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SorceressKnight

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About SorceressKnight

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  1. With the performance art claims- the big reason it's hard to see pro wrestling as performance art is that no one's willing to take that logic to its logical conclusion, and run an indie promotion taking more from pairs figure skating or synchronized swimming than traditional pro wrestling. When it goes, sell the matches as different exhibitions where the matches, themselves, are the competitors instead of the performers. The workers in the match are not sold as if they're opponents, but rather as if the wrestler and their opponent are a team, and the team's goal is to put on the best match on the card. Each match happens, and then the fans vote on which match was the best, with that match "winning" the event. This style would invariably be absolutely terrible to watch, and that's the point. There's more than just the art work in a vacuum to make pro wrestling work, because it's the way that artwork makes you feel that's so important- and how everything surrounding the match tells you from the beginning how to feel about it.
  2. The problem with "flippiest guy" is that a lot of the most resonating flippy guys are the ones who had some steak to the sizzle and could put on a very good wrestling match. Much like how a good technical wrestler does not necessarily make you a Johnny Kickpads wrestler, being a good high flier does not necessarily make you a flippy guy. The true flippiest guy would be someone who does lots of flips and doesn't know a wristlock from a wristwatch.
  3. I could see it, because the list for people who've held the World Title (either WWE or WHC) is kind of set: 28 former World Champs are already in the HOF: Bruno Sammartino, Hulk Hogan, Bob Backlund, Pedro Morales, Bret Hart, Triple H, Steve Austin, Randy Savage, Shawn Michaels, Diesel, Kurt Angle, Billy Graham, Ultimate Warrior, Yokozuna,, Edge, Eddie Guerrero, Ric Flair, Sgt. Slaughter, Mankind, Buddy Rogers, Iron Sheik, Stan Stasiak, Ted DiBiase, Antonio Inoki, Andre the Giant, Mark Henry, Goldberg. Batista's already been announced this year, and assuming JBL is in, that's 30. That leaves 32 World Champions who are not in the Hall right now. We can safely assume it's a lock the following will one day be inducted: Vince McMahon, John Cena, Brock Lesnar, Randy Orton, The Rock, Undertaker, Big Show, Jeff Hardy, Kane, Rey Mysterio, Christian. That brings it down to 21. We can assume as well, due to extenuating circumstances- Chris Jericho and Rob Van Dam will probably go in eventually when their careers are over and they leave their current promotion (19), and Dean Ambrose will probably also go in one day either alone or with the Shield when his career ends (18...and assuming it's the Shield that knocks Seth Rollins and Roman Reigns off, so 16.) In addition, his work on WWE Backstage makes it suddenly possible CM Punk could get inducted one day (15.) Eight World Champions can be considered currently active and show no signs of stopping: AJ Styles, Daniel Bryan, Sheamus, Kofi Kingston, Jinder Mahal, The Miz, Bray Wyatt, and Dolph Ziggler, Of that list, only Jinder doesn't seem like they'll be HOF-worthy by the time their career ends. Counting Mahal, that leaves a list of potential World Champs to miss the HOF as low as: Sid (and he seems like he'll eventually go in), Ivan Koloff (surprising he hasn't been a Legacy HOFer yet), Chris Benoit (obvious minefield there, and as I said the Four Horsemen clause can count it), The Great Khali (...somehow, I think he's a future throw-in HOFer to build up a class). Leaving- the only two World Champions who don't seem to be Hall of Fame-worthy as Jinder Mahal and Jack Swagger. which...kind of seems appropriate somehow.
  4. Because "less than pretty good" has been able to get in many, many times in the WWE Hall of Fame already. Shit, Bob Orton Jr., Koko B. Ware, Hacksaw Jim Duggan, Torrie Wilson, and Hillbilly Jim all never tasted a championship in WWE, and all five of them made the Hall of Fame. If you really think JBL, a former WWE World Champion, is somehow less deserving of a Hall of Fame induction than five people who couldn't even merit a title reign at any level in WWE whatsoever, then you're just biased. If there's any rules surrounding this, then a bare minimum is "you were the World Champion in WWF/E or WCW (and I'd be able to consider ECW for the same logic), you belong in the HOF." No excuses otherwise- David Arquette? Sure, throw him in the celebrity wing. Vince Russo? If they ever induct backstage workers, sure. Chris Benoit? Well, it's a minefield no one wants to go into, but I prefer to go with the earlier said "well, all of the NWO are technically in" argument to sidestep that minefield by saying "well, they inducted the Four Horsemen, he was inducted in the backdoor that way and we don't have to worry anymore."
  5. I'd say the five tools in wrestling are: 1. In-ring ability. Goes without saying. 2. Look. Should go without saying- but it's a much more varied thing than just the traditional view of having the look seemed like there. 3. Physical charisma 4. Mic work. These two are basically separating the charisma factor into two pieces- because it's entirely possible to have one without the other (for example: Jeff Hardy is clearly charismatic, but he can't really cut a promo...and on the opposite side, someone can cut some funny lines on the mic, but they're not particularly charismatic in the ring.) 5. Connection. The other four tools are things that are obvious in a vacuum, but this is the one tool you can't know someone has until they get out to the ring and people actually see them. It's also possibly the most important one- over the last decade we've seen a number of people (Alberto Del Rio, Sheamus as two good examples) who seemed like they were five-tool players on paper, except in practice the fans just weren't buying what they were selling.
  6. Using the benefits of "would Trish have been better in this era?" and it's likely story, it leads to one of the possible hot takes to add to the 2020 mix as well: Hogan. Yes, Hogan's a little controversial now to say the least- and it's not just "WWE in the common era needs someone larger-than life who could be a crossover star", but even just workrate wise. We saw many, many times in wrestling that Hogan was the Uncle Miltie of pro wrestling- he'd pull out just enough to win. His workrate was always "do just enough to make the fans go home happy with his match", and a lot of the bad matches he had could be seen as "not Hogan's fault that for a long time, enough to make the fans go home happy was 'I was in the same room as Hulk Hogan!' His work in Japan or even his work in 2000 WCW or 2002 WWE (ESPECIALLY since those times were past his prime) make it pretty clear that in 2020 WWE where he wouldn't be able to coast on just being Hulk Hogan, he'd probably be very good in the ring.
  7. ...given how often they talked about how he was from the Colorado Rockies on commentary, just assumed that sometime in 1995, they traded him to the Dodgers. Given the nature- it could be better or worse than possible with timing. Molly would be VERY good in 2020 (she'd likely project as Bayley if Bayley could cut a promo), but Trish would look far worse in 2020 than she was (there's no doubt in my mind- Trish would end up the same as Alexa Bliss in this era, for every benefit and weakness.)
  8. Exactly. WWE shirts right now don't look like weak Ed Hardy ripoffs. They look like the weak non-licensed shirts you'd get at Walmart or Kohl's that badly want to be as snarky as the Spencer Gifts T-shirts, but still have to be clean enough so the mother of the 7 year old who wants it will let them wear it...just not at school or around the family.
  9. If this is the path for Shayna, why didn't they put Sheamus on Raw instead to ally with her? After all, he's incredibly strong and fast. His pale white skin sparkles in the light.
  10. If they HAVE to do a move from five to seven teams, can't they at least do the closest thing to a traditionalist way to do it: First and second place teams in each division, plus the best third-place team, make the playoffs. It's still a lot, but at least it seems to reward the top teams per division.
  11. The problem with that for a conglomerate's developmental promotion is that ultimately, it ties to the same point: If you don't use developmental, then you'd inevitably be going to a "bring in top stars from the independent scene as your newcomers", and ultimately it's down to that same issue: The vast majority of independent wrestlers just don't LOOK like stars. They just don't. And the ones who you could argue do look like stars? They don't look like enough of stars to be good on a conglomerate's taste. That would mean a move like UFC wouldn't work- if you use indies as developmental, they'd be hiring people who are very talented from the indie scene, but who just don't pass the eye test. It'd also be a problem because of the important tools a wrestler needs: you can teach someone how to wrestle if they can't work a lick. If someone isn't charismatic, it's going to be a harder road- but there's some cases where a wrestling promotion taught an uncharismatic worker how to be snarky and cut some good one-liners and make it look like they're charismatic. But with the look- you either got it or you don't. There's not that much you can do to give someone a great look, and even if you have a Jinder Mahal-type situation where a wrestler who didn't really have "the look" decides to kill themselves to change that, they'll end up looking like...uh, Jinder Mahal on steroids. Considering that "the look" would be a big core to making a star- especially by conglomerate standards, you'd NEED development to take people with the look and teach them to wrestle.
  12. Honestly, that is true, but it's not exactly the point I was making...and indeed, it helps the point I'm making a bit. My point is that a conglomerate owning WWE would be the same thing: A conglomerate with this much power would build by marketability, and indie stars wouldn't have the blind star power that would make a conglomerate take them. It's more like that we don't get an NXT-like system of "find the best indie talents and use their marketability to make stars", but rather the FCW-era developmental movement of "this person would look great on a poster, and it'd be easier to take them and teach them how to rudimentarily wrestle than it would be to take a great wrestler and teach them to be marketable on a poster." Heck, the move to IPs over actors as bankable draws makes it even more obvious- the stars are interchangeable, so you can run them for as long as you need and when they are failed experiments/ask for too much money/need to freshen things up, replace them with someone else.
  13. On the contrary to this (and for the people who think a bigger business will think based on the indie experience): We're not talking about some business buying WWE, we're talking in particular about an ENTERTAINMENT conglomerate buying WWE, and in all likeliness they're the only ones who would want WWE. With that in mind: How many major Hollywood blockbusters can you remember that were built around "this star is one of the best actors/actresses in local community theater for over two decades, and now finally, at long last, we're giving this unsung hero of the acting scene their chance to be the lead star in a summer blockbuster!" Hell, even lower it to 'this person was a great actor for a long time on Broadway and they're making their debut as the lead in this summer blockbuster"? The closest example you can think of is stand-up comics getting TV shows, and even then you'd have to be in the top echelon of stand-ups, and a TV show isn't as big a deal as a big summer movie. By comparison to that, how many major motion pictures can be built around "well, they don't really have much talent, and they're not really well known by any means...but LOOK AT THEM! Cast them in the major motion picture because they'll look good on the poster. If they can act, it's a plus. If not...eh, who cares?" That's how we'd get in this instance- it'd be far less likely a entertainment conglomerate says "wow, this person has 10 years of indie experience and is considered one of the best in the business. Let's hire them", and much more likely they go past "college football player with no wrestling experience" and into "this person has no relevant athletic experience to speak of, much less wrestling experience...but their Instagram account is amazing. Let's hire them and make a wrestler out of them." An indie wrestler would not be likely to get past the door in this world, and if they do, even if you have a Yes! Movement or a post-Pipebomb world for that star, where WWE currently goes "...don't care don't care don't care...aww fuck, you won't give up on this? Fine. We cave. You win. We'll give it to you", the entertainment conglomerate would invariably respond to that movement with "don't care don't care don't care OH MY GOD I DON'T CARE they have no star quality and it'll never change, we're going with this person as the star, DEAL WITH IT".
  14. Well, he DID get an injury this year, so technically the Madden Curse still hit him, even if he came back and went on to win Super Bowl MVP. Which makes it even more impressive- the Madden Curse hit him and he still managed to go all the way.
  15. Even with that, the nature of people hating people obviously pushed down our throats with no reason yet relates to the same point: Hating someone before we love them is also manufactured in that instance. It's not just about "just turn someone heel and the fans will love them as a face" isn't the point- because if the fans didn't start to like them anyway, they won't care about them more because they wear black tights and talk smack about the local sports team. This is the whole problem with the "but you can't turn Roman heel, the smarks will just cheer him!" argument- it's not that smarks would just cheer Roman if you turn him heel, but rather if you turn Roman heel, it won't make smarks care about him. The reaction won't be smarks cheering that you finally turned Roman heel so he can organically turn face, because Roman has been so manufactured that it is impossible for him to ever have an organic rise. A Roman heel turn would just be met with "Oh, BULLSHIT WWE! You're only turning Roman heel because you think that'll make us like him! Get it through your skulls, WWE- I WON'T like Roman Reigns, and YOU CAN'T MAKE ME!"
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