AEW - JUNE 2023

[Technico Support]

3 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

Like Sarge and his stolen Valor. 

I worked at a conservative talk radio station in Baltimore in the late 90s and one of the show hosts constantly crowed about exposing Sgt. Slaughter.  Was that a thing to be proud of?  To me, that was like bragging about exposing Mark Callaway for not really being an undead mortician.  Like yeah, no shit.

[odessasteps]

To some folks, the fact that Bob Remus makes it sound he really was a Marine, not just "Sgt Slaughter", it's a touchy situation. Not me, mind you, but others. 

[Elsalvajeloco]

1 hour ago, odessasteps said:

Like Sarge and his stolen Valor. 

 

1 hour ago, odessasteps said:

To some folks, the fact that Bob Remus makes it sound he really was a Marine, not just "Sgt Slaughter", it's a touchy situation. Not me, mind you, but others. 

You answered your own question!

Yeah, that's totally different. Mark Callaway isn't claiming to be actually dead or making old timey caskets. And to be fair, it took him like 3 whole months to make one casket. Shoddy operation if you ask me.

Not to point fingers, but a certain Wendy's devouring, burger joint afficionado in Louisville and others have let Dax to believe he is a legit throwback to olden days and much different than the flippity doo wrestlers.

Also, if you been wrestling for 15 plus years at this point (especially since the early 2000s is when wrestlers were intaking Somas like M&Ms), there have enough generations between you and when you first started. Shit, Bret Hart is only three years younger than Roddy Piper. No one considers those two of the same generation. Matter of fact, Bret was the leader of the New Generation while Piper was considered an old man. Hell, Nash was 35 when he won the WWF title. Age and experience is relative in pro wrestling.

[twiztor]

so Willow is the NJPW Strong Women's champion. is that NJPW's main female title? does New Japan still partner with a joshi promotion? is/was that independent or connected to them? what's the correlation between all this? explain it to me as if i've never followed puro.

[Casey]

39 minutes ago, twiztor said:

so Willow is the NJPW Strong Women's champion. is that NJPW's main female title? does New Japan still partner with a joshi promotion? is/was that independent or connected to them? what's the correlation between all this? explain it to me as if i've never followed puro.

Think of it like the IWGP Women’s title is their main one in Japan, and the STRONG Women’s title is their main one everywhere else they would run (most likely, but it’s definitely the case in America).

New Japan doesn’t partner with Stardom as much as they’re both owned by the same company (Bushiroad) so there’s a small bit of crossover there sometimes.

I’m still not sure why they had Mayu beat Mercedes for the title and then create the STRONG title. Mayu wanting more money to travel overseas? Mercedes appearances with Stardom running out? New Japan wanting a strong female draw on their American cards, but Stardom wanting to keep Mayu happy? I don’t know. There’s a few posters here that might know better, like @Eivion or @Raziel or maybe @Sparkleface? 

[Elsalvajeloco]

Supposedly, Mayu was rumored to be the first IWGP champion and contractual issues supposedly kept that from happening. Anyway, the belt found its way to her in a matter of months.

[Eivion]

44 minutes ago, Casey said:

I’m still not sure why they had Mayu beat Mercedes for the title and then create the STRONG title. Mayu wanting more money to travel overseas? Mercedes appearances with Stardom running out? New Japan wanting a strong female draw on their American cards, but Stardom wanting to keep Mayu happy? I don’t know. There’s a few posters here that might know better, like @Eivion or @Raziel or maybe @Sparkleface? 

No one really knows. The IWGP Women's belt doesn't even make sense as it is with NJPW having no women's division, let alone the STRONG title. In general its likely both were created partially with Mercedes in mind to help with US attendance for shows but with no real long term plans beyond that. Basically I'm pretty sure they are just making it up as they gp along with plans regularly changing. If I were to guess the main title got left in Japan mostly to lessen future changes to Stardom's own plans after the initial creation of the title likely threw things off a good bit. Mayu has no issues traveling or working overseas. Stardom just needs to not be doing any important shows while it happens. 

11 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Supposedly, Mayu was rumored to be the first IWGP champion and contractual issues supposedly kept that from happening. Anyway, the belt found its way to her in a matter of months.

I have never really bought those contract issue rumors. Rossy and Kidani are seemingly the ones still negotiating those, and Mayu is too close to the former to want to cause trouble. Unless it was a case of them needing to talk her into sticking around longer before retirement this one just never made sense. Besides it clear NJPW wanted the belt on Mercedes first, but she wasn't available as soon as they hoped. 

Edited June 25, 2023 by Eivion

[odessasteps]

2 hours ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

 

You answered your own question!

Yeah, that's totally different. Mark Callaway isn't claiming to be actually dead or making old timey caskets. And to be fair, it took him like 3 whole months to make one casket. Shoddy operation if you ask me.

Not to point fingers, but a certain Wendy's devouring, burger joint afficionado in Louisville and others have let Dax to believe he is a legit throwback to olden days and much different than the flippity doo wrestlers.

Also, if you been wrestling for 15 plus years at this point (especially since the early 2000s is when wrestlers were intaking Somas like M&Ms), there have enough generations between you and when you first started. Shit, Bret Hart is only three years younger than Roddy Piper. No one considers those two of the same generation. Matter of fact, Bret was the leader of the New Generation while Piper was considered an old man. Hell, Nash was 35 when he won the WWF title. Age and experience is relative in pro wrestling.

Listening to BTS this week, when the Fantastics had their match on WWF tv in 1997 for the light heavyweight belt, those old guys were like 34 or 35, younger than a lot of the main wwe talent these days, let alone the whole thing how Sting is working at 60-whatever now. 

[Elsalvajeloco]

Just now, Eivion said:

No one really knows. The IWGP Women's belt doesn't even make sense as it is with NJPW having no women's division, let alone the STRONG title. In general its likely both were created partially with Mercedes in mind to help with US attendance for shows but with no real long term plans beyond that. Basically I'm pretty sure they are just making it up as they with plans regularly changing. If I were to guess the main title got left in Japan mostly to lessen future changes to Stardom's own plans after the initial creation of the title likely threw things off a good bit. Mayu has no issues traveling or working overseas. Stardom just needs to not be doing any important shows while it happens. 

Does the Stardom schedule even line up to allow semi regular participation in New Japan? They had a house show when New Japan was doing Dontaku in Fukuoka. They were running Korakuen the same day New Japan had Dominion. They obviously wouldn't be on the BOSJ shows or G1 shows (at best, maybe the G1 Finals). That's rough when you just start the division. That's up there with Madusa winning the WWF title in late 1993 and doesn't have a televised match on Raw until the summer of 1994. 

19 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I have never really bought those contract issue rumors. Rossy and Kidani are seemingly the ones still negotiating those, and Mayu is too close to the former to want to cause trouble. Unless it was a case of them needing to talk her into sticking around longer before retirement this one just never made sense. Besides it clear NJPW wanted the belt on Mercedes first, but she wasn't available as soon as they hoped. 

I could definitely see trying to get the rub of having two former WWE stars hold the belt first especially if you have no guarantees of them being around. Iwatani isn't really going anywhere (as opposed to Mercedes for example who would probably be in AEW right now had she not gotten hurt), and she's super dependable as a worker.

[Elsalvajeloco]

7 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

Listening to BTS this week, when the Fantastics had their match on WWF tv in 1997 for the light heavyweight belt, those old guys were like 34 or 35, younger than a lot of the main wwe talent these days, let alone the whole thing how Sting is working at 60-whatever now. 

Dude, Tracy Smothers was considered like aged by 1996. He was 33 going on 34. He had just been around since he was 19 or 20.  

Shit, Orange Cassidy is damn near 40. However, for some reason, he's considered one of the younger talent cause his first real national exposure was a few years ago.

[Eivion]

15 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Does the Stardom schedule even line up to allow semi regular participation in New Japan? They had a house show when New Japan was doing Dontaku in Fukuoka. They were running Korakuen the same day New Japan had Dominion. They obviously wouldn't be on the BOSJ shows or G1 shows (at best, maybe the G1 Finals). That's rough when you just start the division. That's up there with Madusa winning the WWF title in late 1993 and doesn't have a televised match on Raw until the summer of 1994. 

They tour nearly as much as NJPW. They can let people miss smaller shows, but they are definitely working the same time NJPW does at least half the time. I think they avoid major shows happening on the same day.

[Elsalvajeloco]

3 minutes ago, Eivion said:

They tour nearly as much as NJPW. They can let people miss smaller shows, but they are definitely working the same time NJPW does at least half the time. I think they avoid major shows happening on the same day.

That's what would make it tough to participate in AEW. They would need to be totally off tour cause realistically and logistically, you need to block off a minimal of three days. One day to travel, a day to do said show, and at least one day to travel back. That's three shows you're potentially missing. 

I think that's what killed any further involvement of the AJW and freelance talent in WWF and put the nail in the coffin for the women's division altogether back in 1995. If you're freelance you probably have an opening, but AJW was doing like 40-45 shows per tour.

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

11 hours ago, Eivion said:

They tour nearly as much as NJPW. They can let people miss smaller shows, but they are definitely working the same time NJPW does at least half the time. I think they avoid major shows happening on the same day.

Stardom's not really in a position where their bigger stars can miss even those smaller shows. Like yes, Kaori Yoneyama can miss a few shows to go run YMZ or do some freelance work and I don't think anyone would be too bothered, but if Tam Nakano misses a week because she went to the States, that might rub some fans the wrong way. This is especially true when Stardom is trying to be a promotion that can draw outside of Tokyo and Osaka. You need all your talent when you're running towns outside of the larger prefectures because they're still drawing anywhere from 200-500 there. The people that would be used for draws on American shows for NJPW Strong would also be the ones needed for those smaller shows, and one of those puts more money directly into Stardom's bank account.

[Eivion]

4 hours ago, Sparkleface said:

Stardom's not really in a position where their bigger stars can miss even those smaller shows. Like yes, Kaori Yoneyama can miss a few shows to go run YMZ or do some freelance work and I don't think anyone would be too bothered, but if Tam Nakano misses a week because she went to the States, that might rub some fans the wrong way. This is especially true when Stardom is trying to be a promotion that can draw outside of Tokyo and Osaka. You need all your talent when you're running towns outside of the larger prefectures because they're still drawing anywhere from 200-500 there. The people that would be used for draws on American shows for NJPW Strong would also be the ones needed for those smaller shows, and one of those puts more money directly into Stardom's bank account.

And of course as we are discussing all of this Giulia just threw out a challenge for the STRONG title. I assume Willow is either going to Japan or they found a small enough show that they can afford to have someone like Giulia off of it. She and Tam were the two I figured just would not happen at this point. 

Edited June 25, 2023 by Eivion

[Ace]

NJ Strong is doing shows at Korakuen in  a couple weeks. I assume it happens there.

 

[Elsalvajeloco]

2 hours ago, Eivion said:

And of course as we are discussing all of this Giulia just threw out a challenge for the STRONG title. I assume Willow is either going to Japan or they found a small enough show that they can afford to have someone like Giulia off of it. She and Tam were the two I figured just would not happen at this point. 

For reference (also poor Momo )

DON'T DO THIS TO ME, WOMAN!

[Greggulator]

I have been watching a ton of original 90210 lately and man there is so much money to be made if the new heel Jungle Boy does a Dylan McKay tribute act — especially in the era I am at now where he is a pained rich boy. Or I would love it if he were to interject himself when other heels whine and he interjects by saying “Hey man, I’ve been there” or asking for people’s keys believing them to be drunk. 

Do it TK or HMU since you are probably reading the e-fed I am in.

[Kevin Wilson]

Watching PPVs with my brother is always fun as while he is a big AEW fan he isn't an 'online' fan so his takes are less influenced by whatever the Internet is bad about any given day. I do agree with him that I hope TK isn't too.... obsessed with the current "four pillars." It was a fun thing to mention to build up to their match but our hope is that was all it was and he isn't going to try to force it into being a thing forever. There is certainly something appealing about being "homegrown" talent but at the end of the day its an entertainment business and you have to go with the flow.

So if I was TK, I'd probably send most of the pillars back to the midcard/upper midcard to hone their craft and focus more on elevating Starks, White, Robinson, and Hobbs. I think all of them have shown more upside, doesn't mean I think Sammy/Darby/Perry should be cast aside and forgotten but they should just phase out the 'pillars' thing and let it go naturally. Starks in particular they need to stop messing around and get him going.

[Dolfan in NYC]

Under the radar (sort of) announcement from last night, 

All Out will be September 3rd  (Labor Day weekend) in Chicago @ The United Center (!)  
And, yes, All In is a week before, so the rest of the summer is gonna be interesting. 

[Casey]

Just now, Dolfan in NYC said:

Under the radar (sort of) announcement from last night, 

All Out will be September 3rd  (Labor Day weekend) in Chicago @ The United Center (!)  
And, yes, All In is a week before, so the rest of the summer is gonna be interesting. 

they’re running Chicago that entire week: Dynamite/Rampage at the NOW Arena, Collision/All Out at the United Center.

[evidence]

13 hours ago, Kevin Wilson said:

 Starks in particular they need to stop messing around and get him going.

I'm not with the WWE method of having 2 of whatever gimmick match (Elimination Chamber, Hell In The Cell) their PPV is named after so both can have one but I wouldn't mind having a 2nd Blood & Guts (since we are definitely going to get Elite vs BCC) with Punk/Starks/FTR vs White/Robinson/Guns (or 2 other people in their place) with Starks getting the big win for his team. 

 

If they're trying to keep White strong for Punk, then a Starks vs Christian/Luchasaurus feud for the TNT Title would be the best option, and much better than Wardlow going for the belt again just to lose it a month or two later. 

Edited June 27, 2023 by evidence

[Elsalvajeloco]

5 hours ago, Casey said:

they’re running Chicago that entire week: Dynamite/Rampage at the NOW Arena, Collision/All Out at the United Center.

Some people who have never been to Chicago before are going to be surprised how far the former Sears Centre is from actual Chicago.

[HumanChessgame]

Eddie Kingston interview where he mentions the alleged backstage drama surrounding Punk's return among other things.

He did it his way and that’s the way wanted to do it. I expected it. I knew it was happening, knowing Punk and what he thought was right for him. That’s it. I see the reports. I see the clickbait on YouTube. But the locker room is not divided, not the people I hang out with. Punk’s gonna do what Punk does and if whatever Punk does helps this company, no one can say anything.   

Q: So there hasn’t been this feeling in the locker room that things that he’s said have bothered at least a large portion of it?

A: Not me, man. Not my crew of people I hang out with. Maybe there’s that one percent that are bothered but the people I chill with, they’re good. They don’t care. 

[Casey]

3 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

Eddie Kingston interview where he mentions the alleged backstage drama surrounding Punk's return among other things.

He did it his way and that’s the way wanted to do it. I expected it. I knew it was happening, knowing Punk and what he thought was right for him. That’s it. I see the reports. I see the clickbait on YouTube. But the locker room is not divided, not the people I hang out with. Punk’s gonna do what Punk does and if whatever Punk does helps this company, no one can say anything.   

Q: So there hasn’t been this feeling in the locker room that things that he’s said have bothered at least a large portion of it?

A: Not me, man. Not my crew of people I hang out with. Maybe there’s that one percent that are bothered but the people I chill with, they’re good. They don’t care. 

Guess who walked back their “locker room is very decisive right now” report a day after this quote came out?

[Octopus]

3 hours ago, Casey said:

Guess who walked back their “locker room is very decisive right now” report a day after this quote came out?