WrestleDream - 10/1/2023

[username]

I think Edge signing in AEW makes the most sense for literally everyone (well maybe not his health if he actually is working fulltime but we'll cross that bridge later), he gets to knock out some matches he always wanted, AEW gets someone with some name value a couple months after losing Punk, and he really ran out of stuff to do in WWE and at this point they are better off putting effort into people who aren't him.

That said I feel a lot of people here don't really watch WWE a lot so let me just leave this here for your own good: expect him to be uneven. He got a lot of freedom in WWE and seemingly his pick of opponents/people to work with and the results were all over the place. Fortunately as backwards as this seems for a 49 year old he's more likely to deliver in the ring than on the mic (if I never hear that man use the word grit again it'll be too soon, and don't even get me started on his version of Judgement Day).

[Go2Sleep]

A full time AEW workload is like one match every 2-3 weeks, Copeland's gonna be fine.

I thought the show was the standard AEW ppv, so mostly good if you like what they do.

Barnett/Claudio stood out on the pre-show because they did a lot more of a shoot style match. Really unique stuff that stood out in a good way without overshadowing anything else.

The Righteous still come out to dead silence after being pushed for a month, so it definitely wasn't the worst team for comedy MJF to go over WWE-style. It wasn't so much a burial as it was two sacrificial lambs to build up MJF's face cred. It served its purpose and hopefully we can go without the Righteous on every show for a while now.

Julia/Stat was an example of a quick build that helped everyone. Julia finally stands out as contributing member to HOB and gets a much-deserved PPV showcase for her improved skills. Stat gets a more significant win than just random open challengers. Good work all around.

Not excited about the Bucks winning the 4-way, they're kind of testing their boundaries on over-exposure again.

Swerve/Hangman was really good with both guys adapting for the crowd. They both got to show their vicious side. The hand work made for some logical cutoffs and Swerve's arm-injury move looks like a real equalizer. Swerve will still be a heel everywhere else, but it was nice for him to get a big moment.

Danielson/ZSJ lived up to the hype.

Everything not listed to this point was just kind of there.

I feel like Aussie Open doesn't have that AEW-level top gear. They didn't bring anything new to their biggest match except a move where Mark Davis probably broke his arm. Kinda disappointing showing from them here to be honest.

I liked the choice of Darby/Christian as the main. Despite the initial botch, those stair bumps were exactly the type of insane shit you'd expect from main event Darby. Frankly, it didn't look like Christian was entirely comfortable with the idea and I don't blame him. Really hot match down the stretch and the Nick Wayne turn makes sense and got great heat. Copeland debut was a cool moment and I'm glad Tony sprung for the Alter Bridge theme. It did seem a bit rushed, like it would've probably been better to let the Wayne turn sink in for at least a couple weeks before bringing Copeland in to even the odds, but I understand the need to sell PPVs by only putting the biggest moments on them. Like most, I wasn't thrilled with Copeland's WWE work the last few years, but he still seems like he has some gas in the tank, so I'm ready to give him a chance in a fresh setting.

[John from Cincinnati]

6 hours ago, S.K.o.S. said:

The "Early life" section of Edge's Wikipedia article says: "He has said to have never met his father, or even seen a picture of him".

If you never knew your father, you'll never know whether he's dead.

Close enough, do your thing Christian.

[username]

1 hour ago, Go2Sleep said:

I liked the choice of Darby/Christian as the main. Despite the initial botch, those stair bumps were exactly the type of insane shit you'd expect from main event Darby. Frankly, it didn't look like Christian was entirely comfortable with the idea and I don't blame him.

Yeah it felt like Christian didn't feel he could pull it off (he seemed to half lose him before slamming him onto the stairs so he was probably right) and it appears like it may have been the thing to possibly legit injure Darby so it was pretty clear the wrong idea to go back to it... but Darby has dodged death so consistently that I can understand why everyone involved went the way they did.

[southofheavy]

Tying a couple of other posts together without quoting, Battlarts Claudio needs to be more of a thing, and frankly, Battlarts Darby should be, too. Bryan and ZSJ showed that matwork and grappling based matches can get over like crazy. They are definitely the two best in the world at it, but Claudio and Darby are no slouches, either. 

As Darby is one of the best in the company at wrestling how they should behave, it would enable him to calm down on the bumps and sell the matwork like death. Yeah, it's murder on the joints, but it's trading in murder on the neck and spine. 

Also, good call on those noting Julia Hart's growth. She has really come along in the last year and is so young still. The sky is the limit. Honestly, I'd like to see more of her and Brody on their own away from Malakai and Buddy, or at the very least, more spotlight put on them within the House of Black. A Brody main event or International title run with him destroying the holy hell out of everyone and Julia cutting promos for the two of them would do wonders for the both of them, I think. 

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by southofheavy

[zendragon]

@Thenatural in here rating DB matches like Homer Simpsons rating donuts

[Zakk_Sabbath]

Life got in the way post-Grand Slam (yay for corporate mergers) but do not mistake my silence for displeasure - I got a little wrestled-out this weekend because we missed TV all last week, so Saturday was a 5 hour marathon of Dynamite/Rampage/Collision (plus I found a random MLW Fusion from the ECW Arena airing on my way to bed, apparently BeIn Sports is part of my YTTV package now, and I just couldn't turn down the nostalgia of seeing that building on an obscure station in the wee hours of a Saturday night/Sunday morning). Long story short, I didn't get to watch WD until last night. Phenomenal show! The PPV hot streak continues. I'm very pro-Edge - I think he's just the kind of vet this dressing room needs (I'll leave it at that while I sip this Pepsi). Everything @NoFistsJustFlipssaid yesterday is spot on w/r/t growing the AEW 'brand' (I feel a little gross typing that, but it's important).

[Steventon]

7 hours ago, southofheavy said:

Tying a couple of other posts together without quoting, Battlarts Claudio needs to be more of a thing, and frankly, Battlarts Darby should be, too. Bryan and ZSJ showed that matwork and grappling based matches can get over like crazy. They are definitely the two best in the world at it, but Claudio and Darby are no slouches, either. 

As Darby is one of the best in the company at wrestling how they should behave, it would enable him to calm down on the bumps and sell the matwork like death. Yeah, it's murder on the joints, but it's trading in murder on the neck and spine. 

Also, good call on those noting Julia Hart's growth. She has really come along in the last year and is so young still. The sky is the limit. Honestly, I'd like to see more of her and Brody on their own away from Malakai and Buddy, or at the very least, more spotlight put on them within the House of Black. A Brody main event or International title run with him destroying the holy hell out of everyone and Julia cutting promos for the two of them would do wonders for the both of them, I think. 

 

There was a Zack vs Darby match in EVOLVE at one point which was excellent. Darby took like zero bumps but got twisted and tortured in all sorts of ways on the mat. I'd love to see more of that from him some time.

[Technico Support]

Finally catching up on Zero Hour and -- I know it's beating a dead horse now -- but JR is awful.

Athena enters the ring and JR says something to the effect of "I'd like to see Athena put together a hot streak and do something.  She has all the physical tools, but......" 

HOLY FUCK.  She is the ROH women's champion and has been dominating the division since last December.  I'm listening to old Deadlock pods and Ross says this exact line about someone else during a Dynamite episode (I really wish I could remember who) and it drove the guys on the pod crazy with how dumb it was.  Ross clearly has no interest in learning anything about the wrestlers or storylines, and just digs into his bag of sports analyst cliches whenever he needs something.  You could replace him with AI or an impersonator reading Madlibs and nobody could tell the difference.

Saying nothing about the discomfort of hearing an old white southern sports announcer putting over a black athlete's physical tools while putting down everything else about them, reminding me of how football announcers talk about black QBs vs white QBs.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Technico Support

[Zakk_Sabbath]

@Technico SupportI didn't catch Zero Hour but that's roooough. He's like one 'so articulate' away from filling the bingo card

[(BP)]

The commentary on Zero Hour was part of what convinced me not to order the show. I want every announcer in the company besides Ex, Taz, and Schiavone to fall off the face of the Earth. 

[Zimbra]

Gonked gourd Mox was a real treat on commentary.  I wish Elevation was still around so we could get a few weeks of Mox/Daddy Magic commentary while recovers.

[Just Dave]

@technico support I thought that about JR too. Was waiting for the "quick twitch" euphemism...

[Zakk_Sabbath]

1 hour ago, (BP) said:

The commentary on Zero Hour was part of what convinced me not to order the show. I want every announcer in the company besides Ex, Taz, and Schiavone to fall off the face of the Earth. 

Those three are definitely the 'A' team, but I REALLY enjoyed the 2 weeks of Collision where we got the Ian/Caprice/Nigel booth. Overall, I quite enjoy the rotating third man on PPVs - it reminds me of the period of WCW where they would swap Larry Z for Bobby Heenan in the second hour of Nitro

Edited October 3, 2023 by Zakk_Sabbath

[jaedmc]

Watched the show. I got choked up when the Metalingus hit.

I don't know exactly why, but Edge is just someone I root for no matter what. Remember when they did the original brand split and they took it really seriously? I also took it seriously and was hardcore Team Smackdown. I looked at the show as the place where the guys WWE didn't really care about got to be themselves and grow. Like the whole Smackdown Six period, and later when it was the La Familia era with Vicki. I still remember going to my friends house to watch RAW(I never had cable) just because I heard this new guy named Edge was going to debut and I wanted to see it. And every time he's made a come back or cashed in MiTB - that fucking music hits and I get hyped. 

And I think there's just something beautiful about the idea that he's been pretty much a WWE lifer and as he looks at the possible end of his career - he chose to go be where his best friend is. That's the most AEW shit ever.

So yeah. I'm happy. I'm excited to see what story they tell with him and Christian. I want to see how they fight and I want to eventually see how they reconcile, because I think deep down everyone eventually wants this to end with E&C back together(against FTR!).

 

Rest of the show thoughts....

Julia Hart is good. I love those moments where she got to display her character quirks in the ring. I don't know what to do about Statlander and how to connect her to an audience. Do people not like her? She used to be a quirky misfit alien, but now she's a power house kinda worker? I don't watch enough to know, but that's kind of the problem. Over the course of the match I learned what Julia Hart was, and I didn't feel the same with with Kris, who I've enjoyed in the past.

Bryan Danielson and Zack Sabre was fucking awesome. Jim Ross was lost. I mean really lost. I've defended Ross in the past, particularly in the early days in the company. But he was wildly disconnected in the match. And any time he'd interject, it felt like he was pulling any random old saying he's used in the past out of a bag. Hearing Moxley trying to work around him was tough too.

Excalibur, Tony Schiavonne, Taz, and Nigel - are pretty much the only people who should be in the booth.

Swerve Strickland is magnetic. There's just something terribly cool about that guy. His promos have been spotty for me during this feud. He does this thing that so many wrestlers do, where they kind of half chuckle mid sentence, while they figure out what the hell it is they're trying to say.  It's no good.

But the guy looks like a fucking star, and he's good at using his agility to do heel behavior. Like when he often does a dive or flippy move, I usually think "that guy is an asshole" instead of "that was pretty."

Fun show.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

1 hour ago, jaedmc said:

he's good at using his agility to do heel behavior. Like when he often does a dive or flippy move, I usually think "that guy is an asshole" instead of "that was pretty."

Great call (and I'd say that theory also extends to his setup and finish) - it's the exact thing that frustrates me a little bit sometimes about watching folks like PAC (or when I still watched WWE, Seth Rollins).

Edit: YMMV on this, but I'd posit that the Bucks are pretty good in this area too

Edited October 3, 2023 by Zakk_Sabbath

[Brandon Bones]

Speaking of getting choked up a bit.  I got the fucking FEELZ when Nick hit Darby.  
 

That degree of starvation applied to a young man who would sacrifice ANYTHING for an authentic fatherlike experience is insanely relatable. 
 

I’m the same age as Christian Cage.  But I’m pretty sure he could talk me into it too.  

Edited October 3, 2023 by Brandon Bones
Who I gotta stab?

[Dog]

4 hours ago, (BP) said:

The commentary on Zero Hour was part of what convinced me not to order the show. I want every announcer in the company besides Ex, Taz, and Schiavone to fall off the face of the Earth. 

Not metioning Nigel has angered Saraya. She wants you to have this.

Spoiler

 

4 hours ago, Just Dave said:

@technico support I thought that about JR too. Was waiting for the "quick twitch" euphemism...

 It's actually "fast twitch." Please pick from the same bag as BP.

Spoiler

 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Dog

[NoFistsJustFlips]

Do no like this L gimmick thing, please revert to the lovable canine I always pictured you as

[(BP)]

The spate of normal posters repackaging themselves is freaking me out. This is what it must feel like to live in Gotham City and open up the paper every week to see a new member of the Rogues’ Gallery debut. 

[Brandon Bones]

I really like Caprice though.  I kinda wish he were more in the rotation.

[tbarrie]

1 hour ago, (BP) said:

The spate of normal posters repackaging themselves is freaking me out.

Wait, there are normal posters here?

[Leonidas]

Ex / Tazz / Nigel would be my favourite combo with Tony / Mox / Menard / Jericho coming in to do bits too. Can see why they spread the work load out over Dynamite/Collison fair enough, but for PPVs we could get this.

[Dolfan in NYC]

2 hours ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Do no like this L gimmick thing, please revert to the lovable canine I always pictured you as

Heel turns happen.  He's gotta move up the card sooner or later.

[Dog]

Some posters seek out gimmicks, others have gimmicks thrust upon them. Blame that SmUgly guy.

Edited October 4, 2023 by Dog