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MARCH 2019 WRESTLING TALK.

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Posted (edited)

Plus, Slaughter could slot into the "blue-collar American with the value of hard work" slot against rich or entitled heels like Million Dollar Man. Slaughter as a face espousing the values of owing one's country as opposed to being a rich douchebag who feels that their country owes them would have been tremendous. 

Edited by Smelly McUgly
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Even beyond the Slaughter benefits, the most important thing was, as we're seeing: Whoever was going to take Hogan's spot in this hypothetical HAD TO be able to be a crossover star people outside the "wrestling bubble" would know.

In the 1980s, there was really only a shortlist of people, independent of booking, who could give you that: Hogan because of "Rocky III", Slaughter because of "GI Joe", and Jerry Lawler because of "hey, that's the guy on Letterman who fought Andy Kaufman, right?"

If we have Hogan and Slaughter, the third also would have been an interesting direction (Lawler had the ability to wrestle any type of heel like Hogan, but he also could have worked heel and changed things up if WWF got someone bigger.) 

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Anyone want to watch these two Jumbo/Baba vs Brody/Ladd matches so I don't have to? 

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3 minutes ago, Matt D said:

Anyone want to watch these two Jumbo/Baba vs Brody/Ladd matches so I don't have to? 

No, not unless it's because I lost a bet. 

...hey, want to make a match-watching bet? 

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4 minutes ago, Matt D said:

Anyone want to watch these two Jumbo/Baba vs Brody/Ladd matches so I don't have to? 

If they were just Jumbo vs. Brody matches, they absolutely.  I'm about 1000% sure I wouldn't want to see Baba and Ladd around it.

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Raziel said:

If they were just Jumbo vs. Brody matches, they absolutely.  I'm about 1000% sure I wouldn't want to see Baba and Ladd around it.

I finally gave in and am watching it. You're nuts. Ladd is the best part of this match. So many cool little things you'd never see from anyone else. Brody's the worst. 

If you want Jumbo vs Brody that badly though, here's what I think is a match no one on this side of the pacific has seen in decades, if ever:

 

Edited by Matt D

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Re: the AWA and WWF expansion - It was Vince, it had to be Vince. There was no board of directors to hold him back or to tell Verne what year it was. The traditional method of make money on the house show circuit - lose money on TV and have supershows a couple times a year in the big cities - had been in place for 50 years but technology was going to force a change, and would benefit the early adopters. VKM's ventures on his own were unsuccessful and he was going to go into the family business and do it his way ("dammit" (sorry)). He knew he was right and in hindsight, he was. Part of that focus is that he can't understand why everyone else doesn't see it his way. If you don't, you are WRONG and deserve your failure. He believed (believes) that all the workers are willing to sacrifice their home life (on the road), bodies (schedule, steroids) and autonomy (gimmicks). If he can do it, they can too (see also: Shane M.: gigging, Stephanie M.: breast implants). The man is driven. Wrestling genius? Maybe - it depends whether your definition of wrestling ends at the ring ropes. Business visionary? 100% ("pal" (sorry)). His ambiguity in dealing with his choasen profession to the rest of the world is understandable when viewed thusly.

- RAF

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Bix's really weird anti-Rousey fixation is...well weird. So, and I know this is really fucking inside baseball, but when did he get like this? Did the rise/toxicity of Twitter just turn everyone into an asshole?? 

On a more wrestling relevant topic,  has there ever been anything written long-form about the All-Japan/NOAH split? I remember reading about it at the time, of course, and I'm sure Meltzer covered it in depth but seems like a good subject for a book. Related - any good books on the history of lucha?

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Posted (edited)

Lately, I've been thinking how Tony Schiavone should be in the WWE HOF, and I was wondering who you guys thought were the five greatest play-by-play (not color guys unless you want to list them too) guys in history

My Top 5

Jim Ross

Vince

Tony Schiavone

Mauro Ranallo

Gordon Solie

I haven't really seen a lot of matches where Gordon announced but I feel he should be on there, out of respect maybe.  Was he good or was he just a fan favorite?

Edited by notoriusvig

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Solie was great. Treated it like s sport. Also, he's already in the WWE HOF.

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Lance Russell and Bob Caudle are both HOF worthy. A shame Lawler or Michael Hayes didn't pull a few strings to get Lance inducted before he passed.

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Was Mean Gene good?  I need to pull out my best of AWA dvds now.

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My Top 5 PBP guys, in order:

1. Solie

2. Schiavone

3. Russel

4. Caudle

5. Ross

 

And Ross is basically only because everyone else is substancally worse and Ross has a longer high period than his end of career coast mode.  Cases could be made for pre WWE Mauro and pre-Vince Screaming in his ear Cole, but outside of that, those 5 pretty much smoke everyone else.

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I think Lance just smokes everyone else and it’s not even close. 

Hot take - in hindsight, all of Ross’s WWF/E run is bad. He just happened to be there to scream and yell over iconic and really cool moments. Go back and think about anything he commentated that wasn’t Foley/Austin/Rock doing cool shit and it’s pretty bad. He also BURIED the fuck out of things he didn’t like and sounded bored just like he would do during his NJPW run years later.

Notable mention: Styes really was great in ECW

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My favorites are: 

1. Gorilla Monsoon - He was able to explain how the holds worked and made everything seem important ("History has been made here!"). Gorilla also had great chemistry with two different partners (Ventura and Heenan). Working well with your partners is a lost art that I would like to see return in the future.

2. Mauro Ranallo - He has a lot of credibility from MMA,, and if you accept that he's a very hyped-up guy, his match calling is solid.

3. Joey Styles - Another one with a strong knowledge of the names of moves, which is very important, and he was perfect for ECW. He cut strong promos, too ("He's going to have to pay for what he did").

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I like an announcer who talks to me, not yells at me. That's why I liked Lance Russell and Gorilla Monsoon the best.

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What was the name of the All Japan commentator during the 90’s? Whoever he is, he sounded like the greatest play-by-play guys ever.

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For me

Ross (pre WWF), Solie, Lance, Tony,  Caudle.

 

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Styles was super overrated, IMHO.  He sounded great when Heyman was producing him, like in the original ECW and ONS 05 and 06 but when he announced anywhere else, he was just kinda bland.  Plus, sure he knew the move names in ECW but isn't there more to being a play-by-play guy then just knowing the moves.  Say what you want about Vince but he certainly knew how to put guys and stories over more than he ever called moves by their technical names.

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Vince called moves by their names. He just thought they were all called Whattamanouvre!

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Literally I'm not sure I've ever heard Vince actually call a move.

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You never heard Vince call a "BAAAAAAAAAAACK Body Drop!"?

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3 hours ago, notoriusvig said:

Lately, I've been thinking how Tony Schiavone should be in the WWE HOF, and I was wondering who you guys thought were the five greatest play-by-play (not color guys unless you want to list them too) guys in history

My Top 5

Jim Ross

Vince

Tony Schiavone

Mauro Ranallo

Gordon Solie

I haven't really seen a lot of matches where Gordon announced but I feel he should be on there, out of respect maybe.  Was he good or was he just a fan favorite?

Interestingly enough, one of the wrestling podcasts in my rotation has been covering this subject during their latest "season" of episodes.

Our Vantage Point: Retro Wrestling Podcasts has been doing a Royal Rumble style segment covering the best 20 Wrestling commentators as voted on nominations on their Facebook page, and ranking them, two at a time, over the course of this "season" of ten episodes.

Last week's show had them introduce Gorilla Monsoon and Jim Ross into the rankings. 

https://ovppodcast.wordpress.com/

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