(BP) Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Miz is brilliant because I've never been able to tell where the heel heat ends and the go away heat starts. It's unfortunate that he wasn't a natural athlete and spent time in a developmental that made cookie cutter workers. He's my one of my favorite wrestlers that I'd never ever want to watch a comp of. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 1 hour ago, JCM said: Arn Anderson is one of the best promos of all time, was in the best stable of all time, one half of one of the greatest tag teams of all time with Tully, and maybe the greatest tag wrestler of all time. The fucking Miz(and I enjoy his work) doesn't compare to AA. And believe me, 99% of fans haven't seen him at his best on weekly WCW/NWA TV, just PPV's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCM Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 It just seems to me that they're in two different leagues. I'd take Arn's promos alone over Miz' entire career without thinking twice. Miz on a top 100 of all time list(even if it's just American wrestlers) doesn't compute. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 So, if I were making a list, I'd put Arn top fifty and not rate Miz. But the argument I'd make for Arn looks a lot like the argument I'd make for Miz, which is all I'm saying (and I do think that Arn has the added argument of "great mic worker" which Miz, while solid, doesn't have). I don't think they're ultimately in the same league, either. But neither guy has been in many all-time 1-on-1 matches and both have longevity and being really solid workers as singles and in tags all over TV as their arguments. And if someone pressed an argument based on Miz being top one hundred for those reasons, I'd disagree, but I'd understand where it's coming from. It's my fault for pointing out that the arguments for them look similar when it comes to productivity, though. As soon as I mentioned Arn Anderson in the same post as the Miz without that post saying "Arn Anderson is way the fuck better than the Miz," I should have known that some of y'all motherfuckers would get triggered. I kind of don't blame you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 The deal with the PWO GWE thing is that it was just 100 wrestlers from all of history and from every style. If you have 10 mid-south guys, it's harder to place Miz even at 100. If you have 20 luchadors, etc. If you have 15 Joshi workers, 10 WoS wrestlers, etc. And those last five spots which were a bit more "personal pick"-y were so, so hard. I think Miz brings a lot to the table, honestly, but I look at the genius of Les Kellett or how amazingly sound Judy Martin was or Brazo de Oro's match with Santo. Miz never had a match like that. And everyone had to deal with that. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 If I was compiling a list of 'Best Pro-Wrestlers who started out on reality TV' I would have Miz behind Jesse Godderz. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Even if you have a massive blind spot (like I know nothing about Mexico and little about Oceania), it would be hard to place someone like him. It would be hard to do on a list of only U.S. workers, even accounting for the fact that there is little pre-seventies footage. I might have one hundred guys who wrestled in the '80s before Miz. But then again, I looked at the list just now and Kofi Kingston got a vote, so you never know. That's the magical thing about lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 http://prowrestlingonly.com/index.php?/topic/33534-kofi-kingston/ It's not necessarily a case I agree with, but it's a strong case for why someone would give a low vote for Kofi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Dave Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Wait a minute, on what planet is Miz not a great mic worker? The guy gets sensational heat without touching anyone? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I mean, I don't think he's great, but if you made the argument that he was, I would certainly see where you were coming from. I do think it's worth something extra that he generates actual heel heat as a heel in 2016 WWE. But when I think "great," I think more like Arn Anderson being basically the President Obama of wrestling promos with the voice that you know is spitting truth and the sometimes soaring rhetoric and the ability to give me chills at his best. EDIT: MattD, I think that's a compelling argument. It actually makes me want to go watch some random 2011 Kofi matches on Superstars or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I like Miz' mic work, I thought his match with Lawler was one of the best of that year, but until someone does this to his ring music, he ain't shit: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 16 minutes ago, Smelly McUgly said: I mean, I don't think he's great, but if you made the argument that he was, I would certainly see where you were coming from. I do think it's worth something extra that he generates actual heel heat as a heel in 2016 WWE. But when I think "great," I think more like Arn Anderson being basically the President Obama of wrestling promos with the voice that you know is spitting truth and the sometimes soaring rhetoric and the ability to give me chills at his best. EDIT: MattD, I think that's a compelling argument. It actually makes me want to go watch some random 2011 Kofi matches on Superstars or something. The Learned Psychology argument helped to get Christian to the top 105 since he's basically the king of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt McGirt Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Just to break the conversation, I think all of us can enjoy this no matter what. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 A thing to remember about The Miz is that while he may not have a super strong catalogue of matches (though he does have some very good ones) his character work is fucking A+ and to someone like me that is extremely important. Jericho is probably one of my favorite guys to watch right now because his current character is so fucking douchey and absurd and he plays it perfectly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 BTW - the Miz being on that list isn't even remotely the most egregious thing on it (or not on it if you will) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bustronaut Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 The *most* egregious thing about the SI Wrestling list is that people still think Sports Illustrated matters in any way. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Miz might make my "Top 100 Wrestlers Who Regularly Use the Figure Four". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Maybe the list was "in order of appearance." Then they drew names from a hat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zakk_Sabbath Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 1 hour ago, cwoy2j said: Miz might make my "Top 100 Wrestlers Who Regularly Use the Figure Four". Even then it's just Flair 50 times and Greg Valentine 49 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 1 hour ago, cwoy2j said: Miz might make my "Top 100 Wrestlers Who Regularly Use the Figure Four". I'm being told on reddit that he is one of the best wrestlers ever by multiple people. Here's some quotes: "he's been around for over 12 years and headlined a wrestlemania. 101 isn't a stretch. " "I'd have Miz way higher than 101. He is easily in my top 20 if not even top 15. I have been watching for 10 years, and he is easily there. " "To be honest, he may be one of the best heels of all time- and you throwing a fit about him only serves to prove that theory. " People say I'm elitist, but I'm not even sure that I'm from the same planet as some of these dudes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technico Support Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 I had to look it up: Tully and Arn only worked together as a team for a little over two years (mid 1987 - November 1989). So did they pack an amazing amount of really good matches into that short stint or are we looking at them with rose-coolored glasses a bit? Right now I'm going to play the little girl in the taco commercials and say, "porque no los dos?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 57 minutes ago, Technico Support said: I had to look it up: Tully and Arn only worked together as a team for a little over two years (mid 1987 - November 1989). So did they pack an amazing amount of really good matches into that short stint or are we looking at them with rose-coolored glasses a bit? Right now I'm going to play the little girl in the taco commercials and say, "porque no los dos?" Most definitely the former. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 1 hour ago, rzombie1988 said: I'm being told on reddit that he is one of the best wrestlers ever by multiple people. Here's some quotes: "he's been around for over 12 years and headlined a wrestlemania. 101 isn't a stretch. " "I'd have Miz way higher than 101. He is easily in my top 20 if not even top 15. I have been watching for 10 years, and he is easily there. " "To be honest, he may be one of the best heels of all time- and you throwing a fit about him only serves to prove that theory. " People say I'm elitist, but I'm not even sure that I'm from the same planet as some of these dudes. I love that "headlined a WM" talking point. He was in one of the worst WM main events of one of the worst WM. And I get a chuckle out of "I have been watching for 10 years". Wow, 10 whole years! So where would they rank Eric Escobar? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyld Samurai Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 King Kong Bundy headlined a Wrestlemania. That's the only counter argument anyone ever needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted July 29, 2016 Share Posted July 29, 2016 Didn't know there were so many unreasonably venomous Miz haters left, thought y'all got bored and moved on to Dolph and Rollins 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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