Ryback Hates Bullies

I think the train of logic was to run UE against the Elite, but then Adam Cole got injured and the stuff with Punk happened etc. Agree it was a mistake bringing in Fish & O'Reilly - Strong is a great hand and obviously Adam Cole had something - the extent he has it now I'm less sure. Tbh one reason I think having weight classes is a great idea was that you could stick Cole in the two bottom divisions and get something useful out of him. I sort of hope Kyle O'Reilly gets MJF's ring and he becomes Champagne Kyle or something, tbh I doubt it'll work any better than Cool Kyle but it might be fun wrestlecrap.

I am reluctant to go back and relitigate this, but I literally mentioned Darby Allin vs Brody King, and had mentioned Darby Allin before that. Though, resisting the temptation to be snarky as much as I can, it's not like that last match exactly popped a rating now is it? 461K at the end I believe. Overall I understand the show was 300K down on same time last year. And look, they're being paid good money to do that match and it's better than them doing it in front of a few hundred people at PWG, and then a few thousand DVD viewers and a few thousand more bootleggers. I completely get that. So maybe the slow slide into oblivion is the better option. May well be.

That's great. I can respect that and would have engaged with that argument.

No it's you trying to make a sneaky argument that's annoying to unpick. Just say 'well actually I really want to see Jack Perry wrestle Luchasaurus'. My guess is that you won't because you don't. And I have pointed out that there are still a myriad ways you can have those matches. Admittedly if you think small man vs little man matches are the apex of pro wrestling, yes I can see how you wouldn't like my idea. I think a Kevin Nash is likely to have a better match with a smaller guy. But I don't think that's as true of the larger wrestlers today in all honesty. Styles do make matches I agree, but you're oversimplifying things. A lot. That in no way is the essence of what I'm positioning at all, and it's pointless to continue if all you can do is attack strawmen.

I actually profoundly disagree with the framing that having to vaguely operate within the bounds of realism and logic is artificially handcuffing yourself. And it's that kind of thinking that has got pro wres into all sorts of issues at certain times. AEW hasn't been much good at storytelling in some time. But even if they were, WWE exists and in a profoundly more competent way than 5 years ago. That isn't likely to change. They produce 2 A shows, & a B show that has developed into a quirkier show that usually outrates AEW even though they are working with a pretty inexperienced talent base. That's the reality. Why do people need a less interesting version of all that with more flips? You dun changed brah. Shawn Michaels and the Undertaker wrestled for WWE; you're not getting that match in AEW. This might seem like a really asinine point, but it's not because if you said 'A world with no Jack Perry vs Luchasaurus** matches is not a world I want to live in' people would think you were insane and that's kind of the point really. And you might say, 'ah but what about Darby Allin vs Brody King?'. But I've already articulated how you can still have those matches. The reality is though that AEW hasn't been all that good at booking for size discrepancies either, so why you advocate for centering around them I'm not really sure. In all honesty, if you're having to essentially pretend the Undertaker still exists and wrestles in AEW then you may want to re-examine things - because an argument like that is essentially doing that. 'Oh obviously I didn't mean that', will you stop?'....well don't say it then The truth is a 199lb guy against a 185lb guy is still a big man vs little man match. And so is 225 v 280. Strickland vs Lashley for the title could still happen. Garcia vs Lashley no. Good. People watch sports movies, including ones not based on true stories. You can use the actually devices of real sport in a creative and artistic way to tell a story in a way that doesn't easily happen within the messy confines of real life. I'm not saying you have to completely restrict yourself to that by any means, but I really don't agree with any of your framing. And as for people want real fights...sure some people do, other people want strong looking action that's more reliably interesting than the majority of MMA. I do believe, to an extent, in the 'Strength of the Job' (a phrase that William Regal uses a lot). In all seriousness, I have said that 'I can defend my pov to a point' - and I recognise the limitations here because someone with standard preconceived ideas of what wrestling is will very naturally struggle with what I am suggesting - trying to unpick all that would be very tedious, time-consuming & quite likely to be unpersuasive even if I presented a highly logical argument. So the temptation is to be slightly flippant/snarky but the point is that I basically disagree with all of your framing and I don't think they are helpful to the point at hand. Ultimately what I have said is " My slightly more abstract point is that AEW will likely need to change in some significant way in order to get the feeling back". I don't think essentially being a WWE clone is going to be the thing, and whatever vibe the Elite & their Indy friends brought 5 years ago has left the building and is not coming back. ** I realise Luchasaurus has not been doing so well healthwise, and I realise wrestlers do read this sometimes - so nothing against the guy and hope he does well and gets back to wrestling if he wants that.

Kingston & Xavier had no future on TV as singles wrestlers. They've split the tag belts, hell they've even got secondary women's titles on both shows - this is not a good time to be a midcard dude, especially with Wrestlemania season beginning. And (so)...practically everyone in the midcard is in some kind of group. Tbh I think they might be better on Smackdown feuding with the MCMGs anyway, but I'm sure that can happen soon enough.

A month ago I might have agreed with you. I should probably stop there. Well Tone does like him some lucha, and this pretty much backs up my point about weight classes. If AEW makes stars in the different divisions, they'll be good. A heavyweight title would actually be good for AEW's big guys, as tbh they've actually really struggled with booking them well (except maybe Joe). But equally there's guys at lower weights that would clearly benefit from the lower weight classes. There's people who might not so much, like Darby Allin, but there's nothing to stop him fighting catchweight bouts and being the exceptional small guy who can take the big guys (especially in gimmick matches)....so really it's all about execution.

1. Any reponse that doesn't even acknowledge McGregor, scumbag as he might be, can safely be pigeon-holed as not entirely in good faith 2. "Heavyweight, despite having the least amount of talent, is among the most" is a pretty classic retreat from the bailey to the motte. 3. I'm not really proposing AEW has a Flyweight division. I'm probably proposing the lowest weight class limit be 180. So I think the arguments about the lowest weight divisions in UFC aren't really applicable. 4. I said 'more or less'. Allow me to clarify (you can see this as a retreat if you want), I think in practice the 200 and certainly the 180 belts would likely be seen as slightly less important. This matters less in wrestling because one or both of the 200/220 belts are likely to be defended at any given PPV/PLE, but the key point is they should be presented seriously and not as stepping stones. 5. WoS-era BritWres would probably be the most obvious example of a precedent. Which is not really to deny that the Heavyweights were not an important spectacle, and a guy like Finlay bulked up so that he could be a top guy in Germany. But clearly some of the most iconic and well-loved stars came from other weight divisions - Johnny Saint, Les Kellett, Mick McManus, Jim Breaks et al. 6. It's a big change, & yes it would require commitment. My slightly more abstract point is that AEW will likely need to change in some significant way in order to get the feeling back. Feeling != Business, & I don't claim to have the access to data TK has or the time to use it. But I stand by my statement that there will be no new golden era if they keep doing what they have been doing. What they do exactly, well again others are probably better placed. I have my opinion, & can defend it to a point.

But anyway I would lean on the UFC paradigm. Basically you can set Light-Heavy at 220ish, Cruiserweight at 200ish, MIddleweight at 180ish. Two divisions for women.

I'm not claiming every belt in UFC is equal by any means, but I think you need to look at some match cards and some other stats around prize money and I think you'd probably want to walk that opinion back.

I think you can be both realistic whilst thinking that "AEW has long established it's strengths and weaknesses if you're pushing against either and expecting something they aren't" is a pretty fatalistic pov. Tbh I don't really see where particularly recently they have learnt from mistakes. I have seen them try to do things about mistakes they have made; I'm not entirely sure that's the same thing though. The thing is, you can't really tag me with the 'toxic crusader' line because I haven't really said anything at all; I had literally not posed about wrestling in a long time. And I don't want AEW to fail. The fact that so many people are getting a paycheque for wrestling is tremendous, as is the energy they have provided the competition. What I will say though is that whilst WWE in some sense may be forever, I don't think the paradigm that AEW rests upon is necessarily so and that I think AEW will not have another golden age under the current paradigm. We have seen companies come back before.....NJPW 2006ish, WWE in the 2020s (I know that is hardly the same thing because WWE was always making loads of cash, but still)......AEW can come back, but it will not be with what it was doing, and tbh I don't think the Death Riders are going to provide the reset needed to have that, though obviously I don't have a crystal ball and Tony Khan could well be smarter than me. Maybe they'll never have another golden age, and they'll just meander along giving people a chance to make a living from wrestling and I'll continue finding it less and less interesting - this is fine for me in all honesty though I think it will eventually shrink in size, probably when the Khans finally decide it's a distraction and sell it. I had suggested it for Ring of Honor, but now I really, genuinely think that the future (and I don't mean next week, next month or even necessarily next year) is weight classes. There's costs and benefits to such an approach, it is a paradigm shift, but I really think guys like Garcia and Yuta just make more sense when you have weight classes when you don't have to pretend they can likely beat Powerhouse Hobbs in a straight 1 on 1 match. Given Darbs his run, and then start to make the transition. AEW just has to be willing to treat the weight divisions as more or less equal and you're good. Some people might think the meandering mediocrity is the better option and I can respect that though.

Idk maybe this is me not hanging out on wrestling forums much this year, but who is really the complainer here? I think you may have to allow that people may take a less fatalistic view than you. Punk's comment about 'understanding of the business' was trolling to a point, but I think there's a truth to it. The Elite come from a different mindset of pro wrestling - what I call post-carny (Essentially the PWG mindset, though Fight Club Pro and Progress put their own spin on it in the UK). It's what made AEW charming and the biggest missed opportunity is not so much failing to scale that as not bothering to really try i.e. deciding to make CM Punk the face of the company over Hanger.

The point with Shelton is that, like with Christian, they are giving a guy a chance they never really got in WWE. That can easily look like 'bringing in WWE midcarder and having him/her eat your roster', but I thnk this case can more easily be made for Mercedes than for Shelton. Rumblings indicated Guerrera was offered a more prominent spot on AEW, but as a heel - he decided he didn't want that, so he's in the spot he's in, which is fine - he's one half of the ROH Tag Champs and out of the Jericho vortex. There's a lot wrong with AEW, & I may talk about that at some point. But the above ain't it.

Mox used the term 'land of opportunity', which I thought was a pretty clear reference to Shane McMahon.

Just a few notes n my recent training: For the last 6 weeks I have trained almost exclusively with my gf, sometimes I get in a bit earlier but not so much recently. There is a degree of compromise in turns of the workouts, but I generally try to make it stuff we both want to do. I *mostly* pick the exercises. Roughly speaking the breakdown has been: Tues - Chins & Dips until recently, though this has become more of a push + high-rep bicep day now. Weds - Hamstring & (Upper) Back. This was deadlifts & RDLs, then leg curls and barbell rows mostly. Some Quad work towards the end. Sat - General Upper Body. Recently this has meant close-grip Smith Machine 45 degree Incline & wide mag grip pulldowns as primaries. Top sets on each today sets of 8 for 88kg & 75kg respectively. Yes I actually walk into the gym with the mag grip handle. Sun - Quads & Rear Delts (Cable Reverse-Flyes mostly). Sounds like a funny combo, but it works. We have been doing Hyperextensions on this day too. The quad work is mostly high-rep & not too serious - we grind but it's more an athletic/mobility thing. I mean yeah we do leg extensions too but actually my gf wanted them in. The point is I suppose is that I've tried to slightly specialise on upper back, chest & to an extent delts. I think it has lead to a somewhat more aesthetic appearance in a t-shirt. There's a big bodybuilding show in town this weekend, and there were 2 female competitors in doing some pumping and in 1 case posing - she had the clear heels and everything. My gf was staring a lot.