob. Pat Tanaka vs The 123 Kid from late 93 is a ridiculously good sprint. The sunset flip powerbomb to the floor spot is just ridiculous for 1993. Love to hear the nominations for WCW Pro/Worldwide/Saturday Night ..even Thunder. Brad Armstrong and Jushin Liger had one of the better Worldwide matches I can remember (I think this was my first time seeing Liger). Sabu and Devon Storm had a really good match on either Worldwide or Pro but I can't find it anywhere https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt2ExoB_-Dg Mr. Perfect and Doink had two time limit draws on Superstars/Challenge https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0dY7A4etM8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaeSOggP-Nw 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elizium Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 I don't think Lacey Evans was any good, but that's never stopped anyone from being successful before, but her Spirit Halloween Antebellum gimmick when she started absolutely sunk her. Hard to take any repackaging seriously after that 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.K.o.S. Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 2 hours ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said: Curious to see what people have as the best match shown on a promotion's B or C shows? Action Zone had that obvious clique tag match from 94. Superstars less clear. It had a really good Bret vs Backlund match that started the heel run for Bob. Pat Tanaka vs The 123 Kid from late 93 is a ridiculously good sprint. The sunset flip powerbomb to the floor spot is just ridiculous for 1993. Love to hear the nominations for WCW Pro/Worldwide/Saturday Night ..even Thunder. First thing that came to mind was the infamous Raven vs. Kaz Hayashi match... which, looking it up, I see was on WCW Worldwide. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
username Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 8 hours ago, Zakk_Sabbath said: This is going back a while now, but when Tay Conti started getting the hang of things during the beginning of her AEW tenure, I remember having a lot of convos here about that being a bit of an indictment on the NXT system - my gut is that similar would be in play here. I want to point out that in retrospect all of this was a bit of an overreaction as I think after the initial "hey, Tay is better than we thought she'd be" effect wore off she was revealed to still be a rather flawed wrestler who had more... let's say execution issues than her initial hot start revealed. I think NXT was hurt by covid causing the house show loop equivalent they had going on getting dropped for years (is it even back now?), that was how a lot of the trainee-level people there were getting their reps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Commander Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 21 minutes ago, HumanChessgame said: Sabu and Devon Storm had a really good match on either Worldwide or Pro but I can't find it anywhere was Sabu really in WCW for long enough to have any Worldwide/Pro matches end up on TV? the only Sabu WCW matches on TheHistoryOfWWE that weren't on Nitro/Havoc are from a "TV Taping" in August 1995 where he worked Chris Kanyon twice, so is it possible that you're confusing Devon Storm and Chris Kanyon? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 (edited) 31 minutes ago, DJ Hero Morganti said: 205 probably has an ali/murphy(matthews) match that was amazing At least two or three. They had great chemistry. There is also a damn good Swerve/Gulak match that drew plenty of the crowd in despite none of them really knowing Swerve at the time. 205 had a pretty decent number of good matches. Edited August 18, 2023 by Eivion 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shartnado Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 15 hours ago, Technico Support said: DVDVR: where Scandinavians slyly paraphrase Rock Superstar just to see if anyone notices. Thank you for noticing! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shartnado Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, DJ Hero Morganti said: 205 probably has an ali/murphy(matthews) match that was amazing Yes, more than one. And a few Cedric Alexander/Murphy matches, too. And on the subject of Lacey Evans, I'd have to look pretty hard to find a clearer proof that Vince is completely out of F'n touch than her being called "Sassy Southern Belle" in Goddamnened 2020! You couldn't have gotten away with that in the 90's, FFS! Edited August 18, 2023 by Shartnado All About Evans 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said: Curious to see what people have as the best match shown on a promotion's B or C shows? Action Zone had that obvious clique tag match from 94. Superstars less clear. It had a really good Bret vs Backlund match that started the heel run for Bob. Pat Tanaka vs The 123 Kid from late 93 is a ridiculously good sprint. The sunset flip powerbomb to the floor spot is just ridiculous for 1993. Love to hear the nominations for WCW Pro/Worldwide/Saturday Night ..even Thunder. Good question. WWE Main Event: Kofi Kingston vs. Cesaro, 1st May 2013. Kofi's best singles match. WWE Velocity: Chris Benoit vs. William Regal, 16th July 2005. WCW Power Hour: Sting vs. Cactus Jack, 23rd November 1991. Much better than WCW Beach Blast 1992. AEW Dark: Athena vs. Marina Shafir, 10th January 2023. AEW Rampage: Bryan Danielson vs. Minoru Suzuki, 15th October 2021. Edited August 18, 2023 by The Natural 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 Didn't the first Action Zone have a Bret vs. Owen match? I am coming up on this in my rewatch for 1994 so I am pumped. Anyway, where the hell do I find this shirt that Mika Iwata has on? Spoiler 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Commander Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 I was looking around Peacock last night and I thought to myself "maybe I should watch the Cruiserweight Classic" which certainly has some good matches, right, maybe... so thats kind of a C show that's out there Then again the Peacock has stuff like Evolve and wXw tucked in there and I guess some of that is good but there's quite a bit of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eivion Posted August 18, 2023 Share Posted August 18, 2023 43 minutes ago, Cobra Commander said: I was looking around Peacock last night and I thought to myself "maybe I should watch the Cruiserweight Classic" which certainly has some good matches, right, maybe... so thats kind of a C show that's out there Do we really count tournament specials as C shows? Feels like that might be cheating just a pinch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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