Dynamite - 7/27/2022

[Shartnado]

2 minutes ago, Log said:

Were any of Jericho's wins clean?

No. Every single one had a shitload of interefence during them, but I guess matches ended with the Judas Effect (some of them at least), so "clean" in that sense.

[DEAN]

THURSDAY REFLECTIONS II:  It's seems to be streaming normal again.  Miyu Yamashita on my TV screen reminds me when I was convinced that WCW was starting to book DIRECTLY to me by bringing in Meiko Satomura and Sonoko Kato from GAEA completely out of the blue.  I understand that there are true Joshi nerds in charge of AEW so it's not a surprise, but I really dig it nonetheless.  I like that these Joshi gals work a non-Joshi style to get over in America.  I guess the main difference is that Joshi has a million moves per match that kind of build up to a finish but there are like five moves to every one move in an American match.  Tokyo Joshi Pro is closer to American style than Stardom or Sendai Girls, because they have more story based matches instead of Stardom's crazy athletic contests- which would get over in the US eventually, I guess.  I like that Thunder Rosa and Yamashita's match fit right in to the flow of the whole episode, as opposed to being a total culture shock that Utami Hayashishita vs Saya Kamitani would be.  It was pretty similar to their Japanese match except they built up to Yamashita's Skull Kick.  I like that Thunder Rosa sets her finisher by landing two kicks to Yamashita's head.  Thunder Rosa isn't a wrestling machine but she is OVER and the fact she can have a good match with a wrestler from such a foreign style to US Pro Style is a good thing to have in your champion.  I mean, imagine how good this match would have been between Yamashita and Toni Storm or Jamie Hayter, but still.  I'll take it.  I forgot how great Danielson's kicks are.  They are great!  I was there live when Shawn Michaels and Owen did the first thing like this. The concussion selling is like the Dustin Rhodes heart attack thing he does now.   I dig how it slows his rampaging monstrous unbeatableness.  I don't think he'll revisit it but it was a good story and allowed Daniel Garcia to go over.  Jesus, Garcia takes an ass beating.  He earned that win. I love that they used Remsberg arguing with Garcia about Danielson's condition to allow Danielson to blade.  Garcia reminds me of Baron Von Raschke's body language arguing with the ref.  These little things make Daniel Garcia a great wrestler.  I love that Danielson works from underneath and the crowd is totally behind his babyface comebacks while Garcia is such a great complete asshole heel who is relentless attacking the injured Danielson.   Danielson is really fucking great wrestling as a fiery babyface who is doomed.  So many great comebacks.  So many GREAT nearfalls.  Such a great psychological performance.  Just a great fucking match.  JR is actually good in this match getting over the story as much as Jericho, Excaliber and Taz does.  That was fucking great.

[zendragon]

18 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

 

As much as I'd like Danhausen to get to actually wrestle as he's perfectly capable, I get why they booked this sequence the way they did. Is Starks supposed to be the face in all this? They did try and make him somewhat sympathetic with the post match promo and beatdown, but Starks is such a natural douchebag heel it's hard to take him seriously as a face.

 

Rickys been getting face pops for a while now. A turn was pretty much inevitable 

Wish we could get Dante teamed up with someone who can at least get wins on the youtube shows

[DEAN]

36 minutes ago, Log said:

Were any of Jericho's wins clean?

They were death matches.  There are is no DQ so ALL of them were clean.

[eikerir]

Finished the show and that’s one of the best paced Dynamites I’ve seen in a long time, nothing felt rushed, things got to breathe and a shitload of stuff still happened. One of the best and most “fresh” feeling episodes they done in a while.

 

I loved how much young talent was highlighted today bookended between the big stars in the opener and main. The future is in good hands.
 

I loved the whole Ricky Starks saga tonight, sometimes it’s nice to move things quickly like this, not everything has to be a months long build up. It was exciting, everyone involved was super over and the crowd loved every second from Danhausen’s music hitting to the Hobbs turn.

 

Btw when the hell did Dante Martin get so much personality? I still remember him looking like my bored 15 years old brother less than a year ago. He feels like such a much more complete character now. 

I’ll riot if the Best Friends are not the inaugural Trios Champs.

Edited July 28, 2022 by eikerir

[zendragon]

1 hour ago, BrianS81177 said:

Yeah JR was definitely past nap time as the show went on. At one point didn't he start rambling about Dunkin Donuts or something?

Hearing Caprice Coleman on the youtube shows has really exposed how tired JR sounds...and I give JR a lot more rope than mot people

[zendragon]

[Zimbra]

2 hours ago, BrianS81177 said:

Yeah JR was definitely past nap time as the show went on. At one point didn't he start rambling about Dunkin Donuts or something?

Hey, can we talk about how he randomly blurted out "pronoun boy" during the first match, followed by several seconds of awkward silence from the announcers?  Because what the hell was that?

[zendragon]

4 hours ago, StuntmanCrowley said:

I'm probably overstating it because I feel it was a MASSIVE mistake to have Kingston lose to Jericho in the barbed wire match, and like you said, Hager has dropped falls, but I can't put my finger on it, it seems that outside of Blood and Guts, they've dominated in the W/L department.

Given the way things ended on Dynamite we still have unfinished business between JAS and Kingston's army. I feel we get the two leaders in a cage at Grand Slam

[Guest Stefanie Without Stefanie]

16 minutes ago, Zimbra said:

Hey, can we talk about how he randomly blurted out "pronoun boy" during the first match, followed by several seconds of awkward silence from the announcers?  Because what the hell was that?

It was weird, that's what it was.

Though I will say, the fact that he didn't even make an attempt to pronounce "Miyu Yamashita" and stuck with calling her "that young lady" and "the challenger" was a nice unspoken admission that he just doesn't give a heck about learning Japanese names, especially since he struggled for months with a relatively easy one like "Hikaru Shida".

[Matt D]

24 minutes ago, Zimbra said:

Hey, can we talk about how he randomly blurted out "pronoun boy" during the first match, followed by several seconds of awkward silence from the announcers?  Because what the hell was that?

I assumed that was a knock on WWE announcers not being able to use pronouns and he was having a flashback of being yelled at but who the hell knows. 

To me, the craziest announcing moment of the night was when he was shitting on back rakes and Taz tried to cover by invoking Ronnie Garvin and he doubled down. 

He’s the pits.

Edited July 28, 2022 by Matt D

[zendragon]

[Jenalysis]

35 minutes ago, Stefanie the Human said:

It was weird, that's what it was.

Though I will say, the fact that he didn't even make an attempt to pronounce "Miyu Yamashita" and stuck with calling her "that young lady" and "the challenger" was a nice unspoken admission that he just doesn't give a heck about learning Japanese names, especially since he struggled for months with a relatively easy one like "Hikaru Shida".

 

I watch Dynamite in a vtuber discord with a lot of LGBT presence, and they were trying to figure out what JR was smoking with that.

I'm at the point where I just want JR gone.   He's not Kevin Dunn bad, but he adds almost nothing to the show and isn't worth the money.

 

Edited July 28, 2022 by Jenalysis

[Craig H]

JR has repeatedly made digs at pronouns before to mock Vince railing against not using pronouns. This was just another instance of that. I’m surprised you all haven’t heard him say that before. That’s why I think he would never go back to work for Vince because he’s always making that dig at him.

[BrianS81177]

1 hour ago, Zimbra said:

Hey, can we talk about how he randomly blurted out "pronoun boy" during the first match, followed by several seconds of awkward silence from the announcers?  Because what the hell was that?

I missed that (had a couple fans going when the show started trying to keep from roasting to death in this heat wave). Yeah, it's time to find JR something else to do. Especially when he's taking time away from Taz and Caprice Coleman both of whom are much better at this point than he is.

[Matt D]

3 hours ago, Matt D said:

I assumed that was a knock on WWE announcers not being able to use pronouns and he was having a flashback of being yelled at but who the hell knows. 

To me, the craziest announcing moment of the night was when he was shitting on back rakes and Taz tried to cover by invoking Ronnie Garvin and he doubled down. 

He’s the pits.

Fuck it, I want to double down because it makes me pretty angry. In pro wrestling anything can work and anything can be effective. It takes 3-4 things.

1. Conviction from the person delivering the offense: they have to believe in what they're doing and project that belief, embody it.
2. Reaction from the person taking the offense: this is selling; the person has to show that it has an effect upon them through their physical reactions.
3. The announcers putting it over: it was done with conviction, it was sold with conviction; just explain and express that it worked and come up with reasons how and why and put it in context.
4. Consistency over time: if these three above things all happen and they happen repeatedly, the fans become conditioned to accept what they're seeing.

JR crapping on something that was done with conviction and is being sold not only means he's failing at what he's doing, but he's actively betraying not just the wrestler doing the move, but the wrestler that dared to sell it. It means that any other time that wrestler sells anything, it's put to doubt. It means that any other time the initial wrestler does any offense, it's put to doubt. The only one who potentially gets any credibility out of it is JR himself, who comes off like a maverick who calls things fake even when the wrestlers aren't brave enough to avoid doing them or to avoid selling it or the fans in the audience aren't brave enough to avoid reacting to it. Only JR is above all of them.

He has to go. He 100% has to go. What an absolute liability. What a horrible announcer. A bad announcer who fails to do his job and get something over is one thing. A terrible, wretched, counter-productive announcer who actively sabotages the product is something else entirely.

Edited July 29, 2022 by Matt D

[BrianS81177]

1 minute ago, Craig H said:

JR has repeatedly made digs at pronouns before to mock Vince railing against not using pronouns. This was just another instance of that. I’m surprised you all haven’t heard him say that before. That’s why I think he would never go back to work for Vince because he’s always making that dig at him.

My gut instinct was to say that JR would go running back the first time Vince called his name but the more I think about it, you're right. I think Tony Khan treats JR with a sense of awe and reverence because he's the voice TK grew up listening to, and I'm sure after years of Vince shitting on him every chance he got JR probably likes someone treating him like he's a big deal.

[BrianS81177]

So... trios. I think anyone with a brain can see it's leading to Cole/Redragon vs Bucks and either Hangman or Omega in the finals. How many other already set trios/stables are there? Gunn Club obviously. Death Triangle if they get Pac back over here. House of Black would be a gimme, but Matthews is hurt (unless they put in Miro or have Black corrupt somoene else). Dark Order. The Factory. Nightmare family. Andrade and his hired goons. Am I missing any? I'm not talking about obvious pairings (like Sting/Darby/Hardy) but established factions.

[Jiji]

How Khan handles Jim Ross, at his nadir, while Ross is detracting from matches seems similar to how managers in sawkur or other sports deal with fading stars whose skills aren't there and yet they still demand playing time and focus that they've grown accustomed to. Can Khan make a tough call and remove Ross from his position? With Ross back on the full two hours of Dynamite, it doesn't appear to be the case but I hope I'm wrong. 

AEW has an absurd abundance of riches. It's incredible that they can add a guy like Rush to the fold and he's probably going to end up as a guy for long stretches. Guy looks and carries himself like a superstar, has fun matches, can work various styles within one match, his English is coming along, and his promos in Spanish are incredible. Looking at their roster page, there are at least 22 men that could easily be bumped up to the world title scene as very credible challengers with a couple of weeks worth of investment. That's not counting guys like FTR, who are mostly tag wrestlers. 

If they were to move on from this tepid Rosa title run, who do they go to next? I, of course, would suggest Hayter but she's not been put in the position for that to work as of yet. With only one real competitive women's match a week and a roster that is still largely developing, it's tough to see where it goes next other than Toni Storm, and she's not an interesting character and will likely struggle in a similar way that Rosa has. Khan has to do better here.

Highs and lows.

[Jiji]

7 minutes ago, BrianS81177 said:

So... trios. I think anyone with a brain can see it's leading to Cole/Redragon vs Bucks and either Hangman or Omega in the finals. How many other already set trios/stables are there? Gunn Club obviously. Death Triangle if they get Pac back over here. House of Black would be a gimme, but Matthews is hurt (unless they put in Miro or have Black corrupt somoene else). Dark Order. The Factory. Nightmare family. Andrade and his hired goons. Am I missing any? I'm not talking about obvious pairings (like Sting/Darby/Hardy) but established factions.

Sting, Darby, and Miro vs. House of Black is the kind of interweaving of storyline and tournament that Khan likes to do the past year. There are some other obvious ones: JAS combination, BCC, Satnam/Sonjay/Lethal. It does seem like there are fewer options than last summer. 

If Punk is talking about his foot feeling like it's on fire and being in pain after doing comic con, All Out seems like a really quick turnaround. If not Punk, who does Moxley defend against that will be a viable threat and worthy of headlining a PPV? 

[Guest Stefanie Without Stefanie]

8 minutes ago, Jiji said:

If they were to move on from this tepid Rosa title run, who do they go to next? I, of course, would suggest Hayter but she's not been put in the position for that to work as of yet. With only one real competitive women's match a week and a roster that is still largely developing, it's tough to see where it goes next other than Toni Storm, and she's not an interesting character and will likely struggle in a similar way that Rosa has. Khan has to do better here.

Highs and lows.

Kris Statlander. Let her yeet people around like the weirdly dorky powerhouse she is meant to be.

[porksweats]

6 minutes ago, Stefanie the Human said:

Kris Statlander. Let her yeet people around like the weirdly dorky powerhouse she is meant to be.

That's definitely the way it should be going, the last Stat/Athena promo had Stat specifically say they were going for the AEW Women's while Athena the TBS

[JLowe]

20 hours ago, Dog said:

As soon as Dragon started selling the concussion, I knew Garcia was winning. You knoattn:w Dragon's been BEGGING Tony to let him lose a high profile singles match.

Attn: Jonathan Gresham

[Casey]

All I really want are two role reversals and title switch. Make Toni Storm a heel, give her the title, let Jamie Hayter turn on Britt Baker (Britt is getting face pops like Ricky Starks has been, just do the thing already). Former rivals become reluctant tag partners in Britt & Rosa after Hayter & Storm team up to run things like two boss motherfuckers. I'd rather see Kris Statlander end Jade's undefeated streak, to be honest. If we can't have any of that, I'll settle for a Statlander/Storm title program if she ever takes it off of Thunder Rosa.

But, yeah, I've been of the opinion that Thunder Rosa has never been all that great and is only a slight cut above Britt Baker in-ring. They both make up for it (I guess?) outside of that, whether it's character work, mic work, etc.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

53 minutes ago, Matt D said:

Fuck it, I want to double down because it makes me pretty angry. In pro wrestling anything can work and anything can be effective. It takes 3-4 things.

1. Conviction from the person delivering the offense: they have to believe in what they're doing and project that belief, embody it.
2. Reaction from the person taking the offense: this is selling; the person has to show that it has an effect upon them through their physical reactions.
3. The announcers putting it over: it was done with conviction, it was sold with conviction; just explain and express that it worked and come up with reasons how and why and put it in context.
4. Consistency over time: if these three above things all happen and they happen repeatedly, the fans become conditioned to accept what they're seeing.

JR crapping on something that was done with conviction and is being sold not only means he's failing at what he's doing, but he's actively betraying not just the wrestler doing the move the wrestler that dared to sell it. It means that any other time that wrestler sells anything, it's put to doubt. It means that any other time the initial wrestler does any offense, it's put to doubt. The only one who potentially gets any credibility out of it is JR himself, who comes off like a maverick who calls things fake even when the wrestlers aren't brave enough to avoid doing them or to avoid selling it or the fans in the audience aren't brave enough to avoid reacting to it. Only JR is above all of them.

He has to go. He 100% has to go. What an absolute liability. What a horrible announcer. A bad announcer who fails to do his job and get something over is one thing. A terrible, wretched, counter-productive announcer who actively sabotages the product is something else entirely.

Agreed 110% and thanks for articulating it so well.

"I don't see any skin lost!" was just awful. In trying to give him the benefit of the doubt, he may still have his referee mentality towards his credibility where if he doesn't call out the bullshit and sells it as anything less, then he's seen as lacking credibility the next time he's required to put something over, rather than the announcer role where he's supposed to sell the stupid shit. Even though he's sold far more ridiculous for the past 30 years without missing a beat.

The misogynistic "She's just worried about when she's going to the mall next!" line re: Tay Conti was awful too. It wasn't even consistent with the character they have her doing either. Just his weird view of women.