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Dynamite - TBS Premier Episode - 01/05/2022


Gordlow
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5 minutes ago, Hagan said:

Question: do some of you downgrade a match based on knowing that someone get legitimately injured? Seeing takes that the tag match was a "mess" or was "ruined" because Fenix got injured. I get that logic in that I can see the enjoyment of a match being diminished knowing someone got seriously hurt (no different than any other sport) but I was wondering if people saw an injury as an artistic demerit in match evaluation? 

It can highlight excess if it's related to a big spot. 

It can make a match better or more impressive if someone smartly works through it and adapts. Usually, in that point, I'd think about it more in rating a wrestler than a match. 

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11 hours ago, JLowe said:Some good moments in the match but mostly sloppy and awkward with more than one instance of total miscommunication on what the move sequence was, Jade standing around badly lost once, and multiple rope slips, including what would have been an impressive finisher.

I remember a Jade interview where she very clearly stated top rope was not for her. You could tell that she wasn't comfortable there from the first move so I knew the other attempts would be as bad .

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7 minutes ago, Hagan said:

Question: do some of you downgrade a match based on knowing that someone get legitimately injured? Seeing takes that the tag match was a "mess" or was "ruined" because Fenix got injured. I get that logic in that I can see the enjoyment of a match being diminished knowing someone got seriously hurt (no different than any other sport) but I was wondering if people saw an injury as an artistic demerit in match evaluation? 

I have no idea if I was in the minority or not, but I don't think the tag match was a mess. It was the standard Lucha Bros. match where there is practically no adherence to normal tag rules and it's more of a tornado tag match. That's not everyone's cup of team, but I've just learned to accept it because Penta and Fenix are never going to change.

The injury to Fenix, while gruesome, I don't think took away from the match. For example, HHH's quad rolling up his leg in the Austin/HHH vs Benoit/Jericho match didn't take anything away from that. I don't see why Fenix making his arm double jointed would make the match worse.

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Didn't take away from the match for me, but since it happened pretty much right before the win it did take my attention away a bit. I kept trying to enjoy JB's moment but kept think "Poor Fenix, all these guys must be so worried right now". So kinda takes away a bit from the moment but not from the match quality itself.

Edited by eikerir
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1 minute ago, eikerir said:

Didn't takw away from the match for me, but since it happened pretty much right before the win it did take my attention away a bit. I kept trying to enjoy JB's moment but kept think "Poor Fenix, all these guys must be so worried right now". So kinda takes away a bit from the moment but not from the match quality itself.

Yes. Exactly this. 

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They replayed the table bump twice without anyone in the truck realising it was grotesque injury footage. I don't think Penta clicked at first, he went from arguing with the ref that he shouldn't have lost, to "Oh shit my brother is hurt" very suddenly. Once he realised that the screaming from ringside wasn't a very excited Jungle Boy fan.

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14 minutes ago, AxB said:

They replayed the table bump twice without anyone in the truck realising it was grotesque injury footage. I don't think Penta clicked at first, he went from arguing with the ref that he shouldn't have lost, to "Oh shit my brother is hurt" very suddenly. Once he realised that the screaming from ringside wasn't a very excited Jungle Boy fan.

This. I'm guessing production didn't spot the severity of it. I've seen people say they missed it until the replays. AEW pulled a tweet with the injury and on the YouTube channel, blur out Fenix after he's gone through the table. I think ITV4 will do the same or cut to a crowd shot. A ghastly injury.

Edited by The Natural
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I didn’t even notice it when it happened, and when somebody reposted it in gif format with a barf emoji. I thought they were just upset about the title change. I definitely got it on the third viewing.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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2 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

I didn’t even notice it when it happened, and when somebody reposted it in gif format with a barf emoji. I thought they were just upset about the title change. I definitely got it on the third viewing.

One of the worst injuries I've seen watching live. Uriah Hall checking Chris Weidman's leg kick at UFC 261 last year was the worst. Get well soon, Rey Fenix.

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Guest Jimbo_Tsuruta
40 minutes ago, Hagan said:

Question: do some of you downgrade a match based on knowing that someone get legitimately injured? Seeing takes that the tag match was a "mess" or was "ruined" because Fenix got injured. I get that logic in that I can see the enjoyment of a match being diminished knowing someone got seriously hurt (no different than any other sport) but I was wondering if people saw an injury as an artistic demerit in match evaluation? 

Knowing what happened to Shibata afterwards does make me feel queasy watching it again but I still rate his 4/9/17 match against Okada as one of the best modern Japanese bouts.

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Just now, Jimbo_Tsuruta said:

Knowing what happened to Shibata afterwards does make me feel queasy watching it again but I still rate his 4/9/17 match against Okada as one of the best modern Japanese bouts.

That's the best example. I gave Kazuchika Okada vs. Katsuyori Shibata from NJPW Sakura Genesis 2017 ***** even though I hated the headbutt, still do. I wasn't sure at the time whether to go the full five for it.

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So, good news, relatively speaking:

I didn't notice the injury live and unless I had seen a bunch of people post "OMG Fenix's arm" on twitter I might not have noticed on the replay.

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19 minutes ago, Jimbo_Tsuruta said:

Knowing what happened to Shibata afterwards does make me feel queasy watching it again but I still rate his 4/9/17 match against Okada as one of the best modern Japanese bouts.

Better than Kenny v Okada

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3 minutes ago, Zimbra said:

So, good news, relatively speaking:

I didn't notice the injury live and unless I had seen a bunch of people post "OMG Fenix's arm" on twitter I might not have noticed on the replay.

No way.  The human body is miraculous.

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9 minutes ago, Zimbra said:

So, good news, relatively speaking:

I didn't notice the injury live and unless I had seen a bunch of people post "OMG Fenix's arm" on twitter I might not have noticed on the replay.

Thanks for posting an update. Amazed there's no break to go with the dislocation. How long will Rey Fenix be out for? Any ideas?

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Just now, The Natural said:

Thanks for posting an update. Amazed there's no break to go with the dislocation. How long will Rey Fenix be out for? Any ideas?

It'll depend on what kind of damage there is to the tendons and ligaments.  If nothing tore or ruptured and it doesn't require surgery he could theoretically be back in a couple of months.  

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I Like the Lucha Bros, but I hope Fenix takes some time to heal. It seems like they can't go more than a match or two without him getting hurt. Take a few months. AEW isn't going anywhere.

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Faye Jackson dislocated her elbow and retired. Had problems with basic mobility for months, never mind any kind of load bearing exercise.

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So if he can move his arm and use that hand, he’ll be back in a few weeks or something absurd or possibly ill advised?

In baseball, if someone is hit by a pitch on the elbow, there’s less of a risk of broken bones than if they’re hit by a pitch on the wrist. Would the same be true for risk of suddenly tearing various things in the elbow vs suddenly tearing various things in the wrist?

If there are some things messed up in the elbow, it’ll impact his ability to use that hand too. But have any wrestlers ever had to get Tommy John Surgery (to replace the UCL in the elbow)?

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3 minutes ago, just drew said:

I Like the Lucha Bros, but I hope Fenix takes some time to heal. It seems like they can't go more than a match or two without him getting hurt. Take a few months. AEW isn't going anywhere.

But it’s the Lucha Bros. They book 10 dates a week in Mexico. All Luchadors who are considered a hot commodity, barely stop. To get into a position like this takes years in that country, and as long as they can breathe, they’ll never give up being always in demand.

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5 minutes ago, Cobra Commander said:

So if he can move his arm and use that hand, he’ll be back in a few weeks or something absurd or possibly ill advised?

In baseball, if someone is hit by a pitch on the elbow, there’s less of a risk of broken bones than if they’re hit by a pitch on the wrist. Would the same be true for risk of suddenly tearing various things in the elbow vs suddenly tearing various things in the wrist?

If there are some things messed up in the elbow, it’ll impact his ability to use that hand too. But have any wrestlers ever had to get Tommy John Surgery (to replace the UCL in the elbow)?

I doubt any of them would be patient enough or have sufficient resources to stay on the shelf for 12-18 months.

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I’m sure they are being paid well by AEW, but think about it. They are getting a full-time deal by a major North American promotion, and are allowed to work a lucha superstar schedule. That’s a lot of money to give up.

I’ve seen a lucha show that had LA Park’s kid teaming up with him, against the Wagner’s. Thing was, it obviously wasn’t LA Park, it was most likely some guy his son got so they made the same amount of money if he actually had been there, then split part of it with that dude.

Edited by LoneWolf&Subs
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