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[NOV 2016] WRESTLING DISCUSSION THREAD


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Unpopular opinion: Is anyone else kind of over the "british invasion" of sorts of talent like Sabre Jr, Ospreay, Scrull, etc? I mean, yeah, it's great that talent from the UK is getting international exposure, but I watch their matches and... ugh. I can't get into it. I try to watch WCPW or ICW or PROGRESS and it's just so bad. It seems really low-rent.

I'm probably the only one that feels this way, but it's something I've felt for awhile and it came to a head during the Cruiserweight Classic with Sabre Jr. and now it's getting worse with ROH and PWG. 

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I love ICW, but that may be because it is more character based than other promotions, and I like that. I have not watched enough Ospreay or Scrull to comment on them, but I was definitely underwhelmed by what I have seen of ZSJ.

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I would take Rev Pro over PROGRESS  but I do see what you mean with the over-exposure.  A couple of years ago they tried it with NJPW talent and now it seems that the new flavor is UK talent.  Osprey is great though, Marty has a decent heel character, and Noam Dar is hit or miss.   With ZSJ  if he has someone who can keep up with him (cesaro, Danielson, Hero)  the match can easily be 5 stars, but I have also seen where Zack will phone it in.  Sort of like 2005 ROH AJ Styles.

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2 hours ago, Casey said:

Unpopular opinion: Is anyone else kind of over the "british invasion" of sorts of talent like Sabre Jr, Ospreay, Scrull, etc? I mean, yeah, it's great that talent from the UK is getting international exposure, but I watch their matches and... ugh. I can't get into it. I try to watch WCPW or ICW or PROGRESS and it's just so bad. It seems really low-rent.

I'm probably the only one that feels this way, but it's something I've felt for awhile and it came to a head during the Cruiserweight Classic with Sabre Jr. and now it's getting worse with ROH and PWG. 

As long as Jack Gallagher is still lacing up his boots I'll never tire of British carny-ism.

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4 hours ago, The Nature Boy said:

 

That's a different discussion and a real problem honestly. The biggest problem with post-Attitude Era wrestling is that fans say that someone is "wasted" if they aren't being pushed to the moon and receiving World Title shots. A lot of people fail to realize that the curtain jerker and the mid carder are all apart of the tapestry that is a good wrestling show.

 

True, but it's strange that smaller companies can figure out how to make money off guys, but WWE sometimes can't.

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1 hour ago, DTTW said:

True, but it's strange that smaller companies can figure out how to make money off guys, but WWE sometimes can't.

Key word, though: SMALLER COMPANIES.

Saying that a smaller company can make money off some indy star doesn't necessarily mean they're guaranteed to be money in the big leagues for one, especially since pretty much every star who had any independent experience was once money in a smaller fed (The Shining Stars were absolute licenses to print money in Puerto Rico when Carlos Colon was booking the family, but there's been enough time to prove no, they will never be over- much less a draw, in the United States. 

That is the same for a lot of them- for every "But...but [indy promotion] did it so they could be a new boom period if WWE didn't HATE US and would gladly lose money just to make smarks unhappy!" person, there's at least one "Have we considered that maybe, JUST MAYBE, they were a smoke and mirrors job on the indy scene and they aren't that good?" story.

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Not trying to start a fantasy booking thread, but I was thinking ahead to WM 33 and trying to figure out a card for it when I realized that it's going to have to be a really full card due to the brand split this year. In the past, we've had 9 matches take up a 4 hour show. With the brand split, we have 7 titles now. Assuming all those get on the card, plus whatever Undertaker match, Brock/Golderberg match, the rumored Shaq/Big Show match, the Andre Battle Royal, that really starts to fill things up. And that's not counting any other matches/feuds that aren't for any titles. Obviously, some things will be on the pre-show, but man...it could really be a huge show this year.

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10 hours ago, Casey said:

Unpopular opinion: Is anyone else kind of over the "british invasion" of sorts of talent like Sabre Jr, Ospreay, Scrull, etc? I mean, yeah, it's great that talent from the UK is getting international exposure, but I watch their matches and... ugh. I can't get into it. I try to watch WCPW or ICW or PROGRESS and it's just so bad. It seems really low-rent.

I'm probably the only one that feels this way, but it's something I've felt for awhile and it came to a head during the Cruiserweight Classic with Sabre Jr. and now it's getting worse with ROH and PWG. 

Nope, exactly the opposite actually. I think the UK is way ahead over the other three big wrestling countries right now.

Watching the British Indies is my main focus nowadays.

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2 hours ago, MonteCarl said:

Not trying to start a fantasy booking thread, but I was thinking ahead to WM 33 and trying to figure out a card for it when I realized that it's going to have to be a really full card due to the brand split this year. In the past, we've had 9 matches take up a 4 hour show. With the brand split, we have 7 titles now. Assuming all those get on the card, plus whatever Undertaker match, Brock/Golderberg match, the rumored Shaq/Big Show match, the Andre Battle Royal, that really starts to fill things up. And that's not counting any other matches/feuds that aren't for any titles. Obviously, some things will be on the pre-show, but man...it could really be a huge show this year.

Mania will be 12 hours this year. It's all part of the plan to eventually have live wrestling go 24/7/365 on the Network.

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8 hours ago, SorceressKnight said:

Key word, though: SMALLER COMPANIES.

Saying that a smaller company can make money off some indy star doesn't necessarily mean they're guaranteed to be money in the big leagues for one, especially since pretty much every star who had any independent experience was once money in a smaller fed (The Shining Stars were absolute licenses to print money in Puerto Rico when Carlos Colon was booking the family, but there's been enough time to prove no, they will never be over- much less a draw, in the United States. 

That is the same for a lot of them- for every "But...but [indy promotion] did it so they could be a new boom period if WWE didn't HATE US and would gladly lose money just to make smarks unhappy!" person, there's at least one "Have we considered that maybe, JUST MAYBE, they were a smoke and mirrors job on the indy scene and they aren't that good?" story.

Cept for the part where they bring them in, don't treat them seriously, book them to lose, and then say they arent grabbing the brass ring.

If it was a hit and miss thing, ok, but it's got to be around a 90% rate where they never seem to tap into whatever they saw in guys to hire them in the first place.

Look at the ratings...and realize they have better depth, diversity, and resources across the board...and yet the company seemingly has zero momentum. They don't have another Cena ready...despite a roster full of guys who were able to be Cena back home. I'll buy a few guys being smoke and mirrors...but nearly every single guy...come on man, at that point, it's not talent, it's WWE.

I think back on Taz and compare it to AJ. Took them 20 years but they seemed to realize hey if the guy comes elsewhere and he's massively over, maybe we shouldn't waste all that momentum.

And then I remember Roman and hope ends up lost again.

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I don't think they should do Brock/Goldberg III at the WrestleMania.

At the Rumble: Reigns enters early, Goldberg at 27 and spears and tosses a couple of guys, Strowman around for the final four, Strowman eliminates Roman, Goldberg gets Strowman out right after, Brock enters at 30, wrecks Goldberg for a couple minutes, goes for a big clothesline and Goldberg dips his shoulder, Brock goes flying, Goldberg wins the Rumble.  Challenges for the WHC.  Styles can carry him to a long-ish main event-level match.

Brock goes nuts on Raw, murders a couple of cruiserweights.  Literally.  RIP TJP.  Gets Universal Title match at WM to satiate him.  Jericho eventually cons his way into the match making it a 3-way.  Brock squashes both guys, eats the shopping list and sends Jericho away to play rockstar.  Holds the title until the SummerFest where he baits Goldberg into another match and he finally picks up a win over Goldberg.

Also, Roman vs. Strowman.  And Ambrose finally snaps on Ellsworth leading to a garbage match against Shane.  And I guess, Rollins vs. Trips and Cena vs. Undertaker.

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I dont think all the titles will be defended at Mania. That's a gimmick for Night of Champions.

We will probably get a 10 person intergender, cross promotion tag match with the SDL womens, IC and US champions.

Who knows if New Day will still be champs? Both tag belts could be on the pre show.

7-8 matches will be about right on the main show.

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A near 50 year old football drop out beat a certified MMA badass who is juiced to the gills in under 5 minutes.

The fantasy booking I have involves a room full writers and executives along with a high capacity weapon that fires rapidly to fix this level of stupid booking.

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2 hours ago, L_W_P said:

I dont think all the titles will be defended at Mania. That's a gimmick for Night of Champions.

Granted there are more of them now but all titles are defended at almost all the Manias. It seems like at most one isn't defended on each show and that is rare. Like when the Shield was doing all the 6 man's and Ambrose was never defending. Or when they kept putting AJ Lee in tag matches because... well they hated the women.

God did they really hate defending the US Title on Mania

Especially now when they put them on the preshow too

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1 hour ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

"Defending championships is a gimmick...."

I'm not sure if I'm more disturbed by that statement or by your "Dana Brooke as Sindel" avatar...

Hey Night of Champions is their idea not mine.

The point I was making is that they don't have every title defended on a single show anymore because their is a 'special' show for that. Same reason there aren't any Hell in a Cell matches outside of that show and The Undertaker.

I doubt we see both womens, both tag, both the IC and US as well as the CW titles all defended along with the WWE and Universal championships. That's 9 matches before we throw in Goldberg, Brock, Undertaker, Cena and Triple H having matches and I can't see all of them fighting for titles.

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