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I don't think this will be helpful to anyone but it'll probably be helpful to me, so bear with me. I didn't think I had a lot to say but now I'm on the other side of the Rumble (and a lot of people watching it like... it was any other Rumble) and the scrum. Vince won. It's hard for me to even sum up just how much he won. When you look at what he wanted throughout his career, at the top of the list, it was respect from people outside the industry, and total and absolute control over the world he created. He probably didn't get the first half, though if you look at the TKO ribbon cutting ceremonies and how his peers on the board spoke of him, he kind of sort of did. When it came to the control though? Absolutely. If there was a turnover of audience, and especially an enhancement with younger people in 84-85, in 97-99, and then over the last few years, this last one is the most insidious because it had social media to support it. I can't even imagine the sort of rebellion that happened in 2014 now and that was just ten years ago. I can't imagine the current audience even thinking that whatever they were fed wasn't the absolute correct thing in the first place. It's so telling how quickly they realized they should be singing along to Cody's song or how they do the "It's Clobbering Time" better than anyone else. Stories in the WWE aren't about human issues, not really, or if they are, they're all through the lens of the mythos Vince has created. They're detached from real life. Everyone's not fighting for money and glory but instead for corporate recognition. They're all fighting to be employee of the month, basically, because that is the loftiest goal as seen by all the wrestlers and the fanbase as a whole. It is dystopian down to the language and terminology and branding. And it's all supported by almost bulletproof revenue streams that aren't affected by how good or bad the product is, including, of course, Saudi money. Here's where I'm at. When they stop calling the wrestlers Superstars, I'll start considering checking in on WWE programming again. Seems like a pretty good thematic line.

"I didn’t read the lawsuit" though. I. DIDN'T. READ. THE. LAWSUIT. Motherfucker, everybody interested in pro wrestling read that lawsuit or a breakdown of it. People NOT interested in wrestling whatsoever did, even if it was for their jobs. In this instance you are asking to get dragged.

I actually believe he didn't read it. And that's really the problem, isn't it?

Triple H had an AEW shot ready in the chamber, but didn’t have a boilerplate corporate statement ready for any Vince questions. Fucking lol.

I know AEW has their attendance issues, but I’ll take a smaller, passionate crowd over a huge one with the same handful of dorks in the front row every show reacting to nothing.

Somebody could write a book about how Vince’s own body dysmorphia has influenced generations of young men.

“I haven’t read the lawsuit” is a variation of when a Senator/House Rep. wants to duck giving their opinion on what was said/done/written/etc. by [not naming who]…”I haven’t watched the video”, “I haven’t read the interview”, “I haven’t seen the speech”. It’s bullshit then, and it was bullshit now. It happens often enough that just *one time* I’d like to see the reporter anticipate this avoidance strategy by immediately following up with, “no problem - here you go!” and handing them a printed copy of the lawsuit. “Summary is only a couple of pages - we’ll give you a few minutes for your thoughts on it.”

Monkey’s Paw: Billy Corgan announces that NWA will start doing post show scrums streaming live on Truth Social.

HHH - Handles Harassment Horribly please, no standing applause. We got not have so much time and let the other posters get an opportunity to post. Save your loud cheering and whooping for the end.

Boy calls me down to the basement. “Dad! Come see this!” Proceeds to unload some damn-near-perfect Kobashi/Kingston machine gun chops on the heavy bag.

*stops doing Hindu squats while hauling myself over the coals for having a McNugget meal last night* What do you mean?

“I haven’t read the lawsuit” was a wild thing to say. Really wish somebody would’ve followed up on that.

you think those fans they showed in the Slim Jim section pre-title match knew how close they came to not getting free Slim Jims tonight

No. He tries his moves out on me.

One of the things recent rumbles have brought into focus is how terrible and indistinguishable from one another most current WWE theme songs are. I felt like on at least half the men’s rumble entrances you didn’t even get the big countdown pop because nobody could tell who was coming out based on the music hitting. Just this delayed “oh yeah, that guy.”

I realize there’s only one Pat Patterson, but it’s shocking the degree to which they’ve completely forgotten what makes a Rumble good. This shit was so boring.

Did other people know? Sure. Absolutely. Are people probably projecting who they think it is for whatever reason (personal dislike of that person, a desire to completely clean the company top to bottom, an assumption based on available information, et cetera, et cetera)? Yes. And that's sort of the problem. People are trying to connect dots and letting their own personal biases get in the way rather than wait for facts and judging based on them.

Collision was definitely "My AEW." Hard hitting opening tag with a limb focus. Orange Cassidy match; not the best but still a lot of fun with percolating storylines underneath. Solid women's match to get May over even more; she's very active and in the moment all times with her crowd interaction. That just awesome stretch of the Kingston match, the wonderful Danielson match that you couldn't get anywhere else, Deeb's return, and then the wild six man cage match full of bells and whistles and family and hatred. Such a great show. Granted, it's AEW so I'm not looking forward to Dynamite much (Jericho vs Fletcher, Deonna vs Taya, Strickland vs RVD?, Page vs Toa).

There are times to be a "positive vibes only" kind of dude, and last night wasn't one of those times. Triple H has been pretty famously obtuse about his surroundings (the one that sticks out to me because it's relevant to my personal interests is him saying he didn't know "joshi" was a real word a few months ago), but he did himself no favors with that press conference. All he had to do was say "there are active investigations and I cannot comment". I doubt anything will come of it, but it is, how one might say, a bad look.

I want to give that crowd a shout out. Especially for being directly against the Rumble, they were loud and awesome. That’s how it’s done, Savanah

Triple H: " I haven’t read the lawsuit.” That's a problem. Those answers by Trips, ugh.

For as shitty as this was, all respect to Thurston, Alba, and Hawkins. People like to talk shit about wrestling journalism, sometimes for good cause, but they did their job.

Can you even imagine the things he’s managed not to read, see, hear over the years as they were happening in the next office, backstage, in the hotel. he’s just a doomed creature.

I expected Hunter to be vague, but I was surprised at how much lamer he handled it. Like he could've said "it's fluid we're still sorting things out, so I can't comment on specifics now." Instead he was like "guys this week was amazing."

Dude, read your username. You're not Chaotic Metal.

Should have kicked the FG.

Pretty much this. I think what people forget when they do a lot of the "what if the territories had survived" scenarios is that a lot of those territories were doomed anyway, and WWF hastened their demise. Take Black Saturday, for example. Georgia was buckling under the weight of trying to expand too quickly and the Briscoes wanted to get out anyway. If it wasn't going to be sold to Vince, it would have been sold to someone else. Watts? Watts crashes in 1986/1987 anyway; nothing stops the oil prices from falling and his territory from cratering. If anything, Turner's demand that someone run a studio show in Atlanta might spread Watts' territory out and buy him a little bit of time, but he still ends up going under if his home base is still the Mid-South area. Crockett probably crashes even faster than he did if he buys Georgia in 1984 instead of buying the slot from Vince, because then he tries to expand sooner than he did, and his staff wasn't capable of managing it. The question is really if Turner would be more willing to buy Crockett in, say, 1985/1986 rather than 1988. The AWA still dies because Verne Gagne's problem wasn't Vince, his problem was his refusal to change with the times. He had Hogan when Hogan was red hot and wouldn't put his belt on him because he wanted a cut of Hogan's Japan dates, which forced Hogan out. Then he got gift-wrapped Sgt. Slaughter, who was almost as hot as Hogan at the time, and squandered Slaughter. World Class still has the problem with the Von Erichs having their issues, and the territory becoming stale even if they do survive. If Turner somehow stays in the wrestling business and if the situation described by Mister TV doesn't kill most of the groups, then whoever lands on Turner and survives in the mid-1990s still likely gets cancelled in 2001 when Jamie Kellner restructures TBS and TNT's programming. People say it's WCW's financials that got them cancelled, but both channels got rebranded around the same time WCW got dropped. It was clear that the merged AOL Time Warner wanted to change their programming and WCW's financials were an easy out for them. It stands to reason that no matter how healthy WCW was, or whoever was in their spot, they don't survive 2001. This isn't to say that Vince was a genius or anything, but he was incredibly lucky and often in the right place at the right time. So assuming there's no WWF national expansion, eventually someone will end up trying (likely pushed by Turner as cable expands) and practically everyone ends up crashing due to their already extant problems.

Triple H claiming he hasn't even read the lawsuit might be the biggest lie he's ever told and that's saying something.

Jesus Christ, Mahomes is getting the full Tom Brady "your defense and the other team making huge mistakes won a game you were mediocre in, so we are going to verbally give you a hand job while all but ignoring everybody else" treatment.

Cody is, and always has been, corny as fuck. He’s exactly where he’s supposed to be in his career. Being the top guy in the underdog opposition promotion is not for him. He’s always at the ready to toss the salad of his corporate overlords.

I'd be okay with CZWFANS still existing.

Yeah I think someone else may have attempted to nationalize, but what Vince really did was create a relationship between wrestling and pop culture. It’s had its ups and downs but that relationship has meant everything to professional wrestling as a whole ever since .

Like cockroaches, the business will always survive on some level, even if it’s just at county fairs and fire halls.

Vince has been pro wrestling's #1 enemy since he found out what his dad did. His influence on the industry and the artform has done lasting damage to how wrestling is presented and accepted and could take years to correct if they even want to

Football managers too. Whenever an Arsenal player got a red or yellow card, or conceded a penalty, Arsene Wenger would always say he hadn’t seen it. Now if one of his players was the one being fouled, you bet your arse he would have seen it, and had a strong opinion on how the refs should do more to protect his players.

Serena Deeb bringing the FIRE! Love to see it, one of my all time favs. Great match and promo. Robyn Renegade's also been shining in all of her outings lately, so this all ruled. Opening tag was fun. Bryan/Nagata was as awesome as would be expected. Really enjoyed the main event. Thought all the story beats were really well executed and the escapes all made sense. Particularly dug Brody tackling Dax out the door. Loved Mark Briscoe not just disappearing but coming back around to be a major part of the finish. Star quality ending for Garcia. Great stuff.

I’m so screwed, guys

I thought it was a really fun show. I mean, it's the Royal Rumble? The Woman's Rumble was excellent. On top of all of the really big moments, I came away thinking that the woman's division can now fill a Rumble where the worst entrant is "not too bad." Even someone like Shotzi has an awesome entrance, presence and at least one good splash. The top end of the women's roster has been great for about a decade now. The lower end is now a really solid group of performers. I also came away really impressed with Becky Lynch. I know I'm not breaking anything new about her being a generational talent and performer. But she had so many awesome little moments sprinkled throughout this -- like when she was in awe watching Jade toss out Nia (the woman standing in Becky's way for years now) and her elimination. The way they're setting up Becky's Last Stand against Rhea has been fantastic -- where Becky has to see if she still has her mojo or if this new generation has passed her. The two of them together have some real "lightning in a bottle" energy where I can see us clamoring for that to be a WM main event. I'm also elated that Bayley won. It sorta blew my mind that she's never had a singles match at WM. Nobody deserves a big WM singles match more than her. I'm pretty sure Bayley has to be the GOAT WWE Woman's Wrestler now. I don't know if we even have a Woman's Rumble match without Bayley/Sasha tearing down the house at NXT. Those two showed not just women's wrestling as a serious entity but you could build a promotion around women's wrestling as your main feud. Bayley was the best babyface of her era. She's had so many great moments on the main roster. Her and Sasha carried the promotion during the pandemic and right after. She hits it out of the park even when she's taking a step back from the starring role. We're really lucky to have her. I'm also happy Cody won. I was not into Cody at all when he arrived. He's won me over. Great babyface who connects with the audience. It hit me watching the final two men end that this was somehow a perfect way to end a week in wrestling that literally changed everything. Cody started the first rival to have any legs in years and came back to win WWE. He beat CM Punk, a guy who made his name as a truth-teller and a black sheep and -- despite the many many many things that can be said about Punk -- has bitten the hand that feeds him a bunch of times. It was a great exclamation point to the chapter in the book.

Long day but caught Collision on a dvr type recording. Very good wrestling television show. The type of fun variety I like. OC vs Komander reminded me of a fun CHIKARA match. Technical lucha with fun gimmicks and shenanigans sprinkled in. Two women’s matches! Look at that. Tony comes through. Deebs is awesome. Glad she is back. Excited for her to mix it up in high profile matches. Kingston vs Mack was ugly delicious. Classic Eddie underdog but King Road Tributing his way through. I was worried about Willie for a second with him not backflip if and landing on his head, but they did a good job making it work because of the knee. Was very well played and made the match even better. Danielson is a prick and hates Eddie. Love it! Bryan Danielson vs Yuji Nagata I’m jotting down as a MOTYC. I absolutely adored this. Yuji still has it and was really getting me excited with his rising and lowering up and down the top rope. I will tell lil Octopus about this Danielson AEW run when he is older. Forgot to mention the opening tag. Good stuff. Cage Match was very fun. I liked the dynamic of starting outside of the cage, the swerve of thinking we’re getting Briscoe, and the actually getting a beat up Garcia. Who might I add sold wonderfully throughout the match. Daniel Garcia was a real highlight. I like the dynamics of teams where escaping can actually put your team in peril. The late part with Buddy climbing back up really made sense and added to it. I also don’t care as much for door usage, but it can be done well and I liked it here. You have to carry the momentum of the match and have everyone down or something. It worked even in the flawed way. The mist was cool. Loved the ending with a returning Mark. Good guys hug. They really feel like the Collision Crew. House of Black still look strong. In summation: Neat.

This should have been Big E

My only real thought is that Bron Breakker is a star the second he shows up on the main roster, he stood out in that match in a way literally none of the other 29 men did.

Double post but fucking seriously, between “let’s just stay positive” and doofus Cody talking about the 50k people they’re there to entertain, let’s put smiles on faces instead of turds on heads, god damn. If there was ever a time to be a fucking human being…a woman was raped and sex trafficked and these shills can’t get out of the “treat Vince like Kim Jong Il” and protect the glorious company mindset. Fuck these guys.

When he died it led to this memorable blue card joke from Norm: " The voice of Tony The Tiger died this past week. Reports say his last words were "Guys, I don't feel so GRRRRRRRRRRRRRREAT".

for those of you who missed that Lamar Jackson pass to himself, don't worry, it'll be in every highlight reel and promo package/commercial for the next 30-40 years

I don't think it's a defense of Vince so much as it is a statement of fact: Vince had a completeness of (business) vision and a series of advantages that no other promoter had and used those things to make pro wrestling, even if it was merely his limited vision of what that could be, a national concern. Then, he took it corporate as soon as he had the path to go public. Those are just facts.

I don't think Vince won, in the sense that he is in his own personal hell (and IDK if Rovert is in the know, but he's certainly making claims online that Vince is like Logan Roy at his last birthday party with none of the kids around, which I wouldn't be surprised to learn was true). He wanted to run his company and do what he wanted with no scrutiny until he was dead. He didn't get to do that. It's small consolation to us because he's rich and destroyed a lot of lives with no punishment, but to him, I'm sure it's hell. I think pro wrestling, like most things that can be commodified for profit, was always headed toward corporatization and ultimate enshittification and that Vince being the one to do it is ultimately meaningless in the scope of things; it doesn't count as a win for Vince, really, in that his vision was always capricious and would have ended up somewhere else had he lived forever and stayed in power. In fact, I think you only see this sort of corporate-branded show after they go public, so as usual, it's more about the corporation being death to creative flexibility and innovation than anything Vince may or may not have done w/r/t his creative vision of what a modern wrestling show is

I've heard that argument before and I personally don't particularly buy into it. If Vince hadn't consolidated wrestling into a national business somebody else would have, he was just more ruthless and opportunistic than others (and had one of the wealthier parts of the country as his base so he had a natural advantage). Between all the other territories and Ted Turner willing to spend money I think it would have survived in one form or another and maybe it wouldn't have become so cartoonish to boot

Really damn good Collision. Two camera shots I loved: 1. Komander's rope walk springboard dive, staying with it from the behind angle gave it a cool perspective. Similarly... 2. Brody and Dax tumbling off the cage back into the ring. Looked like they fell a goddamn mile from that angle, as opposed to the replay.

In the world of million dollar corporations, mealy-mouthed weakness like HHH displayed tonight will get you canned quicker than anything. Those people only respect strength. Dana White was caught on video slapping his wife, and he literally stood in front of the press and was like “I won’t be accepting any punishment for that,” and that is exactly how it went down.

This was a bit difficult as I was juggling between this, the Rumble, and commenting on the Discord, but fun to do. Shane Taylor Productions vs. Blackpool Combat Club! Good stuff, a hard-hitting sprint. I don't think the feud is over nor should it be. Does STP have a third member? If not they need to get somebody and we need some six-mans out of this. Let it get nasty. Kelly: "The llave submission style is relentless", meanwhile they are trading high spots all match long after the initial rolling. It's what you'd expect from a Komander/Orange match. At least Kingdom didn't have much of a purpose aside from being bases. Garcia has been Nancy Kerrigan-ed! He is covered in the red red krovvy! Oh my stars and garters! We get two women's matches tonight, which is fun to see one happen while the women's Rumble is on elsewhere. Lady Frost is great and is willing to lay down for Mariah May. Nice to see Tina Fey Serena Deeb "back from injury"/out of the doghouse. Her and the very solid Robyn Renegade, who has impressed in all the matches I've seen her in so far, worked some really complicated and fluid stuff, including a wiggle out of a hold into a prayer-hands position from Serena which should be called the Namaste. Crowd is HYPED for her being back, which is pretty cool. They're also hyped for Yuji Nagata! That is a welcome surprise. He looks a little slow at first but soon as he hears "Let's Go Yuji" following the "Let's Go Bryan" his ears perk up and he gets the red light fever. Yuji is underrated as one of the most facially expressive of all Japanese wrestlers, many go for stoicism but Blue Justice is out here pulling faces like crazy, he's a busted up old man and he is showing it in every pained grimace and show of strength. The King of the Mountain spot with Bryan headbutting him down the buckles over and over was so good. He would just not die and you feel it. The zombie armbar spot wasn't as good as I expected but besides that this was really, really fun. I guess they wouldn't let Eddie stare through the curtain so they put him at ringside instead, so Bryan can fuck with him by cutting off his music to start and flipping him off at the end. The Eddie-Willie match, meanwhile, is vicious. Eddie eats a powerbomb with his head bouncing like four inches off the mat; Willie gets popped with a line-drive-down-center-field backfist that nails him right in the neck. Ouch. The main was alright. Its internal logic is real weird, why are you gonna leave the ring and give your team a disadvantage, why not get the door open and toss someone out instead. This was just a bunch of bombs instead of a brawl with a guy wearing a fittingly Mid-South-esque "pressure bandage" (TM Bill Watts) that should have came off so he could leak all over the ring. But, they landed the finish pretty perfectly in a very crowd-pleasing fashion. This crowd btw was night-and-day to the one on Wednesday. Meanwhile at the Rumble people are sitting on their hands.