AEW - AUGUST 2023

[Casey]

People actually expected cable PPV providers to bundle two shows together? lmao. AEW (or WWE if this was about them) doesn’t have a say in anything like that.

Now we’ll have a problem if Bleacher Report doesn’t bundle them together. Well, I won’t, because VPN + FITE.TV, but still.

[Octopus]

I can’t wait for Jericho vs LuFisto 

[Evil Otto]

All this talk about how to fix the women's division, and I can't help going back to one of my main concerns for the past two years or so.  Well, I'm puzzled, really.  Puzzled as to why there aren't women's tag team belts in this company.  It's such a simple way to allow people to have more screen time, especially wrestlers who need further experience.  They had a tag team tournament and everything, and well, that was it, apparently

Marina Shafir and Nyla Rose are an awesome, killer team and instead, each one just comes out on random weeks, puts someone else over, and their second just stands by the apron and does basically nothing.  No storyline development, nothing.  What the fuck is that?  Anna Jay and Tay Melo likely won't be a tag team anytime soon, but they clearly got fans intrigued whenever they teamed up.  They were just right there, ready to go, seemingly forever.  I don't get it.  

You can have TV titles, trios titles, and at this point, there is not one, but two fake (or at least highly disputed) titles on the men's side.  But no tag titles for the women?  Baffling to me.  

Edited August 5, 2023 by Evil Otto

[Dog]

With Jade's reign over, I would totally transition the TBS title into women's tag belts.

[zendragon]

3 hours ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

I think that goes hand and hand though. The less resources you have to devote to everything else means more time to have a singular focus on something else. Look at Joshi, for example. Despite Stardom probably being the most popular, other, smaller, and more niche promotions have probably had a better and more consistent success in booking their talent overall. Also, even though they've had several regime changes since then, Impact has had a track record of being more innovative with their female talent than other promotions years before AEW was even an idea. So they always had that going for them even in the leanest of times. It still takes acumen and skill to get it done so don't get me wrong. However, AEW at this point is going in an entirely different direction in terms of what they want their business to be. We're talking several big money contracts and using that talent to eventually secure a big TV money contract. They have to make the ends justify the means. It doesn't mean forget to feature female talents, however, it's entirely different kettle of fish.

That said, personally, I think whatever improvement is going to come from a variety of solutions. Damn near everyone here has provided something so you know talent backstage are trying to provide those solutions. The question is and probably has been will they be heard? Anytime, you're trying to serve numerous masters, you're going to come up short somewhere. I feel that we shouldn't dismiss that they are being featured in some ways whether you feel it's disingenuous or not. ANYTIME you get a chance to knock out of the park, go for that shit. For example, to have TWO beautiful black women of different complexions (cause god knows I haven't enough about dark skin vs. light skin growing up) and body shapes/sizes like Athena and Willow kill it on PPV and in the main event or damn near close to the main event, you cannot go wrong. They got their shot, and they did the damn thing. I am all for that. GIVE ME MORE! I am also for Shida winning the title to bookend a major AEW TV episode. I don't give a damn if it didn't get the most time. The more you make of those opportunities, the less they can deny you. If we have stubborn folks in power (either in suits or in the C level suites), success has ALWAYS been the greatest equalizer.

Your second paraphrase is really true. AEW has done a very good job of highlighting minorities. Swerve apparently has a feature in XXL magazine, that comes from not treating black culture as a joke. Willow and Athena have distinct none stereotypical personalities.

Darkside of the Ring got me to check out some of their other shows particularly the one on Arsenio Hall , and it shows you how Asian culture is right where black culture was in the 80s and 90s with people not wanting be just the butt of the joke. You see Asian helmed movies doing well and winning awards (crazy rich Asians, parasite, everything everywhere all at once). The ufc gym I go to is in a predominantly Asian community and it was packed for the first Johanna v Zella Wang fight, so Shida standing tall at the end of the big dynamite anniversary show is very forward thinking
 

 

[Curt McGirt]

I tried to find out if the local theater is showing em (I did get to see One Night Stand there yeeeeeears ago) but there weren't listings for something that far off. (However, if I wanted to catch a screening of Sound of Freedom, it's a-waiting! )

[Curt McGirt]

Okay this just popped up on Facebook and cracked me up. 

Spoiler

 

[Elsalvajeloco]

Is Neal Pruitt still doing stuff in wrestling? Cause they really need to add his "the biggest icon in wrestling" sound drop over Cult of Personality.

[Casey]

If anyone was wondering (nobody was) - the latest drama is Kimber Lee getting involved (by quote tweeting a blatant anti-AEW account) and calling MJF a piece of shit - presumably because he defended whatever Rascal it was that had that Hitler ‘stache photo posted online.

[TheVileOne]

13 minutes ago, Casey said:

If anyone was wondering (nobody was) - the latest drama is Kimber Lee getting involved (by quote tweeting a blatant anti-AEW account) and calling MJF a piece of shit - presumably because he defended whatever Rascal it was that had that Hitler ‘stache photo posted online.

That's not really drama.

[John E. Dynamite]

38 minutes ago, Casey said:

If anyone was wondering (nobody was) - the latest drama is Kimber Lee getting involved (by quote tweeting a blatant anti-AEW account) and calling MJF a piece of shit - presumably because he defended whatever Rascal it was that had that Hitler ‘stache photo posted online.

At this point Kimber Lee could everything and it wouldn't anything.

[Shartnado]

12 hours ago, tbarrie said:

Wait, how did you wind up the only wrestling fan in the country a year later? Did you murder the classmates who laughed at you?

Not judging, just curious.

It was just a passing fad over here, when people started suspecting it may not be completely real. Other people moved on to other things, I got on the bandwagon a little bit later than others and was basically the only one who stuck with it at the time. Not literally, obviously. There were other fans scattered across the country, but it sure felt like it at times.

Also, I'm no Swerve, so if some unfortunate tragedy befell some of those classmates (which it didn't) I had nothing to do with any of it and I was nowhere near when it didn't happen.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Shartnado
They just changed schools, probably...

[The Natural]

19 hours ago, The Natural said:

Good question. I like your suggestion of Orange Cassidy vs. Bryan Danielson. Pains me the greatest wrestler of all time is so selfless he won't hold the AEW World Championship. Bryan Danielson vs. Jay White would be a dream match.

 

17 hours ago, LF2 said:

Now see the discussions I get to have (and greatly enjoy) with you are a big part of why I stay here. I love that Danielson is clearly your guy, but you frame your opinions in ways that allow for fun talks. Plus you end up pointing out a match that both of us would consider a dream match (Danielson vs White).

 

16 hours ago, The Natural said:

Thank you. I enjoy conversing with you too. Truly.

 

7 hours ago, LF2 said:

Two things made my entire day today. One was this comment. The other I want to preface with a question for you. Have you ever had the privilege of meeting Bryan Danielson? If you haven’t I’ll keep my fingers crossed that he one day does a signing near you, because today I had the equivalent of that happen for me.

My mom and I were supposed to attend this local event they have yearly here. Well the weather forecast looked so bad yesterday that they cancelled todays events and moved the two concerts they were supposed to have to our local arena and the autograph signing to the arena too. We had VIP tickets so the autograph signing was free, and she knew I didn’t want to miss that for the world. So we ended up standing outside in the rain for about forty five minutes then we waited inside for about the same length so I could meet Kurt Angle. I’m not going to lie or say that someone that takes issue with me a lot is wrong. I truly was a mark when we met Kurt. I had this beautiful 11x14 print that Rob Schamberger had done that I wanted Kurt to sign for me. Instead of playing it cool, and telling him I’d attended three shows where he won world titles (including his first WWF title win over The Rock) I just blurted out how to spell my name as there’s three different ways it could be spelled. Then he asked if I’d like the print personalized so I said yes please Mr. Angle, so he starts writing my name then he inscribes “It’s True!”, his signature, and WWE HOF 2017 He was so careful not to cover any of the print too, and was super nice when my mom asked if he’d take a photo with me. I of course thanked him repeatedly then left smiling like a fool for the next hour or so. 

So if anyone ever says don’t meet your heroes remember that’s not remotely true. Three of my best life experiences have been meeting Kurt, meeting Jeff Jarrett (and having a long sports talk with him at a TNA show years ago), and meeting AJ Styles and getting to joke around with AJ both the first and second time I met him (as he somehow remembered me the second time, and told me he still wanted a damn step ladder to take a photo together as he’s maybe 5’10, and I’m 6’4 and a half). Tomorrow I’ll meet Matt Cardona so I’m hopeful that gets added to my list.

Glad I helped to make your entire day. Kind of you to say. The other part was you meeting Kurt Angle. I've been thinking about you and wondering when. So glad it turned out well meeting one of your favourites as it would be crushing otherwise. Didn't realise you were so talk while I'm a short ass. Please let us know how Matt Cardona turns out. Unfortunately I've never met Bryan Danielson. I'd love to though and appreciate you keeping your fingers crossed that it does. I haven't met much famous people and I'm limited in travelling/standing with the Cerebral Palsy but I've never had a bad experience thankfully. The most famous was Mick Foley who was class, he was the first heel I ever liked and one of my favourite wrestlers ever before meeting him and even more after.

Edited August 5, 2023 by The Natural

[Hail Sabin]

5 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

I tried to find out if the local theater is showing em (I did get to see One Night Stand there yeeeeeears ago) but there weren't listings for something that far off. (However, if I wanted to catch a screening of Sound of Freedom, it's a-waiting! )

For my local Theater it doesn't show up until the week of or like 5 days before. 

[The Natural]

Add PAC to the injured list also.

[Curt McGirt]

5 hours ago, Hail Sabin said:

For my local Theater it doesn't show up until the week of or like 5 days before. 

Well, my dumb ass thought it was this weekend for some reason so that's why I went ahead and checked. Durrr hurrr hurrrr

[twiztor]

17 hours ago, peachchaos said:

Devil's advocate o'er here...is there any great incentive to push the women's division past the fact that its the correct moral thing to do and fwd thinking and all that? 

incentive? you mean like creating stars? generating buzz? increasing income from merch sales? diversifying your audience to accomplish all of the former? 
none of that is some "moral thing to do", it is about improving your bottom line. if you limit your "potential stars" to only male, you're cutting 50% of your options out.

Would this "devil's advocate" position fly if it was about race? "is there any great incentive to push 'the blacks' past that it's the correct moral thing to do and fwd thinking and all that?" that's some really 1980s bullshit.

[Just Dave]

16 hours ago, StevieNippz said:

I've said it before and still think it's worth a shot to make Rampage a show for the women. Have frequent TBS title defenses and get some story development and feuds going. The women's division should still be featured on Dynamite and Collision but ever since Dark/Elevation ended the lack of women's wrestling has really stood out. Nyla/Marina/Taya had a trios match against some jobbers at this week's show and the crowd was going wild so it's apparent there is an audience for it.

 

Edit: Forgot to add more updates on the Tampa show. Big Bill and Brian Cage teamed and got one of the loudest pops all night, the crowd loved Bill! MJF was so over with everyone, I hope they don't blow this with him turning heel. It was unclear when commercials were going on, the show was just nonstop. My free tickets ended up being last row in the rafters but it was still an amazing view. Once I saw how packed that building was I totally understood why they weren't front row here. I imagine they'll be coming to Tampa again sooner rather than later, the crowd was a hundred times hotter than the Ft Myers show last year. 

Idk if I’d give Rampage to the women every single week, but I’d probably do it 2x a month and make it feel like a really big deal. “Rampage: Ladies Night” or however you want to brand it. Hype the shit out of it. Make it clear that your company thinks it’s a big deal. After the inevitable Mercedes signing, put her first televised match on that show. Women’s tag titles, women’s “Blood & Guts,” all of it on the special Rampages. I would also veer from the norm for AEW and have an onscreen authority figure for that format. Tafka AJ Lee would do nicely. Or Madusa. A retired woman with some credibility. Do everything you can to make it stand out.

[John E. Dynamite]

On 8/5/2023 at 10:21 AM, twiztor said:

Would this "devil's advocate" position fly if it was about race? "is there any great incentive to push 'the blacks' past that it's the correct moral thing to do and fwd thinking and all that?" that's some really 1980s bullshit.

You think that's bullshit that stayed in the 80's? I absolutely guarantee you conversations about the value of "chasing the Black dollar" still happen in WWE, previous and current bosses both considered. Roman Reigns' current Universal Championship run is longer than every single major Black championship reign in WWE history combined.

Edited August 6, 2023 by John E. Dynamite

[Just Dave]

Fwiw, that’s not just something that happens in wwe. In my last job I sat in multiple meetings where the question “do we have enough black viewers to make featuring (insert black outfielder’s name here) worth it?”

Pretty disheartening, tbh.

[NoFistsJustFlips]

I like men's wrestling. I like women's wrestling. I like tag team wrestling. I like brawls and spot fests and technical matches. I think wrestling is at it's best when you have the full menu of creativity available to you. So I have always personally been against a women's only show for the same reason I'd be against a tag matches only show. You take away a lot of the creativity and tools in the tool box when you put yourself into such a tightly constrained "booking" box.

And for that reason I'd like to add this thought to the conversation. The tight formatting of Dynamite is the main hindrance here. We're at over 200 episodes where EVERY ONE OF THEM is 6 matches. EVERY ONE OF THEM has only one women's match a week. The ideal booking (to me at least) that alleviates the problem of lack of women's matches is to throw that strict format out the window. Do 10 matches one week. Do 5 matches the next. Don't have a set amount for ANYTHING. Have a 5 match Dynamite that has 3 women's matches one week. Have an 8 match Dynamite the next that may only have 2 women's matches.

Basically if you mix up the formula to the extent you aren't doing the same thing every week, the problem goes away. Fans aren't able to sit there and recognize a pattern for 200 weeks straight where 1/6 matches is a women's match and that women's match more often than not is match 5 out of 6. I have no earthly idea how many women's matches WWE has in a week. And I bet neither do they. Which is why I think you hear about this being an AEW thing and WWE doesn't really get the same flack.

Flexibility and creativity. That's how you fix the way the women are currently booked. You add more variety and let go of the OCD rules you've bound yourself to as the booker. I'm pretty surprised AEW doesn't get more flack for the rigidity of their TV format. I think that's an unspoken reason why Collision seems fresh tho. One week you only have 3 matches because one went an hour. The next you have 7 or 8.

[John from Cincinnati]

On that same tip, I’m a fan of them slowly getting away from announcing damn near everything in advance as they do for most (not all) shows. Only three matches announced tonight. Maybe Punk-Starks go long? Maybe there’s a Miro squash or the Acclaimed segment spins into something more? Maybe Darby is looking for a fight like he was last week? I don’t know everything and sometimes I don’t want to know. Give me the headlines and then let me be surprised once in a while. The pop a surprise Miro squash graphic gets from the live crowd more or less supports that. 

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

5 minutes ago, John from Cincinnati said:

On that same tip, I’m a fan of them slowly getting away from announcing damn near everything in advance as they do for most (not all) shows. Only three matches announced tonight. Maybe Punk-Starks go long? Maybe there’s a Miro squash or the Acclaimed segment spins into something more? Maybe Darby is looking for a fight like he was last week? I don’t know everything and sometimes I don’t want to know. Give me the headlines and then let me be surprised once in a while. The pop a surprise Miro squash graphic gets from the live crowd more or less supports that. 

Heck, do what WCW or Mid-South did and put your main event on first so the fans can be ensured they'll get all their main event, then you have standby matches that aren't announced, if "matches made that day" is "too Attitude era" for some, which it probably will be.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Sparkleface

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

I'm wary of getting too much into this, but how the AEW men's roster is beyond f'n huge and the women's roster is a tiny subset of that in terms of numbers, and frankly in terms of quality. I mean, yeah I take people's point about Purazzo but the fact that Mia Yim is being touted as some big missed opportunity tells me a lot.

I mean, the best wrestlers on the women's roster are generally considered to be Storm & Hayter right? How many of the men's roster are realistically better?

I mean are people really claiming that they are better than Mox, Claudio, OC, Pac, Omega, Allin or Jay White?

And I mean think some of the people I didn't put on that list.

This is what Khan has decided to put together, what he decided he needs. And even if he had the pick of every woman in the world, he just wouldn't be able to put together a comparable roster to that of the men's. 

But even looking past that, Hayter getting over a bit doesn't make her the new Paige, or Sasha, or Charlotte, or Asuka, or Becky, or Bayley, or Rhea, or even Belair. No offence to her, I think she's great and then some - but I think people have to be real about what a TV star really is.

 

[Dolphman 3000]

47 minutes ago, John from Cincinnati said:

Maybe Punk-Starks go long?

I think Steamboat being announced is telegraphing this

45-minute draw on free TV against a major WWE PPV...? Let's go