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I'm not gonna tag anyone but I'm begging yall to stop casually dropping slurs just because Kevin Nash did 20 years ago. It's 2022, midget is not an acceptable term anymore. If Kevin Nash made a race joke or sexuality joke 20 years ago about a group of wrestlers would you guys be riffing off of those too? Not only is it super fucking demeaning in the context you're using it, but you're essentially calling a bunch of wrestlers physically disabled as if it's "gross" to be physically disabled or something. If you think Kyle O'Riely is boring, then just fucking say he's boring.

I think last night kinda showed that the Hangman reign is working as intended. He's just "noble, fighting babyface champion" taking on the heels. It's so contrary to how a lot of world champions are booked where someone like Roman is THE central point of the show to the point that him holding the belt up and posing is like the most pushed part of it. I'm not knocking Reigns or anything for that, either. Page kinda has that Bret Hart vibe going right now.

In terms of whether Punk is dumb for not seeing through MJF, you have to look at it through Punk the character’s eyes. Again, going back to 2003: Punk’s origin story is that he was hurt kid who was let down by someone important to him and grew up to be an adult who hurt others in return. So, when he hears MJF’s story, he’s hearing his own story all over again, except he’s the villain who let a hurt kid down. That shit touches something deep inside a person, and it makes perfect sense that the emotional side of Punk really just wants to give MJF a hug, even as there is still the rationale side of his brain questioning whether MJF can be believed. A+ psychological storytelling.

God Bless CRZ unretiring for a second to do this Thread

Re: MJF Promo So, as the only Jewish kid in a 97% Irish Boston suburb who had coins thrown at him at elementary school (which was not necessarily a scarring moment; at the time it was more of a confusing one), I'm not entirely sure what to make of this. I imagine it made some people feel seen, which is always a good thing. It feels real because it is. There are receipts, as we've seen. It feels like a villain origin story for MJF which you don't always see in wrestling, but then there's a reason why you don't always see that in wrestling. I'm not saying nuance doesn't draw but... We're on the precipice of a dog collar match. The idea is to mimic Valentine vs Piper. Bloody, straightforward revenge where the hero finally gets the villain who's been dodging him. Visceral and violent, and I'm not entirely sure I want to even see the match after that promo. I get there's an offramp here where Punk shows mercy and MJF takes advantage of that, not even in that he was luring him in just that it's too late and the damage is done and maybe that opens a door for a face turn in a year or two or something, but MJF's whole act is that he's the worst of the worst, that he's not a sympathetic heel in the least and this shattered it. I'd say they have a plan and to wait for it play out, but the track record on that in wrestling in general isn't all that great. Wrestling making you feel conflicted is strange territory considering the story can't get to a logical end point and has to keep going on forever.

We might finally get the tag team reunion in AEW that so many have been clamoring for....

Sure, fine, whatever, Regal. The answer is Regal.

Remember in 2014 when Cesaro won the Andre Battle Royal as part of WM 30 and it felt like we were getting a company that would be focusing on a new vanguard of stars? Legit feels like more than eight years ago. Reigns is the only newer talent from that show that they've capitalized on, and I think capitalized is a stretch considering that he's sub-Nash as a draw or pop culture media presence.

PWInsider says Cesaro has left WWE after his contract expired.

Re: the anti-Semitic part of the angle While MJF has shown that there isn’t much he won’t do for heat, it seems like his Jewish identity is important to him IRL, and I think he’s even talked about facing anti-Semitism in the past. So my instinct is that he wouldn’t trivialize it by doing an angle where he lies about it. People believing anti-Semitism isn’t real is actually a real problem, and we don’t need pro wrestling angles that play into that with wrestling’s most-prominent (?) outwardly Jewish character. I’m choosing to believe that everyone involved, especially MJF, is smart enough to realize that.

I had forgotten that and now I’m very angry that I now have to remember again.

Fuck, man. Wrestling is so much fun right now.

I am already looking forward to seeing Orange Cassidy taking a giant swing, with his sunglasses on, relaxed and enjoying it.

I'm just gonna open this post with the fact that I fist-bumped Dustin Rhodes. Saw him coming out of the media box when I was getting back to my seat during Dark. No one below us noticed and I didn't wanna blow up his spot, so we just silently bumped and kept walking. I like to think he was appreciative of that - but what a freakin' cool moment! Also accidentally made eye contact with Mox through a partition while in the bathroom line, and Kip was running around doing his thing all night. I haven't watched it back yet, but this crowd was loud as hell in person . The reactions for Hangman and Kingston actually rivaled anyone else I've seen in this arena in the 20 years it's been open - Hogan, Flair, Michaels, Rock, Foley, Taker, HHH, you name em. Without a doubt though, we came most unglued for Kingston. I mean, people were next-level rabid for that guy. He was just as over here as in NYC, maybe more. Really hope it came across on TV. MJF's promo was really great - I'm looking forward to seeing how the announcers sell it, because the feeling in the building was that we weren't buying it. Nothing but big Punk chants. It was really awesome to see Punk here for the first time since 2012 and Jericho since 2002! The guys in front of me were going nuts for Jericho. One of em just kept yelling "MOUNT RUSHMORE!!" Rampage, I won't spoil, but definitely watch for Sammy/Andrade. Great match. A minor spoiler below Great night. Arena was probably 80-85% full. Just a few light spots on the hard cam side. But definitely way more people than the last WWE card I attended here in '15 or '16, and probably 10x as loud. I really, really hope they make it a regular stop.

What's weirding me out is the number of people who are asking questions like "what if MJF's big sob story is fake?". No, it really, really obviously isn't. The antisemitic bullying has come up in quite a few other other interviews, including several featured on AEW programming. I don't think it's a stretch to assume Max takes his identity far too seriously to trivialize it as a fictional heel tactic. I don't think CM Punk is the kind of guy to sign off on that kind of storytelling. It's an idiotic PR move between the last two guys who would do it, and there's evidence out there per the photo & the decade-old social media posts that the rest of his story holds up. There's a trick a lot of the world's best talkers use, it's using real life events that really hurt them in their promos in order to present authentic emotions. The most basic terminology for this in theater is "inside-out acting", in which the actor believes the truth of the character lies inside their own personality and experiences and it's on them to to find it and bring it out, vs. "outside-in" acting where the actor allows the character's beliefs and behaviors to affect them personally so they can better portray them (Nikita Koloff learning Russian, for example). Both methods can be useful, both can be bullshit, but because pro-wrestling so often has one foot in reality. because the characters wrestlers portray are so often extensions of themselves, you see a whole different kind of the outside-in method. You see it a ton. Wrestling is weird. Some people are very good at this (Kingston). Some are quite bad (what's-his-name). There's absolutely reasons to believe it can be in bad taste (MJF using real antisemitism to contextualize a fake match being a valid argument), or that there are negative psychological consequences from turning your real life trauma into revenue-generating mass entertainment (see: most wrestlers). But do I think outspokenly proud Jew Max Friedman and I-wear-pro-choice-shirts-on-live-TV-in-Texas Phil Brooks are working an angle where Max falsely claims bullies threw coins at him? Not in a million fucking years.

I'm kinda slow, it took me a while, but I figured out that Bryan Danielson's character right now is more or less Magneto. It makes too much sense now I can't unsee it. He is the pied piper of a dark and violent path......

Blink twice if Arn is currently pointing a gun at your head making you type this.

I think it adds some new wrinkles to MJF as a character, and I’m not sure what kind of message it sends if he’s supposed to have been lying. It’s much more interesting if the moral lesson at the heart of it is that becoming embittered and cruel because of pain from your past is self defeating, and it doesn’t justify hurting people. It kind of plays into Mox’s comeback promo about not being able to drop defense mechanisms even long after what hurt you is behind you.

I don't want to assume every person in Texas is a piece of shit, so I'll just say fuck Greg Abbot and fuck anyone who voted for him.

Watched the MJF promo again. I love how it really poked at Punk leaving in 2014 at a level we haven't touched yet. There've already been hits at that topic from Kingston and MJF. But taking it from the angle of here's this young guy who Punk meant a lot to, who was maybe wounded and shaped by it, who's injecting the issue with some really shitty formative experiences... and that guy also happens to be the smuggest, most entitled brat heel in the company... and he's playing it completely straight and sympathetic? So many good ingredients in this soup. And Punk, who's been playing it righteous this whole time (and rightfully so) about his leaving, is both questioning the sincerity of this guy and probably at the same time examining the effect he may have had on this kid? Goodgoodgood. I don't want to know where the truth stops and the fiction starts. I'm just happy there's stuff like this on TV. I'm was already getting Revolution primarily for this match, and now my hype is on another level. And all credit to Max, who I've been hot and cold on this whole time but who's definitely had his moments. I've found myself sometimes rolling my eyes at him as putting on a show and playing heel way too hard sometimes rather than being one, but also recognize the utility of a guy who's willing to go for it hard. But him having this within him is a whole different level. Beyond impressed. And my perceptions of him "playing heel" can be read retroactively as him always actively papering over this guy, so all the better -- even if he's being manipulative. To my absolute surprise, I think my second most anticipated Revolution match is Kingston-Jericho. Give me the big issues with big personalities, yes please. Helps that they're finally leaning into it with Jericho and Eddie continues to force the issue.

Oh you didn't know?

Let’s just hope Claudio has no desire to control his narrative.

With war breaking out and no can't miss match main eventer advertised. Seems to be no rhyme or reason to it.

Good for Claudio Castagnoli standing up for himself and being willing to walk away. The man has literally given nothing but the best years of his life and career to WWE, was always the company man, busted his ass, and given bullshit Vince McMahon "not grabbing the brass ring" nonsense. Literally squandered all of his momentum after WrestleMania 30. Shameful.

Claudio is one my favorite guys of the last 20 years, and I’d kill to see the best base in US wrestling this century work with Dante Martin.

Jade/Bunny was another good match during Jade's "I'm building the plane while flying it" reign.

Either MJF's mom is in on the angle or those Sunday night dinners are about to get even more awkward.

So many grown men in goth phases.

Time for a remix

Nyla Rose is great on twitter.

"What's a babyface?" is the best promo ad-lib in AEW history.

Cesaro is out of WWE!!!! FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!! The pop inside my head:

My dad recognized Nash from "the Longest Yard" remake when I was watching the Kliq documentary a few weeks ago. Popped me pretty hard.

Nah. More Magnum TA.

Just saw SRS report the same. Any promotion that can sign him absolutely must. He's one of a handful of guys from WWE that I truly, genuinely miss watching

Not to make it about myself more, but I didn't totally love that they set up the crowd to be in a position to boo the specifics of MJF's story either. You can only blame them so much for booing because of who MJF is and everything he's done and because they almost put the fans in a tricky situation on purpose to achieve an emotional output for Punk to play off of, but it inspired some pretty uncomfortable feelings for me to hear the words he was saying booed so severely. (Which yes, is bs that WWE does with their minority characters all the time, but generally not in so heartfelt a way).

The round face guy from 2.0 looks so much like Nasty Boy Knobbs that I keep expecting him to say "nasty-ized!" At the end of a promo.

Can't unsee.

Just finished watching (VCU had to beat Mason) and add me to the I Hate Battle Royals But Give Me MOTHERFUCKING FTR AND REDRAGON 100 TIMES contingent. THAT WAS FUCKING AWESOME. So Bryan Danielson is the best wrestler in AEW BUT is Allie the Bunny the second best wrestler in AEW? THAT was how you carry a green gal and they had actual credible nearfall. Jade Cargill is now right in the middle of all women wrestlers. Garcia/Danielson was fucking epic. That was Pillman vs Flair. The crowd was freaking out over Buddy Matthews, which is cool but strange, because I've only seen one of his matches, but he is instantly over. That was cool. Add me to the House of Black/Death Triangle feud enthusiasts. You knew 10 wasn't winning when he didn't hit a sky high beel maneuver. Oh yeah, GIVE ME HOBBS VS KEITH LEE. YAY! AEW RULES!

Now let’s talk about the utter cringe that is Penta Oscuro and Abrahantes dressed as a ghoul.

So much panic over last week's numbers for nothing. The numbers pendulum as they tend to do. Has anyone forgotten that Nielsen is a sampling? It's pure estimates at the end of the day. It is not a good system, but it's a system that continues to get used because it's all we have. The greater worry would be if they drop and continue to drop and never go back up. Even with the drops last week, AEW was still No. 3 in the cable TV ratings. So it's not like the show did awful numbers.

So many interesting takes on this promo. Also, kudos to @Matt D per usual. My Jewish lady friend, who really likes young Max, keeps an eye on him in part because he does play into some lightly questionable Jewish stereotypes. The most recent example being Max's greedy scheming over getting paid by Andrade - the FTR angle. She wasn't watching last night, but I did cringe a little with her in mind - mostly for the worry of where it might end up. That said, again, for any worries or shortcomings, I thought it was an ambitious and well executed promo. I also get the crowd that says 'this doesn't make me want to see a bloody match now'. But... there's some time to go before we reach the Revolution. Time will tell. Trusting these two with this kind of sensitive material certainly seems fair.

I desperately wanna see Claudio team with John Silver, and have them both do their big "run around and hit everybody with a move in rapid succession" spots.

I think that's a bit off the mark. Reigns is "the man" in the most profitable era in WWE history. And was also in a Fast & Furious movie with The Rock. Nash was "the man" during the lowest money drawing era in the history of WWE. He was not in a Fast & Furious movie with The Rock. While Nash was part of the nWo during the hottest period of the business, he was never really a pop culture guy at all. What media presence did Nash have? Regis & Kathy, just like every other WWE champion? I think Reigns has surpassed that. He does a lot of media and make a wish stuff. Definitely not Cena / Austin / Hogan / Rock pop culture level. But definitely bigger in pop culture than Bret Hart / Shawn Michaels / Kevin Nash. Those are big deals in the wrestling bubble. But hardly any pop culture presence at all.

At first I was like: “Oh goodie! A battle royal from the people that brought you the battle royal at All In”. Then I was like: “No battle royal has lived up to that one since”. THEN I was like: “This battle royal is ok. Just not my favorite one”. Good promos tonight across the board. AmDrag on my screen flexing and clamping fools is my mana. More. More! MORE!!! Really great pop for Hangman coming out. I worry sometimes how over he is. But he always seems to get by. Love that I’m set up for Rampage and next weeks show. AEW does the work.

He looks like a Giambi brother. Weirds me out.

Everytime someone uses the term "vanilla midget", Kevin Nash should blow out a knee. I have strong opinions about former WWF/WCW/WWE Champion Terry Bollea which you should PM me about. But I wanted to express them here too because I can't help myself and Fuck Shawn Michaels on this board. Fuck Kevin Nash should be right there with them.

Considering how many lengthy talking segments this Punk-Max feud has had (not a complaint, just an observation; it's Punk and MJF, of course there should be plenty of verbiage), I'm impressed they managed to pull out something with this much juice so late in the game. I figured things were going to be quieter between now and revolution. They were really sitting on a hot hand here. Kudos on knowing when to play it.