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Dolfan in NYC

2019 NBA Offseason Thread

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Not since Pat Riley told Lewis Lloyd, Mitchell Wiggins, and John Lucas in 1986 "hey, congrats about winning against us. Go kick Boston's ass...but beforehand, let me show the Rockets a special party to celebrate, Showtime style..." has one move napalmed basketball in Houston so perfectly.

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Now all that is left is for the Thunder to revert back to the Seattle motherfuckin' Supersonics in a year or two and I'm good. I would actually have a team to support rather than choosing players I dig to get invested in (would still happen). I'm fittin' to fire up 2K19 and start a Supersonics franchise with all these picks.

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That made my day. Thank you, brother.

Spoiler

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Edited by Oyaji
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I'll actually be the one guy not surprised by this.  The Thunder clearly have given up for at least the next two seasons.  Might as well trade one contract that no one wants for another contract no one wants.  Paul for Westbrook makes total sense on paper.  And watching those two together is going to be glorious.

Also quite the storyline that Chris Paul starts his career in OKC and ends up with a contract so insane in retrospect, they end up being the only team that will take him.

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Fun fact: Steph Curry is now the longest tenured player in NBA with original team who drafted him.

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1 hour ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

Remind me to ban everyone when I'm done with dinner with the potential in laws

I don't understand. Miami just dodged a bullet. Russ is on the downswing, and that deal might be the second worst contract in the NBA (behind Wall because, well, obviously. Ahead of Wiggins cause it's so much more money.)

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14 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said:

I don't understand. Miami just dodged a bullet. Russ is on the downswing, and that deal might be the second worst contract in the NBA (behind Wall because, well, obviously. Ahead of Wiggins cause it's so much more money.)

Maybe because Miami is interested in CP3 now 

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1 hour ago, Oyaji said:

Image

Now all that is left is for the Thunder to revert back to the Seattle motherfuckin' Supersonics in a year or two and I'm good. I would actually have a team to support rather than choosing players I dig to get invested in (would still happen). I'm fittin' to fire up 2K19 and start a Supersonics franchise with all these picks.

Even better: put a team back in Vancouver. And fuck it, offer Terry Pegula an expansion team so he can bring back the Braves!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Here for Lawful Metal's face turn on Russell Westbrook next season.

Also, here for Daryl Morey's potential sad twitter updates on the Rockets' win-less record against the Warriors next season and his Westbrook/Harden Co-MVP campaign.

Edited by _MJ_
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1 hour ago, Brian Fowler said:

I don't understand. Miami just dodged a bullet. Russ is on the downswing, and that deal might be the second worst contract in the NBA (behind Wall because, well, obviously. Ahead of Wiggins cause it's so much more money.)

I think you're too down on him. What you get with Russ is so much more than Wall or Wiggins. The last two years he was either trying to make Paul George happy enough to stay, or play with Carmelo Anthony.  It was a big change from his MVP season. Not sure if you can totally peg it on age or deteriorating skill yet. The liabilities he showed last season feel like the same liabilities he's always had. 

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Both he and Harden should be healthier and fresher for the playoffs now that they'll have to take fewer touches throughout the regular season to accomodate one another. 

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37 minutes ago, jaedmc said:

I think you're too down on him. What you get with Russ is so much more than Wall or Wiggins. The last two years he was either trying to make Paul George happy enough to stay, or play with Carmelo Anthony.  It was a big change from his MVP season. Not sure if you can totally peg it on age or deteriorating skill yet. The liabilities he showed last season feel like the same liabilities he's always had. 

His 3pt% and FT% have cratered. Playing with someone that could create open shots for him made him a worse shooter.

He also is a terrible fit for Houston. Either he will stand still doing nothing while Harden works, or they'll have to use Harden as the spot up shooter on Capela/Westbrook PnR.

Do I think he's better than Wiggins and Wall? Of course. But his age 33 and 34 seasons, at eay over $40 million? If it gets you a title, I guess it's worth it, but I really don't think he does get Houston over the top, and I can't imagine he could've Miami.

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1 hour ago, jaedmc said:

I think you're too down on him. What you get with Russ is so much more than Wall or Wiggins. The last two years he was either trying to make Paul George happy enough to stay, or play with Carmelo Anthony.  It was a big change from his MVP season. Not sure if you can totally peg it on age or deteriorating skill yet. The liabilities he showed last season feel like the same liabilities he's always had. 

The reasons the last two years were one thing, but there's also so much more baggage for Russ as well.

The way his career has gone so far makes Westbrook look like the best player you watch and just know "I'd HATE to play with that guy."  Even most of the notorious swinging pricks in the game usually were good enough to make sure you won, and could have a chance of getting top-tier talent. Russell Westbrook has driven star after star away in large part due to "I don't want to play with this guy", as one of the last vestiges of heroball in the NBA as it's become obsolete...and he may be good, but he's not even good enough to succeed at Heroball.

...and now, Westbrook's going to Houston, with D'Antoniball as one of the early adopters of the new style (which Westbrook can't really play ), and he's going onto the team of James Harden- the MVP-caliber superstar who, oh yeah, Westbrook already drove off once before.

This has trainwreck written all over it....which makes matters worse since OKC got three (and given how this looks doomed to fail, possibly all four) potential high lottery picks out of the deal.

Edited by SorceressKnight

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Russ has become ridiculously underrated the past few years. Like... the guy is beyond incredible at the sport of basketball. 

He has one major deficiency in that he can’t shoot from deep and takes too many shots from that range. 

Aside from that:

A triple double for a season is absolutely insane. There has never been a time in basketball history where getting either a rebound or an assist has hurt the team that got either. Russ rebounding is also such a huge advantage as now the engine of an offense - and one of the best passers alive - has the ball with advantages. 

As awful as Russ is shooting, he is so good at the rim. His shot over 60 percent at the rim last year and gets there a lot.

And taking more stats from this Ringer article:

Russ led the league in points created by assist. And he also threw over 800 passes to a teammate that led to an open 3 last year - making him the league leader, and this for a team that did not have any shooting.

Get a guy who can pass like Russ with shooters and open space? 

Everyone is about to remember just how friggin’ great he is.

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I don't think it's a perfect fit but I think they will stagger Harden and Russ.  They'll always have a top tier scorer and ball handler on the court.  Rockets want to shoot 3's and more 3's but the other thing they want to do is get to the line.  Westbrook has had years where he's close to or over 10 FTA per game.  Harden last year was at 11+ 

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I certainly don't think he's a bad player. But I don't think he's good though at the things that matter most in the current NBA. He refuses move without the ball and is a lousy outside shooter, which automatically limits you to running virtually your entire offense through him our playing 4 on 5 while he's on the court. He's a mediocre defensive player, despite his ferocious athleticism. 

Part of his problem is bad timing. If you dropped him into the NBA before they relaxed the illegal defense rules, and before the space and pace/three point revolution he might have gone down as a top five player of all time. I legitimately don't know how you would've defended him in the 90's.

But the big issue, again, is that he's already 30, looked a half step slower last year, and, instead of improving on the skills needed to compensate for his body slowing down, be appears to be getting worse at those things, and he's locked up for over 40 million a year. 

On one hand, for all the talk of him driving people away, most of his ex-teammates say he was great to play with, and deny it had anything to do with leaving (and I can at least partially believe this. Leaving OKC for L.A. or the Bay Area is certainly understandable)

On the other, he forced Kevin Durant, arguably the single best one on one scorer in the NBA at the time (prior to Harden clearly taking over that title) into often being just a spot up shooter around the Westbrook/Adams PnR because Westbrook was useless if they ran the offense through KD.

Russ is amazing to watch, ferocious and intense and a brilliant full speed player. But I'm ecstatic the Pistons didn't get a deal done for him.

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I so want Tacko to be a thing at the NBA level.

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I will say I totally understand why Morey made this move, and the best case scenario is D'Antoni getting another point guard to buy in, and this forces them to that next level. Westbrook and Harden are friends, and maybe that helps make it work.

But if they don't get a title here, this might slam shut the Harden in Houston window.

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8 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

But I'm ecstatic the Pistons didn't get a deal done for him.

Oh come on,  the Pistons are going nowhere with Blake and Andre as the "stars" of the team.  At least with Westbrook you could probably pencil them in for 45 wins in the east and some fun times. There's nothing fun about this current Pistons team and they have no future. 

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I think Fowler is sick of the Pistons being not a contender, but not a re-builder for something like over a decade now. Getting Russ would delay that even longer while probably not giving the team much for a future.

Miami on the other hand could have benefited right away. With Kawhi gone, Kyrie going to Brooklyn where he'll wait a year for KD, and Jimmy leaving Philly, there's room to move up into the Top 4 in the East, with the ability to attract players next off season before Durant comes back.

Houston....I don't think this works. I get the desperation, and in theory two of the last three MVPs on one team sounds like a great idea. But not if it's Harden and Westbrook. It just sounds like a mess.

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I think its a massive overpay as well. Taking on massive more amounts of salary, and giving up four firsts for the privilege is pretty dumb, IMHO.

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13 hours ago, Brian Fowler said:

I don't understand. Miami just dodged a bullet. Russ is on the downswing, and that deal might be the second worst contract in the NBA (behind Wall because, well, obviously. Ahead of Wiggins cause it's so much more money.)

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Hopefully this explains it.   Short of a straight up Dragon for CP3 trade--with cap relief along the way so we can go for Beal, I don't want CP3 in Miami. 

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