Wrestling What Ifs

[J.H.]

See I'd be for this to Tito v. Heel Backlund down the road.

Seriously though, I let Tito be the transitional champ to Bret. Tito would be a good champ milking his reign for nostalgia until Mania tjen have Bret win the Rumble and Mania tbus avoiding the Hogan conundrun4

James

 

[clintthecrippler]

7 hours ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

I wonder if Vince had another Japanese wrestler in mind if he was willing to sacrifice size for authenticity. You know Tenryu was probably in the running since he had a legit sumo background.

Man, the idea of Tenryu in as the stand-in for Yokozuna is putting me in a state where I am yelling at myself to "calm down, Cripplernetico".

Someone earlier suggested that maybe Flair regains at WrestleMania IX, but now that just has me imagining how much even more that everyone would have lost their shit if they pulled the post-match attack angle, Hogan comes to save the day and wins the title in an impromptu match, and THAT ends up being the only time Flair wrestled Hogan at WrestleMania.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

On 5/30/2020 at 2:13 AM, clintthecrippler said:

Man, the idea of Tenryu in as the stand-in for Yokozuna is putting me in a state where I am yelling at myself to "calm down, Cripplernetico".

Someone earlier suggested that maybe Flair regains at WrestleMania IX, but now that just has me imagining how much even more that everyone would have lost their shit if they pulled the post-match attack angle, Hogan comes to save the day and wins the title in an impromptu match, and THAT ends up being the only time Flair wrestled Hogan at WrestleMania.

Nah, I suggested Flair regains it and defends against Hennig at Mania.

But yeah that'd be awesome because we'd have got Hogan and Flair at KOTR 93 with Flair being the massive crowd favourite.

[LoneWolf&Subs]

The only thing that holds me back from totally marking out for Tenryu as Yoko is that Tenryu wasn’t the Tenryu we loved yet. But maybe working with the WWF would’ve pushed him into the chickenshit old surly asshole stuff faster. 

Edited June 1, 2020 by LoneWolf&Subs

[BurningBeard]

I could not have bought Tito as world champion as an 9 year old mark in 1993, it would have been one of the most absurd choices possible

[SorceressKnight]

The only way that Tito Santana would have remotely worked in the role was if Tito's claim "WWE wasn't sure whether they wanted to expand to Canada, then Europe or expand to Mexico, then South America. If they chose Canada, Bret got it, if they chose Mexico, Tito got it" was in play...and even THAT doesn't make any sense, because Tito Santana was always good, but not what you'd call a top luchador at any point.

Heck, if you assume the Mexico/South America thing, there's even a more intriguing choice in the WWF at the time when hindsight is 20/20, since that fall '92 time period was right around the time Konnan was still playing Max Moon. WWF Champion Tito Santana probably doesn't give WWF that market, but even "WWF Intercontinental Champion Konnan" probably gives WWF a fighting chance at making a handhold into Mexico.

[Infinit]

Didn't El Matador have a clean pinfall win against the Undertaker in Spain? 

[MonteCarl]

Would Tito winning the title be relative to when Jinder won it?

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

http://stevegraps.blogspot.com/2015/03/wwf-undertaker-v-tito-santana-october-5.html

[Petey]

On 5/28/2020 at 11:42 PM, evidence said:

What if Bill Watts becomes booker in 1989?  I've always heard that he was offered but declined because he didn't want to answer to Jim Herd.  I wonder if his run is viewed more like Flair's 1989 or more like Ole Anderson's 1990, who gets pushed, and how long he lasts in power.

I've always wondered what would have happened if Bill Watts got (took?) the Jim Herd job in late 1988. I don't know who Watts would have brought in as booker but I imagine it wouldn't have been George Scott.

[SorceressKnight]

1 hour ago, MonteCarl said:

Would Tito winning the title be relative to when Jinder won it?

The one defense of it- Tito would be much higher than Jinder's title reign, since Jinder was never even remotely a threat for any title whatsoever. In his second run, he was basically a lowcarder on Raw before this and doing nothing of note, and even in his previous reign, you'd have to go all the way back to the Jinder Mahal/Great Khali storyline to find a place where Jinder could even be considered a credible midcarder, let alone a contender (and even THAT was kind of questionable.)  

It may be a hot take, but a Tito Santana title win would...actually be much more relative to Kofi Kingston as WWE Champion. Just like Kofi, Tito was never really in the main event, but he was always running around the IC Title/Tag Team title picture, and even if he never really sniffed the main event scene, Tito was always considered a particularly important midcarder who was always a threat to win the midcard titles and usually had something to do. 

[tbarrie]

8 hours ago, SorceressKnight said:

The only way that Tito Santana would have remotely worked in the role was if Tito's claim "WWE wasn't sure whether they wanted to expand to Canada, then Europe or expand to Mexico, then South America. If they chose Canada, Bret got it, if they chose Mexico, Tito got it" was in play...and even THAT doesn't make any sense, because Tito Santana was always good, but not what you'd call a top luchador at any point.

Reading that, I can't help but think Tito thought corporate expansion worked like expansion in a game of Risk. They needed to take Canada first, so they could get to Europe by way of Iceland!

[Web Conn]

I started the thread but i don't know what all has been discussed so bare with me if it's been talked about before but what happens if the Fusient-Bischoff purchase of WCW goes through? Theoretically I guess that means Kellner doesn't cancel Nitro and Thunder on Turner Networks which has gone down as the reason why the deal fell through or USA decides the still want Wrestling after WWF leaves in late September of 2000 and pick up WCW programming and Nitro and Thunder end up on USA. So bischoffs back in charge Russo is gone and not coming back does Hogan come back? What happens to Flair with Bischoff in charge as they was still friction betweent he two of them in early '01? Do guys like Sting, Luger, Hall, Nash & Goldberg come back? Do Booker, Page, Jarrett, Steiner go back to the to the mid card? Do Joey Styles and RVD come in like has been told in wrestling lore? Do fans come back? Does interest pick up? How much longer does WCW survive?

Edited June 2, 2020 by Web Conn

[PetrolCB]

30 minutes ago, tbarrie said:

Reading that, I can't help but think Tito thought corporate expansion worked like expansion in a game of Risk. They needed to take Canada first, so they could get to Europe by way of Iceland!

And finally conquer the Ukraine.

[SorceressKnight]

As far as WCW owned by Fusient...honestly, a lot of WCW in 2001 before the sale makes it likely that if WCW could have survived 2001, they probably would have been able to still exist to this day. 

The WCW product in 2001 made it clear from a TV standard, they were starting to turn the corner, and all the Time Warner deals would have given WCW the enema they needed to have a fighting chance at survival with the WCW 24 and anyone they could have kept on after that. From there, all WCW would have to do is just survive to 2003, when College Sports Network/CBS Sports Network came into existence and WCW would have a TV deal. It seems realistic WCW could have survived until College Sports Network existed, and if that's the case, WCW likely takes over TNA's place in pro wrestling (especially since TNA has always kind of seemed like what WCW would have looked like if they lived.) 

[BurningBeard]

15 hours ago, Petey said:

I've always wondered what would have happened if Bill Watts got (took?) the Jim Herd job in late 1988. I don't know who Watts would have brought in as booker but I imagine it wouldn't have been George Scott.

I still maintain Watts coming in in late 92 is one of the worst things to happen to WCW, due to the conflict of interest his contract presented as well as his out of touch presentation and ideas.

IF he’d come in when Turner initially took over it might have helped put the rebrand on an even keel and given a bit of consistency which WCW never seemed to have until Bischoff took over.

[Nice Guy Eddie]

16 hours ago, PetrolCB said:

And finally conquer the Ukraine.

Ukraine is game to you?

[L_W_P]

Flair jumping to Vince in the early 90's...

Would WWE look any different if this didn't happen? We never got Hogan v Flair under the WWE banner and, outside of the '92 rumble, that run isn't exactly an all time peak for Naitch.

What does Vince do with the world title if Flair stays home instead of signing? Does Sid get a run in the 92 Rumble? Another go for Taker? Do either of those guys put Bret over after Mania 8? Does Savage hold it through to Mania 9 to drop it to Yoko? If Savage does hold on then does he push though Vince's idea he was finished as a main event option?

That short run (less than 2 years) by Flair actually sets up a whole change of scene in the main events for Vince through the mid 90's.

[evidence]

1 hour ago, L_W_P said:

Flair jumping to Vince in the early 90's...

Would WWE look any different if this didn't happen? We never got Hogan v Flair under the WWE banner and, outside of the '92 rumble, that run isn't exactly an all time peak for Naitch.

What does Vince do with the world title if Flair stays home instead of signing? Does Sid get a run in the 92 Rumble? Another go for Taker? Do either of those guys put Bret over after Mania 8? Does Savage hold it through to Mania 9 to drop it to Yoko? If Savage does hold on then does he push though Vince's idea he was finished as a main event option?

That short run (less than 2 years) by Flair actually sets up a whole change of scene in the main events for Vince through the mid 90's.

I think it still ends up with Hogan vs Sid but I wonder if they try doing face vs face at Mania instead.  I wonder if they still end up promoting Hogan's retirement.  I wonder if they end up making it a title match and if not who ends up in that spot.

Edited June 3, 2020 by evidence

[BurningBeard]

6 hours ago, L_W_P said:

Flair jumping to Vince in the early 90's...

Would WWE look any different if this didn't happen?

ON the whole I don't think so, due to the steroid trial and Bret's popularity in Europe he was always destined to get that run.

I think you're right about WMVIII, it would have still been Hogan v Sid on top but I don't know how you get there. I suppose Hogan v Undertaker could go the same leading to the title being held up, then Sid wins by turfing Hogan leading to a slow burn feud and eventual Sid heel turn. But as I mentioned, with the steroid trial I still think Sid was destined to have that turn and disappointingly short run which is a shame as I really think he could have been the face of the company if the stars had aligned.

Looking back, I get the impression Vince really wasn't impressed with what he got with Flair and was happy to be rid of him in the end

[paintedbynumbers]

For WrestleMania IX it could have been Razor Ramon going against Bret for the title. Change the Rumble Main Event around and make Razor/Bret at IX if need be.  Or have Perfect win 93 Rumble and go with Perfect-Bret at Mania. 

[Wyld Samurai]

5 hours ago, BurningBeard said:

ON the whole I don't think so, due to the steroid trial and Bret's popularity in Europe he was always destined to get that run.

I think you're right about WMVIII, it would have still been Hogan v Sid on top but I don't know how you get there. I suppose Hogan v Undertaker could go the same leading to the title being held up, then Sid wins by turfing Hogan leading to a slow burn feud and eventual Sid heel turn. But as I mentioned, with the steroid trial I still think Sid was destined to have that turn and disappointingly short run which is a shame as I really think he could have been the face of the company if the stars had aligned.

Looking back, I get the impression Vince really wasn't impressed with what he got with Flair and was happy to be rid of him in the end

According to Bret - Vince didn't "get" Flair. He saw that he did the same thing every night. 

[Matt D]

I have this weird feeling that if they had put the belt on Tito in 92, they would have turned him.

And I'm not just saying that because we unearthed the one heel Tito match in existence. 

[For Great Justice]

Morbid but as we are discussing the Gronk Mania spot as well as the Owen Dark Side episode.

What if Vince demonstrates the Over the Edge spot before the show, as he tended to do, and the worst happens? Who takes over the company? In 1999 neither Stephanie nor HHH are in the picture, Shane didn't want it per reports. Do they sell? 

[evidence]

With "Flair not going to WWF", I wonder how it affects WCW during that same time.  I know the talk was that Flair was to drop the belt to Luger at the 91 Bash before everything fell apart. I wonder if they still try to go with Luger as a heel and do a double turn or if Luger gets the run as the babyface ace of the company.  Do they bring back Steamboat and bring in Rude?  Also with Flair still there, is there even a Dangerous Alliance or a Vader as a top heel? Behind the scenes, I'd have to imagine that Herd ends up lasting a bit longer if he doesn't lose not only Flair but also the World title that ends up on WWF TV.