JonnyLaw Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Sami Callihan doesn't deserve to get in, because his Crowe run was the drizzling shits. How good of an actual worker are you if you can't adapt to different styles and fail on a big stage? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Also, some further discussion on the Superstars year of Jack Swagger would be appreciated. Here's Charlie's list again: Not sure where to put this but Jack Swagger was a Top 10 WWE wrestler in 2015. Maybe even Top 5. After his excellent match with Del Rio at TLC, I've been going back and watching most of his stuff from 2015 and I'm super impressed. The guy makes for a great face, IMO. Good strikes, moves/bumps well for a big guy, has some great power moves and sells really well. Some recommendations: vs Cesaro (Main Event #125 - 2/17) vs Harper (Main Event #144 - 6/30) vs Rusev (Smackdown 7/28 & Tribute To The Troops) vs Owens (Main Event #153 - 9/1) vs Sheamus (Main Event #156 - 9/22) vs Stardust (Main Event #169 - 12/29) There's also some good looking house show stuff that I just couldn't track down. He had a couple matches against Del Rio in Canada and Texas that sounded great from the reviews I read. Not quite the year Solomon Crowe had, I know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Okay, hold on a second. If someone doesn't watch RAW and SD! every week then how can they say a wrestler hasn't had a good year and shouldn't be included? Also, I usually vote on more then just x number of matches so I would probably include Rusev because I think he did something this calendar year that nobody did. He turned what SHOULD have been the worst story line of the year and made it watchable. He showed great range. Nobody knew how hilarious he was until they fed him bullshit and he turned it into gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Okay, hold on a second. If someone doesn't watch RAW and SD! every week then how can they say a wrestler hasn't had a good year and shouldn't be included? Also, I usually vote on more then just x number of matches so I would probably include Rusev because I think he did something this calendar year that nobody did. He turned what SHOULD have been the worst story line of the year and made it watchable. He showed great range. Nobody knew how hilarious he was until they fed him bullshit and he turned it into gold. I watch most Raw stuff, but I very rarely watch entire shows. I've watched most Rollins matches, but that stretch was in that "God Fucking Damn this promotion" stretch were I kinda tuned out of the main show for like a month. Rusev though, has a fair case, though the problem there IS what you were saying for Rollins. Just such a let down feeling, even though it was predictable, on where he is now. It's not even a Wyatt low thing were he's still presented as a threat. Rusev is like the 3rd strongest booked guy in a heel stable people don't care about. I'd say Rusev still should be in the WWE's top 16, most likely on further thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Literally the three guys that responded to that puro talk are the three guys I think of when I think about "who are the people that are going to vote almost entirely anti-WWE just because?" And it takes someone who hates WWE to act like there are as many standout wrestlers on the US Indies as there are on WWE TV. I think I'm someone who's been fairly "anti-Indy" in years past, and this last year seemed like a huge, huge year for Indy wrestling, all of the PWG and Evolve stuff, all of the King of the Southern Indies stuff. The Styles indy tour, Hero and recently Sami coming back. There's definitely been a sea change in the last year or two relative to the five or ten years before that. I'm hearing about great indy matches on an almost daily basis from a lot of people that I trust. I just don't have time to catch them all. The fact of the matter is that WWE IS signing these guys. Busisk, Gulag, and a bunch of others have gotten picked up recently and others are being looked at. They have an active arrangement with Evolve. This happened: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Literally the three guys that responded to that puro talk are the three guys I think of when I think about "who are the people that are going to vote almost entirely anti-WWE just because?" And it takes someone who hates WWE to act like there are as many standout wrestlers on the US Indies as there are on WWE TV. I think I'm someone who's been fairly "anti-Indy" in years past, and this last year seemed like a huge, huge year for Indy wrestling, all of the PWG and Evolve stuff, all of the King of the Southern Indies stuff. The Styles indy tour, Hero and recently Sami coming back. There's definitely been a sea change in the last year or two relative to the five or ten years before that. I'm hearing about great indy matches on an almost daily basis from a lot of people that I trust. I just don't have time to catch them all. The fact of the matter is that WWE IS signing these guys. Busisk, Gulag, and a bunch of others have gotten picked up recently and others are being looked at. They have an active arrangement with Evolve. This happened: Doesn't matter, didn't happen with the E, try again. Also, LOL Solomon Crow, apparently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Matt - never said independent standouts don't exist, just that the idea that there should be more of them in the tournament than WWE workers is part of an anti-WWE narrative pushed by some loud haters on the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Phil, can you change my Jacksonville Lizard King to "Loud Hater" please? Here, let's play a game. I named 22 Indy guys that had very strong years this year. Let's take the 17th best person on that list, then compare him to the 16th on your WWE list, and see who had a better year! Oh, wait, sorry, that doesn't count apparently because the Indies are the minors and thus don't matter. My bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 LOL Evan Bourne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodear Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Sami Callihan doesn't deserve to get in, because his Crowe run was the drizzling shits. How good of an actual worker are you if you can't adapt to different styles and fail on a big stage? I do think there is something to be said that if you aren't able to do a 5 minute match and can only succeed when you can be as stiff as possible that there is a severe weekness in your game. Crowe run was SOOOO bad you guys. Just incredibly bad. I liked Evan Bourne. Just not as much as he likes synthetic marijuana. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 EDIT: Actually, naa, I'm done. This thread is gotten silly. Will do the measures needed to not deal with MORELOCK anymore officially. Anyone have any actual match write ups that are there own for the Swagger run instead of just posting someone else said? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Because I guess you don't have to actually watch any WWE to shit on it. Just read some write-ups! This is why there's a Scott Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SorceressKnight Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Literally the three guys that responded to that puro talk are the three guys I think of when I think about "who are the people that are going to vote almost entirely anti-WWE just because?" And it takes someone who hates WWE to act like there are as many standout wrestlers on the US Indies as there are on WWE TV. I think I'm someone who's been fairly "anti-Indy" in years past, and this last year seemed like a huge, huge year for Indy wrestling, all of the PWG and Evolve stuff, all of the King of the Southern Indies stuff. The Styles indy tour, Hero and recently Sami coming back. There's definitely been a sea change in the last year or two relative to the five or ten years before that. I'm hearing about great indy matches on an almost daily basis from a lot of people that I trust. I just don't have time to catch them all. The fact of the matter is that WWE IS signing these guys. Busisk, Gulag, and a bunch of others have gotten picked up recently and others are being looked at. They have an active arrangement with Evolve. This happened: Doesn't matter, didn't happen with the E, try again. Also, LOL Solomon Crow, apparently. The main thing everyone's accepted with AJ Styles's being a lock is "he's currently in WWE, but most of the year was in New Japan so he would be a fairer bet for a Japan spot than a WWE spot." That's out there and accepted by everyone in the debate, and Styles will likely be an easy entrant there. By that same argument, it has to be also said that Sami Callihan spent most of the voting period in NXT, and was the drizzling shits there to the point he was the single biggest bust in NXT and could not have been more exposed. As a result, Solomon Crowe would end up falling under WWE rules- and Crowe did not deserve to be anywhere near March Madness as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 There are no "in the New Japan field or in the WWE field" rules. It's not "just pick 16 from each". Styles is in because of his time with New Japan and the US Indys was really good. If Callihan makes it, which he has a decent shot, I would think, it would be because since his release he's been having great matches all over the indys in the last few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Because I guess you don't have to actually watch any WWE to shit on it. Just read some write-ups! This is why there's a Scott Keith. How many Matt Sydal matches from the time period have you watched? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MORELOCK Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 I've watched a few Sydal matches since he left WWE (where I never cared for him), I'd have to go back and check which were specifically in the time period, but I do remember the 4-Way Tag that opened WrestleKingdom being everything I hate about modern wrestling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted February 15, 2016 Share Posted February 15, 2016 Dragon, check out Charlie's posts in the Main Event/Superstars thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted February 16, 2016 Author Share Posted February 16, 2016 To help (or hinder...) the Swagger and Breeze cases 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 I'll make this post before reading the whole thread for the first time. I'd like Undertaker to be included as I'm a massive fan and looking better than I had hoped especially with the two Brock Lesnar matches proving again the WrestleMania XXX match was a blip due to the unfortunate severe concussion. Early prediction, Sasha and Bayley to go the furthest for WWE. Safe to say Cena and Owens runs in the year were divisive by some? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Schneider Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 Sami Callihan doesn't deserve to get in, because his Crowe run was the drizzling shits. How good of an actual worker are you if you can't adapt to different styles and fail on a big stage? I do think there is something to be said that if you aren't able to do a 5 minute match and can only succeed when you can be as stiff as possible that there is a severe weekness in your game. Crowe run was SOOOO bad you guys. Just incredibly bad. I liked Evan Bourne. Just not as much as he likes synthetic marijuana. How many Crowe matches were there that aired? I saw a Crowe v. Balor match live at an NXT house show where he looked great and was over, I thought Crowe v. Owens was a fine competitive squash, what were the bad matches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 I'd like to see someone make a defense for Brock against the criticisms made other than just taking it as matter-of-fact and going like this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted February 16, 2016 Author Share Posted February 16, 2016 Crowe matches on TV from voting period (as far as I can tell) vs. Baron Corbin vs. Kevin Owens vs. Marcus Louis vs. Tye Dillinger w/ Neville vs. American Alpha vs. Apollo Crews He was also in the #1 contenders Battle Royal but that doesn't really count Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EVA Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 You missed his debut against Bull Dempsey. Which was probably the absolute worst way he could've been debuted. Dempsey was in that icky in-between period where Corbin had just killed him as a tough guy but he hadn't discovered Bull Fit yet, and it was one of those matches where Dempsey took (what felt like) 75% of it before Crowe won. Just awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCM Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 Early prediction, Sasha and Bayley to go the furthest for WWE. Safe to say Cena and Owens runs in the year were divisive by some? I think Owens was the best of the male roster in WWE. I've never liked his main roster work quite as much as his NXT work, but it's fairly close. The Cena series started off great, and they just did the same match two more times(actually I think the matches regressed when the second started with bomb throwing). Owens had more diversity than Cena this year, and I feel he was consistently good all year. Cena's indy ace tribute act got old by the second Owens match for me. That's when it became apparent he had no interest in working anything other than that style when he had a perfect opportunity to have a diverse series of matches with Owens( a guy who was on fire character wise and was brining a lot of unique character work to his NXT matches). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted February 16, 2016 Share Posted February 16, 2016 Early prediction, Sasha and Bayley to go the furthest for WWE. Safe to say Cena and Owens runs in the year were divisive by some? I think Owens was the best of the male roster in WWE. I've never liked his main roster work quite as much as his NXT work, but it's fairly close. The Cena series started off great, and they just did the same match two more times(actually I think the matches regressed when the second started with bomb throwing). Owens had more diversity than Cena this year, and I feel he was consistently good all year. Cena's indy ace tribute act got old by the second Owens match for me. That's when it became apparent he had no interest in working anything other than that style when he had a perfect opportunity to have a diverse series of matches with Owens( a guy who was on fire character wise and was brining a lot of unique character work to his NXT matches). Thank you for your post. I agree Kevin Owens was the best male roster wrestler in the voting period for March Madness 2016, felt like the two Sami Zayn matches didn't get talked up more/got slept on including from me and I really liked them. Rusev vs Cesaro vs. Owens from the 13th July RAW is one of the best Triple Threat matches ever, The second Owens vs. Cena match at Money in the Bank was the best of the series. John Cena's Attitude Adjustment had a big power downgrade with the first one getting kicked out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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