2014 MOVIE OMNIBUS THREAD

[J.T.]

Everyone should watch Snowpiercer.

[Curt McGirt]

Watched Outrage right before passing out last night. Now that is what I call entertainment! Wickedly cynical, incredibly violent, and knee-deep in black humor. The only other Beat Takeshi film I've seen is Violent Cop and that bored the piss out of me; this one certainly did not. As an example of the old adage "there is no honor among thieves" placed in an organized crime setting, the only thing I can really compare it to is Il Boss by Fernando di Leo. The story takes that tact so bald-faced, with more direct examples of the double-crossing and back-biting between gangsters than you ever see in mob pictures. There's no mystery or artifice, the boss is playing with his underlings like action figures in a sandbox and it's clear from the jump. Takeshi himself is in fine form, his only emotion shown being anger, otherwise retreating inside himself with this slightly resigned yet otherwise blank look on his face. Funny enough it seems like the only truly dedicated and trustworthy yakuza in the film are his own men. It makes sense as they are arms of himself and he is the only old-school guy left with a sense of honor. Really want to see the sequel to this one now.

[caley]

I was struck watching 'Bullet to the Head' at how much better Jason Momoa was as a dour, charisma-less bad guy then he was a dour, charisma-less good guy (And no, I don't watch 'Game of Thrones' so I don't have much else to go on with Momoa).  The last 10-20 minutes of 'Conan' was some of the most annoying movie in ages, with a crumbling, confusing set and the girl (I don't remember her name) repeatedly screaming.  But, I actually like the opening of the movie.  I thought Kid Konan was a lot more entertaining than full grown Conan plus RON PEARLMAN.

[jaedmc]

Outrage and Beyond Outrage are fucking good times man. 

[MarcosLoura]

Locke was great.

 

Tom Hardy driving a car and talking on the phone for and hour and an half. Fuck yeah. 

[Victator]

I think the Apes movie fell apart after Ceaser was shot. After that there was way too much stupid shit. From why nobody even attempted to find Ceaser's corpse, to how the apes were instantly able to use guns as effectively as the humans who were trained to use them. Koba just had that Max Cady is Magic writing in the last half. Meaning he accomplished stuff just because the writer needed him to. When he took down the tank, I wanted to start booing. Even the way it was shot, exposed how it could not work. 

There was also the issue that Koba (or is it Kobo) would have been the only suspect after Ceaser was murdered. I don't think the writers wanted the apes to be portrayed as idiots. 

The human characters were universally worthless. The doctor holding the gun on Gary Oldman without even attempting to explain his plan stands out as nearly Transformers stupid. Oldman never felt like a military veteran. He seemed terrified of the gun he was holding. Like it was fine china and would break at any second. 

It is not a bad movie, but the Ape invasion could have been handled much better. Them using guns introduced too many logic problems that could have been avoided. 

I think Ceaser and Maurice being taken off the table for most of the second half hurt, because they were the only real characters.

[Execproducer]

Outrage and Beyond Outrage are fucking good times man. 

They're good, but they are far from being top shelf Kitano, which includes the already mentioned Violent Cop. Hell, they don't even stack up to Ishii's Gonin.

[Jingus]

Violent Cop was kinda early in his career.  It's his A Better Tomorrow; this is where he figured out his style, but it's hardly the best example of it.  Sonatine is still my personal favorite, although every one of 'em has their moments.  Remember in Boiling Point when the lamest guy on the sports team, the complete loser, turned out to be a HELL of a lot tougher than that asshole who tried to go road-rage on the village idiot?  That "(smile) ha ha ha oh you ain't got shit for knuckles, ATTACK~!!!," bit will stick with me til the grave.  

[Niners Fan in CT]

Vic, why would Koba be a suspect when they painted it as a human who had done it? Caesar and Koba had their issues but everyone believed in the "ape don't kill ape" law and a human JUST shot one of them in the woods..  It wasn't far fetched to believe it was an assassination attempt put forth by humans.

 

In a movie where a flu has wiped out 90% of humanity and granted apes human intelligence we are worried that they may not have had proper weapons training.

[EVA]

I'm skimming over this APES talk, so I don't know what exactly is being said, but I'd appreciate it if we could be mindful of spoilerz in this thread.

[Victator]

Vic, why would Koba be a suspect when they painted it as a human who had done it? Caesar and Koba had their issues but everyone believed in the "ape don't kill ape" law and a human JUST shot one of them in the woods..  It wasn't far fetched to believe it was an assassination attempt put forth by humans.

 

Ceaser had a very public fight with Koba and beat him senseless. He had also been opposed to the humans from the start. Some of the apes would have been questioning him. He was a bigger suspect than an unknown human. 

 

​Niners Fan in CT, on 15 Jul 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

 

In a movie where a flu has wiped out 90% of humanity and granted apes human intelligence we are worried that they may not have had proper weapons training.

 

 

 

 

Completely serious and not being aggressive. You do get why that is a terrible defense?

[Niners Fan in CT]

No, I get that its not perfect.. but we really don't know if they have used guns before or not.. one would assume they've explored a lot of human creations over the ten year period.

[Guest The Magnificent 7]

There's a scene I believe where Koba first finds the gun and fires a shot and looks at it like ah so that's how these things work. The movie certainly doesn't act like these apes have much experience shooting.  Even if they did, it is ridiculously hard to shoot a rifle one armed, no matter how strong an ape may be.  Then you add the horseback factor and come on now.  Hollywood nonsense, sure that's why it was a minor thing to me. 

 

But I still want to know where they keep their spare mags.

[nate]

There's a scene I believe where Koba first finds the gun and fires a shot and looks at it like ah so that's how these things work. The movie certainly doesn't act like these apes have much experience shooting. Even if they did, it is ridiculously hard to shoot a rifle one armed, no matter how strong an ape may be. Then you add the horseback factor and come on now. Hollywood nonsense, sure that's why it was a minor thing to me.

But I still want to know where they keep their spare mags.

Up their asses. IS THAT WHAT YOU'VE BEEN WAITING FOR?!??! "Up their fucking smelly ape assholes," THERE. Fuck.

[Guest The Magnificent 7]

What's your problem, ace?

[nate]

What's your problem, ace?

Nothing; I just wanted to say,"Up their fucking smelly ape assholes," 'cause you know how you get something in your head and it has to get out? The faux rage made it sound funnier in my head, but it didn't translate quite how I'd have liked. Sorry for any offense, because none was intended, truly. They can't all be winners; no harm no foul?

[Victator]

No, I get that its not perfect.. but we really don't know if they have used guns before or not.. one would assume they've explored a lot of human creations over the ten year period.

I don't want to make it sound like I'm shitting on the movie. It was good, it certainly was not Transformers 4. 

Those were just the things that took me out of the movie and I feel like they were avoidable. I think they should have put more thought into the ape/human war instead of "the apes win just cause."

[piranesi]

We could avoid all this conflict by sticking to the real rampaging monkey movie series.

 

No guns in TERRA CHIMP, fellas.  Just extremity ripping and face mauling.

[Tabe]

We could avoid all this conflict by sticking to the real rampaging monkey movie series.

How about a one-off like Monkey Shines ?

[Control]

Watched NYMPHOMANIAC (Vol. I & II) over the weekend. I have to fall inline with much of the criticism out there, that is Vol. I is great, and Vol. II is not so great.

 

Admittedly, I haven't seen a lot of Lars von Trier movies. I'd seen ELEMENT OF CRIME, EUROPA, and ANTICHRIST before this. I have a whole lot of respect for von Trier as a filmmaker, and his skills are really on show here. He has a very impressive visual style, but what's more, he's committed to making movies about ideas. That's pretty rare. He thinks of film as art, and acts accordingly.

 

However, the problem is that the ideas he has are pretty facile. He wants to tackle important issues--whether strictly philosophical, moral, or emotional--but he has a very simplistic grasp of these things (at least in the pictures I've seen).

 

Once you get passed the unsimulated sex, NYMPHOMANIAC is about a conversation between an artist (one who creates art) and a critic (one who does not, but comments nonetheless). Joe (Gainsbourgh), the title character, is the artist: she is compelled to do something that makes her feel good and which makes others feel good. Seligman (Skarsgaard) is the critic: he's a virgin, and believes that his academic approach to her story gives him the appropriate critical distance to judge it. And so von Trier approaches a very old conflict (artists and critics) and sets out to prove the superiority of one point of view. That he does this through allegory (and through a very adept hand at filmmaking) results in a good film, but it adds nothing to the debate. He doesn't like critics: they haven't made art, so they actually don't get it. This can be funny (such as when Seligman tries to add complications to her story that aren't necessary: Fibonacci numbers and historical parallels), but after a while it becomes quite belabored, and the absolutely vile last scene is simply there to further belittle critics.

 

I just wish that von Trier could use his obvious and impressive skills to tackle a more significant issue. It's not worth assembling the talent he did, and spending the effort he did, to write a fairly crude comic polemic about film critics. Furthermore, while I think that his approach to human emotions and sexual relations has been more nuanced in the past (could be wrong), there are simply no characters here; rather, all you have is two compulsions--to fuck, and to intellectualize. Neither can strain from this path. 

Now, of course, in calling for von Trier to tackle something a bit more complicated, I realize that I'm being a bit of a Seligman here, who keeps demanding complexity where Joe insists that there's nothing but simplicity. But you don't have to add needless complications to approach an issue with some degree of sophistication.

 

I've been thinking of similar directors, and wondering if they suffer from similar limitations. What I've seen of Jodorowsky (just EL TOPO) might support a similar reading: his film is visually interesting and sometimes overburdened with symbolism, but at the root of it is some pretty simplistic ideas about sexuality and religion. But I think I'd still give the edge to Jodorowsky. I haven't seen enough Tarkovsky to see if the criticism rings true there, as well: STALKER might actually be a pretty good parallel.

 

Anyway, I'd like to see von Trier adapt BLOOD MERIDIAN. Seriously.  

[J.T.]

I've seen both Nymphomaniac Vols. 1 and 2 and I kinda disagree with Von Trier's premise.  While I don't have the inclination or the skill to be an artist, I as a person know what I like and I know what I don't like.  i would think that it is this basic idea that more than qualifies me to be a critic.

 

I can understand the premise he's trying to drive home (pun not intended).  He hates critics because they don't understand the process of creation or the frustration you experience in the course of creating something.  He also hates the fact that the empowered opinions of critics often influence people to pass judgement on somethng that they have not experienced for themselves. 

 

The problem lies with the egos of Von Trier and artists like him in thinking that everything they create is automatically noteworthy and socially relevant (or even just plain ol' good) just because they created it. 

 

However like someone much wiser than me said, Not every painting gets to hang in the Louvre.  Art resonates and causes those who experience art to generate a consensus.  Either they love it or they hate it and if ten thousand people all have a negative opinion of your creation, it probably sucks.

 

I also think it speaks volumes that Von Trier attempts to criticize critics via an allegory comprised of some of the most unerotic moments you will ever see in a movie rather than using a simpler and far less controversial device like, oh I dunno... a movie about a film maker who has an adversarial relationship with a film critic.

 

Masking the rather legit point you're trying to make in a pseudo-intellectual psycho-sexual metaphor is needlessly distracting. 

 

Look at Melahcholia for example.  Started off as a poignant character study into the idea of whether nihilism or optimism was the more natural element in the human psyche and then it got all I know you expect this from me so here is a scene where Kirsten Dunst shows you her tits.

[odessasteps]

Better to discuss criticism by using a talking mouse that is a genius chef.

[Curt McGirt]

I was pretty much force-fed Man of Steel last night and was pleasantly surprised. As a Marvel Kid and someone who has always hated the Superman character, and also someone who is not much of a POPCORN SUMMER BLOCKBUSTAH! guy, I thought it was fairly intelligent and very well-acted, with a bevy of character actors showing up that I had no idea were in the movie. Lawrence Fishburne looks like he ate young Larry Fishburne, but what the hell, people age. It's always good to see Michael Shannon gleefully chew the scenery though I had to tell my friend he needed to watch Boardwalk Empire to see the real extent to which Shannon can wig out. Only real complaint is, of course, entire city blocks being decimated with no human carnage being made mention of. And then Clark Kent seamlessly stepping into the Daily Planet which was an egregious "OF COURSE HE'S SUPERMAN YOU ASSHOLES" moment. 

[caley]

I was pretty much force-fed Man of Steel last night and was pleasantly surprised. As a Marvel Kid and someone who has always hated the Superman character, and also someone who is not much of a POPCORN SUMMER BLOCKBUSTAH! guy, I thought it was fairly intelligent and very well-acted, with a bevy of character actors showing up that I had no idea were in the movie. Lawrence Fishburne looks like he ate young Larry Fishburne, but what the hell, people age. It's always good to see Michael Shannon gleefully chew the scenery though I had to tell my friend he needed to watch Boardwalk Empire to see the real extent to which Shannon can wig out. Only real complaint is, of course, entire city blocks being decimated with no human carnage being made mention of. And then Clark Kent seamlessly stepping into the Daily Planet which was an egregious "OF COURSE HE'S SUPERMAN YOU ASSHOLES" moment. 

Replace 'Boardwalk Empire' with 'Take Shelter' and it would be even better.

 

Watched Red Heat last night.  Man, they just don't make action flicks like that anymore!  Arnold Schwarzenegger is a Ivan, a Russian cop, who travels to the US to bring down a Russian drug dealer on a sort of Russian/American police officer exchange program.  He gets paired up with huge pain in the ass Jim Belushi whose jobs should be mainly to crack wise but instead ends up being more like a damsel in distress as he's constantly getting angry with Ivan and getting pissy about his methods.  But it's just such a relic of its time: one-liners, copious nudity, a bathhouse brawl with half-naked Russian dudes, oodles of bullets, massive kill count, and ends with a bus on bus chase through the streets of Chicago, culminating in a massive crash with a train.  So good.

[Curt McGirt]

Yeah, there's no way Austin has the patience to watch Boardwalk. I could probably get him to get through Take Shelter though. He loved Bug and The Machinist so I think that would work out.

 

I love the part in Red Heat where he pulls the guy's fake leg off, dumps out the coke and says "cocaine" in Russian which is translated on the screen.