OCT WRESTLING DISCUSSION THREAD

[BrianS81177]

 

Well if you haven't read Jericho's new book yet, let's just say he makes it sound like your odds of seeing blood again are slim and none

 

Is this the Batista payed for everyone-story?

 

That's in there, yes, but there are other "vince won't allow blood" stories in it too

[thee Reverend Axl Future]

I really want to see a sequel (NOT a remake, you should never remake a cult classic), a sequel I say, to "They Live" starring Dean Ambrose. Aliens got exposed at the end of the first one, managed to re-manipulate themselves back into our culture, now a new outsider gets forced into the violent role of revolutionary savior, taking on the alien menace and all the new media. Obligatory cameo by Piper, of course.

please Vince and John,

RAF

[Sammo~!]

For a minute there, I truly thought "potatoes that cause swelling" was a framistan for something.

Manly stuffing instead of potatoes that cause swelling beyond my wildest expectations

[Big Fresh]

Random thought: the Internet may have never turned on Triple H if he always kept "My Time" as an entrance theme.

[Johnny Sorrow]

Random thought: the Internet may have never turned on Triple H if he always kept "My Time" as an entrance theme.

But Motörhead rules.

[Josh Mann]

Random thought: the Internet may have never turned on Triple H if he always kept "My Time" as an entrance theme.

But then we never would have had those precious YOUDAMAN points during WrestleMania.

I kid. First time I marked the fuck out, second time was comedy gold.

[Cobra Commander]

I really want to see a sequel (NOT a remake, you should never remake a cult classic), a sequel I say, to "They Live" starring Dean Ambrose. Aliens got exposed at the end of the first one, managed to re-manipulate themselves back into our culture, now a new outsider gets forced into the violent role of revolutionary savior, taking on the alien menace and all the new media. Obligatory cameo by Piper, of course.

please Vince and John,

RAF

the Aliens will morph kinda like in T2. That way, they can get Robert Patrick in as the villain.

 

Mark Henry will play Keith David's role.

[Brian Fowler]

Vince mostly exorcised blading from the company during the mid-80's, and it was definitely banned outright by the early 90's ("the Ric Flair get screamed at for blading against Savage story after Bret swore up and down the blood against Piper was hardway" story) but the company damn sure embraced it in the wake of Wrestlemania 13.

 

Hell, in his book Bret says they convinced (or at least "convinced") Vince that the blood in that match was hardway, and Austin was still maintaining that line when he did new commentary on the match with JR for the big Austin blu-ray from a few years back.

[BrianS81177]

 

I really want to see a sequel (NOT a remake, you should never remake a cult classic), a sequel I say, to "They Live" starring Dean Ambrose. Aliens got exposed at the end of the first one, managed to re-manipulate themselves back into our culture, now a new outsider gets forced into the violent role of revolutionary savior, taking on the alien menace and all the new media. Obligatory cameo by Piper, of course.

please Vince and John,

RAF

the Aliens will morph kinda like in T2. That way, they can get Robert Patrick in as the villain.

 

Mark Henry will play Keith David's role.

 

Only problem with this is nobody would buy the fight scene being 15 minutes long. 15 seconds maybe.

[Cobra Commander]

Might need a foot chase to draw out the fight scene a few minutes. Or Mark Henry flipping over cars to find where Ambrose is hiding.

So, the glory days for consistent WWE blood was 2002-2005? Guessing not much blood after Bob Orton almost(?) gave the Undertaker hep?

[Brian Fowler]

There was still blood up until around the time they switched to PG, iirc.

[mco543]

Ambrose is crazy enough to keep getting up from Henry's ass beatings to stretch the brawl to 15 minutes.

[GojiColin]

Ambrose is crazy enough to keep getting up from Henry's ass beatings to stretch the brawl to 15 minutes.

 

I could totally see that happening in an Ambrose/Rusev fued. 

[MoeCristyV.1.6]

 

Well if you haven't read Jericho's new book yet, let's just say he makes it sound like your odds of seeing blood again are slim and none

 

Vince has always hated blood in matches. I was amazed he let it happen for so long during the Attitude era and beyond.

 

In other news, Noble and Mercury now have a Twitter account.

 

 

The Vince who had the awfulest bladejob ever against Taker in a Buried Alive match? Guy was shooting blood out of his head. Just hard to watch.

[HumanChessgame]

I've been hoping Noble and Mercury as the nu-Stooges wouldn't just be a fleeting thing and it looks like they're going to go with it more long-term.

[greenbat]

Couple things.

When I was watching wrestling the big stooge was Sgt Slaughter. I never saw bomb wrestle as a kid but I knew who he was and he looked scary. When he was feuding was Dx they were cool matches and I dug it. Then Briscoe and Patterson came along. Had no clue who they were outside of "legends", they didn't look intimidating but it was fun seeing Austin stun them.

Basically what if we have a "face company owner" and gang of stooges to enforce the law rather then... heels that just fuck with the faces.

The whole idea of an evil heel owner makes no sense anyway. With Austin and Vince it made sense, it was new and fresh, Austin was a thorn in McMahon's side but sold shirts so Vince just wanted to get the title off of him and it escalated from there. With Bischoff he was leading a new wave of wrestlers that he thought would increase business and he had all these face management types like JJ Dillon in his way, holding down the business.

Why the fuck does Triple H not like John Cena? He sells shirts, earns his championships, never bashes the company, provides a perfect role model for the media, and yet he wants Randy Orton, a douchey underwear model who kicks people's patents in the head to hold the title? Or Lesnar, a guy who turned his back on the company and did a bunch of controversial stuff in mma who refuses to do any media? Why the fuck doesn't Triple H like John Cena!?!

I was thinking about the way Paul Heyman sells the Lesnar fights so incredibly well and basically I think, somehow, Paul Heyman would bea perfect Dana White style Raw general manager, playing hard nosed face, giving the fans the best show ever and holding talent accountable, with Fit Finlay and... oh I don't know, Norman Smiley as his gonna of justice.

(Honestly I'd put Tommy Dreamer in the second role but I'm sure everyone would just shit on that)

[cwoy2j]

Vince mostly exorcised blading from the company during the mid-80's, and it was definitely banned outright by the early 90's ("the Ric Flair get screamed at for blading against Savage story after Bret swore up and down the blood against Piper was hardway" story) but the company damn sure embraced it in the wake of Wrestlemania 13.

 

Hell, in his book Bret says they convinced (or at least "convinced") Vince that the blood in that match was hardway, and Austin was still maintaining that line when he did new commentary on the match with JR for the big Austin blu-ray from a few years back.

 

I have to think a lot of these "oh we convinced Vince it was hardway" stories are basically just the workers coming up with some half-assed story to give Vince plausible deniability. You'd have to be a complete moron to think that Austin's blood was hardway. I get that accidents happen in the ring but you can see the cut on Austin's head. That's not what it looks like if you bash your head into a guardrail by accident.

[ebbie]

I've never liked blood, blade jobs or whatever in matches. But pro wrestling seems to be the only events in which the people forget that there are actual people doing their own damn stunts and using their own body to get the emotion over.

Arnold getting a gash across the head? There's special effects for that. Some asshole wanting to be in a hero and half a crimson mask? Said asshole has to get cut himself.

How immoral.

[cwoy2j]

I've never liked blood, blade jobs or whatever in matches. But pro wrestling seems to be the only events in which the people forget that there are actual people doing their own damn stunts and using their own body to get the emotion over.

Arnold getting a gash across the head? There's special effects for that. Some asshole wanting to be in a hero and half a crimson mask? Said asshole has to get cut himself.

How immoral.

 

Care Lord

[Technico Support]

I can see where you're coming from.  Back when it was supposed to be real, blading was part of the con, a trick used to get the marks more into the match.  Now that only the mentally infirm and small children think this shit is real, taking a chunk of metal and carving your head is pretty fucking dumb.

[ebbie]

Even before there's some alleged reason for it, it's still fucking dumb. How many people watching would just cut themselves because it's part of the job?

There's medication for that.

[greenbat]

I can see where you're coming from. Back when it was supposed to be real, blading was part of the con, a trick used to get the marks more into the match. Now that only the mentally infirm and small children think this shit is real, taking a chunk of metal and carving your head is pretty fucking dumb.

That's what deathmatch wrestling is like for me now. We all know it's a con. We know all the spots are contrived. So when I sit here and watch these guys put needles through their cheeks or Takeda take that ridiculous over the top rope power bomb through glass onto the floor it's like... why? Your making a fraction of what other guys make for doing so much less. Wrestlers who do that stuff do it for themselves. There's a clip of Nick Gage going on about what he does is real, unlike that crap on Monday night, and we should respect him for it. Ian Rotten is the same way. He demands respect because he carves himself up and takes bumps to the floor but it's low, no one ever asked you to.

[Ryback Hates Bullies]

 

I've never liked blood, blade jobs or whatever in matches. But pro wrestling seems to be the only events in which the people forget that there are actual people doing their own damn stunts and using their own body to get the emotion over.

Arnold getting a gash across the head? There's special effects for that. Some asshole wanting to be in a hero and half a crimson mask? Said asshole has to get cut himself.

How immoral.

 

Care Lord

 

 

 

We don't talk like that here.

 

There's part of me that would like to see blood, but I understand the reasons why it's not a good idea and grudgingly agree.

[SorceressKnight]

The whole idea of an evil heel owner makes no sense anyway. With Austin and Vince it made sense, it was new and fresh, Austin was a thorn in McMahon's side but sold shirts so Vince just wanted to get the title off of him and it escalated from there. With Bischoff he was leading a new wave of wrestlers that he thought would increase business and he had all these face management types like JJ Dillon in his way, holding down the business.

Why the fuck does Triple H not like John Cena? He sells shirts, earns his championships, never bashes the company, provides a perfect role model for the media, and yet he wants Randy Orton, a douchey underwear model who kicks people's patents in the head to hold the title? Or Lesnar, a guy who turned his back on the company and did a bunch of controversial stuff in mma who refuses to do any media? Why the fuck doesn't Triple H like John Cena!?!

 

 

In theory, the reason for HHH to not like Cena comes from how the real Authority angle's weakness is it's not really "evil owner vs. heroic employee" as much as it seems to be "evil owners who have the power vs. THE FANS"- which the Authority don't exactly deny is the point of the whole thing. From there, that gives all the reason HHH would have to not like John Cena- the fans LIKE him, and so Triple H will hate him just so the fans don't get to be happy. It's no different than, on the opposite side, John Cena being good friends with and respecting Michael Cole for years, but the second fans hated Cole he's more than happy to turn on him, beat the crap out of him, and pour barbecue sauce all over him, just because the fans hate him and he'll turn his back on a friend for their applause.

 

...or maybe WWE has really poor writing and I'm overthinking it. Eh, whatever.

[The Nature Boy]

 

The whole idea of an evil heel owner makes no sense anyway. With Austin and Vince it made sense, it was new and fresh, Austin was a thorn in McMahon's side but sold shirts so Vince just wanted to get the title off of him and it escalated from there. With Bischoff he was leading a new wave of wrestlers that he thought would increase business and he had all these face management types like JJ Dillon in his way, holding down the business.

Why the fuck does Triple H not like John Cena? He sells shirts, earns his championships, never bashes the company, provides a perfect role model for the media, and yet he wants Randy Orton, a douchey underwear model who kicks people's patents in the head to hold the title? Or Lesnar, a guy who turned his back on the company and did a bunch of controversial stuff in mma who refuses to do any media? Why the fuck doesn't Triple H like John Cena!?!

 

 

In theory, the reason for HHH to not like Cena comes from how the real Authority angle's weakness is it's not really "evil owner vs. heroic employee" as much as it seems to be "evil owners who have the power vs. THE FANS"- which the Authority don't exactly deny is the point of the whole thing. From there, that gives all the reason HHH would have to not like John Cena- the fans LIKE him, and so Triple H will hate him just so the fans don't get to be happy. It's no different than, on the opposite side, John Cena being good friends with and respecting Michael Cole for years, but the second fans hated Cole he's more than happy to turn on him, beat the crap out of him, and pour barbecue sauce all over him, just because the fans hate him and he'll turn his back on a friend for their applause.

 

...or maybe WWE has really poor writing and I'm overthinking it. Eh, whatever.

 

 

I've think you've just nailed a problem in WWE babyface booking though. WWE babyfaces are douchebag narcissists who will do whatever it takes to get a pop. Dean Ambrose is the obvious exception of course.