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The Natural

OCTOBER 2018 WRESTLING DISCUSSION

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Does anyone know what Onita usually says during Onita Theater? All I understand is when he starts chanting "oi! oi! oi!" and even then I'm sure that's not what he's saying and it's actually something meaningful instead of a punk subgenre.

I watched the IYH Final Four main event the other; Bret/Taker/Vader/Austin and it ruled. Heated, chaotic 4 way brawl. Loved every minute of it. Once I'm done with my re-watch/watch FMW, Onita and it's various spinoffs, I may need to re-watch a bunch of 97 WWF and ECW.

I also watched the entire Benoit/Sullivan feud (yeah, I know, I know). Not gonna lie, it's still one of my favorite feuds ever ad the GAB match is still my favorite match ever, but then again I'm a sucker for wild brawls.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Final Four was one of my favorite matches ever at the time.  Not because of technical mastery or anything, it was just super fun bell to bell and I enjoyed it EVEN THOUGH THE WAY TAKER LOST WAS FUCKING BULLSHIT (he ended up getting the belt that Mania anyway fuck it)

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Fatal 4 Way is indeed great and one of the 3 or 4 times Vader was used well in a WWE ring. It's one of those rare matches where there is something for damn near everyone and fans had a legit reason for backing their wrestler in that match. I was in the Steve Austin camp, but I totally get those in the Hart, Taker, or Vader camps. I need to watch that match again. It's been a little bit.

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I'd take a wild heated brawl like that over technical mastery almost always even though I'm a huge Catch Wrestling fan.

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17 minutes ago, Craig H said:

I need to watch that match again. It's been a little bit.

Shit, I haven't seen that since it happened! Just looking at that lineup (even though it's a four way) makes me drool.

EDIT: 

 

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On 10/7/2018 at 3:00 PM, Edwin said:

 

That's gosh darn amazing. Hogan and Tenryu matched up great together. 

This does make me wonder if Hogan ever faced off against Jumbo. Does anyone know?

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Cagematch says no. 

Only time it says they were on the same show was the super show when Hogan wrestled Stan. 

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The entire IYH: Final Four has always been a favorite WWF show of mine, and that main event was, indeed, amazing.

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I have watched shows with huge fans and I have watched shows with workers.  It is interesting to see the things workers notice or look out for in matches that even a diehard fan wouldn't see.

 

Austin Aries has a jerk in person though (no he didn't turn me down for an autograph). I am sure others will agree. His opinion is just as valuable as Meltzers to me

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13 minutes ago, paintedbynumbers said:

I have watched shows with huge fans and I have watched shows with workers.  It is interesting to see the things workers notice or look out for in matches that even a diehard fan wouldn't see.

 

Austin Aries has a jerk in person though (no he didn't turn me down for an autograph). I am sure others will agree. His opinion is just as valuable as Meltzers to me

Edge and Christian talk occasionally about how footwork is the first thing they look at when they watch a new wrestler, and that's not something I think any of us really looks at.

But to me, that's irrelevant to my comments, because what we do look at and what we judge on is very likely both consistent and well-developed for all of us, and so long as those two things are true, it's fine that our criteria might be completely different from that of wrestlers. Aries is definitely worse off for not being able to see where we're coming from, even if we can see where he's coming from.

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I have had guys way more accomplished in wrestling and better performers thank me for liking their work. So the little creep can piss up a rope. 

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Speaking of Final Four I had started going back through 1997..  slowly..  I don't have too much time to watch but I think Bret Hart might have had the greatest single year run of any heel in WWF history.  He was just fucking amazing every single week.  It can't be said enough.  

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26 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Speaking of Final Four I had started going back through 1997..  slowly..  I don't have too much time to watch but I think Bret Hart might have had the greatest single year run of any heel in WWF history.  He was just fucking amazing every single week.  It can't be said enough.  

Expansion Era Piper is probably another contender.

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From Bret's return in '96 through his departure in '97, that's peak WWF imo. Final Four was so dope. I remember thinking how a match with four of my favourites would work, and holy fuck did it not disappoint. Just wild shit.

Also this:

As great as Dusty's line is here and of course his delivery, Christopher just sets this shit up on a platter. Perfection.

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Listening to @BAHU's podcast...

WWF was considering Hayabusa for the Hakushi role. He also mentions Hayabusa's gear was what they based Avatar's gear off of.

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Austin Aries has always come across as a dickhead outside the ring, to me.

Bret Hart vs. The Undertaker vs. Steve Austin vs. Vader at In Your House 13: Final Four is such a great match. My favourite four way match ever.

What a year 1997 was with Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin at WrestleMania 13 the Match of the Year, Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker inside Hell in a Cell at WWF In Your House 18: Badd Blood, Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio at WCW Halloween Havoc and Mitsuharu Misawa vs. Kenta Kobashi AJPW in January. All *****.

You get Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin, the reformation of the Hart Foundation, the three faces of Foley in WWF for the first time, Sting/WCW vs the n.W.o and ECW's year including their first PPV in Barley Legal and the graphic Terry Funk vs. Sabu no roped bared wire match at Born to be Wired.

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5 minutes ago, The Natural said:

Austin Aries has always comes across as a dickhead outside the ring, to me.

Bret Hart vs. The Undertaker vs. Steve Austin vs. Vader at In Your House 13: Final Four is such a great match. My favourite four way match ever.

What a year 1997 was with Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin at WrestleMania 13 the Match of the Year, Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker inside Hell in a Cell at WWF In Your House 18: Badd Blood, Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio at WCW Halloween Havoc and Mitsuharu Misawa vs. Kenta Kobashi AJPW in January. All *****.

You get Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin, the reformation of the Hart Foundation, the three faces of Foley in WWF for the first time, Sting/WCW vs the n.W.o and ECW's year including their first PPV in Barley Legal and the graphic Terry Funk vs. Sabu no roped bared wire match at Born to be Wired.

My favorite year ever in wrestling. I've read that Lorne Michaels always says that people think the best SNL cast is whichever one was on while they were in high school, and I think the same might be true for wrestling and childhood. I mean, sure, I've seen plenty of incredible things in wrestling in the 21 years since, but there still isn't anything quite like seeimg everything you listed for the first time

 

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3 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

My favorite year ever in wrestling. I've read that Lorne Michaels always says that people think the best SNL cast is whichever one was on while they were in high school, and I think the same might be true for wrestling and childhood. I mean, sure, I've seen plenty of incredible things in wrestling in the 21 years since, but there still isn't anything quite like seeimg everything you listed for the first time

 

It's also my favourite year in wresting : ).

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1 hour ago, Edwin said:

Listening to @BAHU's podcast...

WWF was considering Hayabusa for the Hakushi role. He also mentions Hayabusa's gear was what they based Avatar's gear off of.

It's weird that the only FMW alums I can think of that ever ended up in a WWF/E ring were Tanaka and Awesome. FMW was definitely a bigger promotion than M-Pro but they skipped right over them and went to the smaller indy to grab talent (Kaientai-DX, Sasuke, Shinzaki).

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2 minutes ago, Curt McGirt said:

It's weird that the only FMW alums I can think of that ever ended up in a WWF/E ring were Tanaka and Awesome. FMW was definitely a bigger promotion than M-Pro but they skipped right over them and went to the smaller indy to grab talent (Kaientai-DX, Sasuke, Shinzaki).

Foley, Sabu, Chris Jericho, Lance Storm

I didn't count Terry Funk since he had been in WWF before FMW and then after

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1 hour ago, RIPPA said:

Foley, Sabu, Chris Jericho, Lance Storm

I didn't count Terry Funk since he had been in WWF before FMW and then after

You can also add Crusher Dennis (Dennis Knight). He did a tour with FMW years before signing with WWE.

Edit: Watched the debut Shin-FMW show the other day. Like most modern Japanese indys who are struggling to draw, the event was in Shin Kiba. No real big names on the card and not a great card by any chance, but the co-main was Ricky Fuji, GOEMON and the Shooter #1 vs. Tetsuya Kimura, the Great Sata and Suzunne which was exactly what you would expect it to be and the main event was Atsushi Onita and Tarzan Goto vs. Mr. Pogo and Leatherface in a street fight. The main event was quite messy and chaotic, but it never reached it's full chaotic, bloody potential and it only goes for around 9 minutes. It's just them grabbing themselves by their necks and running around ringside throwing each other against fans and chairs. The highlight was probably Onita hurling chairs recklessly as always.

Edit 2.0: Now the main event of the Shin-FMW 1/26/10 show is some wild stuff. It's Tarzan Goto, Hisakatsu Oya and Ricky Fuji vs. Mr. Pogo, Super Leather and the Winger in a street fight. There's a small guy who comes out dressed as Super Leather and he's getting wrecked by Goto before music hits and Super Leather comes in through the side door with his chainsaw and he starts rushing at the crowd. He then comes in the ring and wrecks the other Super Leather. Moments later Goto is then just hurling chairs at Super Leather who's covering up with a table and Pogo is carving guys up like Halloween pumpkins. Meanwhile the Winger gets beatdown and unmasked again. Goto is tossing chairs in the ring and the fans join and start tossing chairs in the ring and then the Winger gets wrecked some more in the chaos. Wild stuff. In the post match interview, whoever is playing Super Leather called Tarzan Goto a banana.

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Did Bill Demott ever appear in FMW as Crash The Terminator?

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No, Bill was a W*ING and then an IWA JAPAN guy.

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On 10/7/2018 at 4:00 PM, Edwin said:

 

Good call! Hogan/Mutoh and Hogan/Hansen in Japan were pretty sweet as well. I've long defended Hogan as someone who could, (when he felt like it) work a hell of a good match. The NA audiences wanted the hulk-up, big boot and leg drop so that's what they got. The Japanese fans wouldn't have stood for such nonsense, so they got a good match.

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