AEW - DECEMBER 2022 - THREAD 2

[Eivion]

1 minute ago, Krone Meltzer said:

They were also the only mainstream game in town at the time too. We love 'rasslin and just want some good graps. 

This is consistently trying to belittle an owner who has done pretty close to everything in his power to treat the wrestling business with as much respect as a new owner could and try to bring it to the glory, respect, and enjoyment it once had. Brodie Lee, Owen Hart memorial, KultureCity, and I'm sure many more I'm forgetting.

Not sure how being the only mainstream game in town makes it ok to go out of one's way to be super negative on a product. Its not like there isn't a ton of wrestling people can catch via streaming.

Also not sure how Khan treated Swole last year was exactly respectful. TK has done good things. I don't think anyone is arguing that. Doesn't change that he has shown himself to be something of a rich brat who doesn't know how to deal with people all too well. Some are going in on him too hard, but others are also putting him on too high a pedestal. Neither is a good thing to do. 

 

 

[odessasteps]

Also, don't think he should be given a free pass just because he used to post here or he is somehow "one of us made good." 

Edited December 27, 2022 by odessasteps

[Casey]

How many people still active here were around when Tony Khan was a member? Less than 10? Nobody is giving him a free pass because of that, of all things.

[Kevin Wilson]

5 minutes ago, Casey said:

How many people still active here were around when Tony Khan was a member? Less than 10? Nobody is giving him a free pass because of that, of all things.

Hey there are a lot of us oldies left that never moved on to bigger and better things.

[Elsalvajeloco]

1 hour ago, odessasteps said:

Also, don't think he should be given a free pass just because he used to post here or he is somehow "one of us made good." 

This is a heel led territory so that honor goes to Tom Lawlor.

1 hour ago, Eivion said:

I don't think anyone is arguing that. 

Eh, I don't know about that part. When you have various Cornette acolytes and/or those who nitpick every little thing to the point of like you should probably quit watching cause it's not going to turn around anytime soon, I think it's evident is more irrational hate for the promoter. That said, there is a reason why you don't have too many customer facing type promoters especially when you have platforms that give voices to EVERYONE who themselves couldn't book for shit if they were allowed to fantasy book everything they wanted. So yeah, once you place yourself out there, it tends to be open season especially when you have certain quirks. However, there have been plenty of people here who offered valid criticisms who don't necessarily take all of it out on Tony Khan the individual as if all the previous non-WWE promoters before him were unimpeachable. There is a reason why none of those motherfuckers are still in business or stayed in business when they were still alive, and all of it wasn't on Vince and his pro wrestling version of manifest destiny. There is a feeling that he didn't earn this. Well, by virtue of having money/capital which is the only requisite of getting into ANY business, he did earn this. And that rubs a bunch of people the wrong way. 

And for as much love as a Jim Cornette gets from his following, I noticed ain't no one trying to fund a Jim Cornette pro wrestling led venture and Cornette isn't that old. He was like 34 when SMW went down (TK is 40 so calling him a brat is weird). He is only a handful years older than a man currently in charge of the number 1 group who had a serious health issue not too long ago.

[FourPostMassacre]

21 hours ago, just drew said:

Outrage mining again.

The gimmick that keeps on giving! 
 

My favorite part about these TK haters is they use info that is the literal definition of grasping at straws and even then they have to twist it to make him look like the bad guy in the situation. 
 

If Tony Khan had not said anything in response to Swole the same people would be on here talking about how he is weak for letting ex employees talk shit about him and not responding. 
 

I mean it’s nice not to have a forum full of TK dick riders but at least come with some valid criticisms. Maybe try watching some highlights or something like a promo Joe compilation or botchamania since the product is too hard for you to stomach in it’s normal form.

[The Great ML]

6 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said:

Hey there are a lot of us oldies left that never moved on to bigger and better things.

My board contribution probably peaked with teenage Kevin Von Erich, hookers or Tommy Rich’s balls and peroxide.

[Shartnado]

22 hours ago, Jenalysis said:

 

I do think AEW is in a danger zone with Hangman- he's starting to git of Naito's smell in the not really winning the big one.  He has to go over Mox, maybe even give Mox his well-earned vacation.

Maybe a Loser Leaves for 30-90 days stip to their next match, perhaps after Hangman gives Mox a concussion, and TK gets tired of them interfering with each other?

 

Are we talking Lex Luger or Sid Vicious level of danger zone here?

[twiztor]

52 minutes ago, Eivion said:

This kind of amuses me as this is what a decent amount of people were doing in WWE threads until a year or two into AEW's existence. 

speaking only for myself with this:

in the early/mid 00s we were just coming off the "highs" (YMMV as to if that was actually a highpoint or not) of the Monday Night Wars. We'd seen wrestling at its peak, and we were moving away from it. From the horribly bad Invasion angle, to the brand split, to the PG era, to the atrocious Diva Search segments, it felt like one downward step after another. I continued to watch WWE for a few years and enjoyed it less and less each week. I found myself coming in to the weekly threads to complain and read from others who were complaining. It was like we had all found our enjoyment of the show by pointing out how terrible it was. I started to actively hope the booking would be bad, or matches would suck, just so that i had more to talk about.

It took a year or three to realize i had put myself into a negative tailspin and that i was focusing on the negative because i wanted to, not because it was all trash. shortly thereafter i stopped watching WWE, and a bit after that i stopped reading those threads here. never looked back, although i pop in on occasion to see what's going right with the show. For a lot of years here, those threads were just nonstop bitching. Anybody that would mention positive moments were put through the ringer for the cardinal sin of *gasp* finding enjoyment from watching.

i like to think i have more self awareness now. i like watching AEW but again found myself reading the weekly threads and only taking away the negative from them. so, i stopped reading them. i hope everyone can find their way to balance out enjoyment and positivity.

[Shartnado]

10 minutes ago, twiztor said:

speaking only for myself with this:

in the early/mid 00s we were just coming off the "highs" (YMMV as to if that was actually a highpoint or not) of the Monday Night Wars. We'd seen wrestling at its peak, and we were moving away from it. From the horribly bad Invasion angle, to the brand split, to the PG era, to the atrocious Diva Search segments, it felt like one downward step after another. I continued to watch WWE for a few years and enjoyed it less and less each week. I found myself coming in to the weekly threads to complain and read from others who were complaining. It was like we had all found our enjoyment of the show by pointing out how terrible it was. I started to actively hope the booking would be bad, or matches would suck, just so that i had more to talk about.

It took a year or three to realize i had put myself into a negative tailspin and that i was focusing on the negative because i wanted to, not because it was all trash. shortly thereafter i stopped watching WWE, and a bit after that i stopped reading those threads here. never looked back, although i pop in on occasion to see what's going right with the show. For a lot of years here, those threads were just nonstop bitching. Anybody that would mention positive moments were put through the ringer for the cardinal sin of *gasp* finding enjoyment from watching.

i like to think i have more self awareness now. i like watching AEW but again found myself reading the weekly threads and only taking away the negative from them. so, i stopped reading them. i hope everyone can find their way to balance out enjoyment and positivity.

On top of you liking Jim Powers a lot this post is amazing and I agree with it a plenty!

[twiztor]

 

the man, the myth, the legend!

[Krone]

Who's asking for Tony Khan to get a free pass?

Meh, maybe I'm wrong and maybe it's opinion based. But Tony Khan has done more to grow the BRAND of PROFESSIONAL WRESTLING across the BOARD moreso than anyone else in recent memory. Most certainly WWE... I mean, wasn't NXT gonna wipe out all the promotions practically outside of the US (and pretty much did for a lot of the UK)? That's best for rasslin? THAT'S my point. 
 

Quote

This is consistently trying to belittle an owner who has done pretty close to everything in his power to treat the wrestling business with as much respect as a new owner could and try to bring it to the glory, respect, and enjoyment it once had. Brodie Lee, Owen Hart memorial, KultureCity, and I'm sure many more I'm forgetting.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Krone Meltzer

[Octopus]

33 minutes ago, twiztor said:

speaking only for myself with this:

in the early/mid 00s we were just coming off the "highs" (YMMV as to if that was actually a highpoint or not) of the Monday Night Wars. We'd seen wrestling at its peak, and we were moving away from it. From the horribly bad Invasion angle, to the brand split, to the PG era, to the atrocious Diva Search segments, it felt like one downward step after another. I continued to watch WWE for a few years and enjoyed it less and less each week. I found myself coming in to the weekly threads to complain and read from others who were complaining. It was like we had all found our enjoyment of the show by pointing out how terrible it was. I started to actively hope the booking would be bad, or matches would suck, just so that i had more to talk about.

It took a year or three to realize i had put myself into a negative tailspin and that i was focusing on the negative because i wanted to, not because it was all trash. shortly thereafter i stopped watching WWE, and a bit after that i stopped reading those threads here. never looked back, although i pop in on occasion to see what's going right with the show. For a lot of years here, those threads were just nonstop bitching. Anybody that would mention positive moments were put through the ringer for the cardinal sin of *gasp* finding enjoyment from watching.

i like to think i have more self awareness now. i like watching AEW but again found myself reading the weekly threads and only taking away the negative from them. so, i stopped reading them. i hope everyone can find their way to balance out enjoyment and positivity.

Honestly, my timeline is different but I took a few year break from keeping up with wrestling for a similar reason. I credit my at the time snarkiness. Good things were in front of me and I wasn’t enjoying it. I wasn’t here of course, but elsewhere (as Sledge.). Life reevaluated and a more positive outlook, I’m now a regular wrestling enjoying @Gordlow! I’ll tease and make zingers and I think valid criticisms are more than fair. If I’m not feeling AEW (which can be off and on) I am so blessed to be in a time I can watch sooo much on YouTube and other online sites or streaming services.

——

If someone posts in a way I don’t like (generally constantly negative or even mean to other posters) I just block them.  I get the luxury to still see that if they post and I do want to read to see the flow of conversation, you can click “see this post” or something around that line. Pretty easy stuff. Most of y’all are cool though and it is a joy to post here. I have no wrestling friends, that even when I’m too busy to watch a lot, it is still fun to see what’s up in the wild world of grapples.

 

EDIT TO ADD

Not worth a double post, but I’m optimistic about the new design. The commercials with the lasers looks neat. Very pro-lasers.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Octopus
FUCK YEAH, LASERS

[Eivion]

49 minutes ago, Krone Meltzer said:

Who's asking for Tony Khan to get a free pass?

Meh, maybe I'm wrong and maybe it's opinion based. But Tony Khan has done more to grow the BRAND of PROFESSIONAL WRESTLING across the BOARD moreso than anyone else in recent memory. Most certainly WWE... I mean, wasn't NXT gonna wipe out all the promotions practically outside of the US (and pretty much did for a lot of the UK)? That's best for rasslin? THAT'S my point. 
 

Do you really not see how you have kind of just equated Tony Khan to a savior and WWE as the devil with these comments. Wrestling is not more popular or respected than it was before AEW. WWE/NXT was never trying to wipe all promotions out. This is the type of stuff I think is unhealthy regardless of who people are being hyper positive or negative towards.

[Casey]

Anyways, Dax Harwood has his new podcast and the first episode is about CM Punk (as a topic, not an interview or anything). All of this stolen from Fightful - the episode doesn't even come out until Thursday, so I guess SRS heard it early or something.

 

On the Hangman in-ring promo segment:

Quote

"After the promo segment, I went to Punk and I said, 'that was really good, that was a great segment.' They got the fans to react. It's hard sometimes to get the fans to react to a babyface-babyface match. I thought it was a great segment. He was like, 'Ahhh, I'm kind of feeling a certain way about it.' I had no inkling that anything went wrong or went sideways or anything like that."

"To be honest, I don't really know Adam Page very well, we worked together once on the North Carolina Indies. I don't know him very well, but I don't think so and I didn't think so. I didn't have that notion of him. He's a family man, he loves his wife, he just had a newborn, he's always pleasant and polite to me. We always talked and get along. Even after the disagreements we've had with the Young Bucks, he and I have always talked and got along great."

 

On Punk not wanting the AEW title, and if Punk was becoming bitter about his experiences in AEW heading into All Out:

Quote

No, not at all. Punk was still so joyous and happy to be in the wrestling business. To be honest, he told me, when they were going to put the belt on him, that he didn't want the belt. He said, 'I just want to have fun,' but he understood that Tony putting the belt on him would put AEW in a better light. He took it, begrudgingly a little bit, but he took the belt. At the time, he was taking me, Cash, Max [MJF], Wardlow, Hobbs, I'm missing so many guys, he was taking us out to eat, always paying for it. He bought all the girls in the locker room Starbucks gift cards and had one of the girls hand them out, anonymously, and didn't say who they were from, but it was from him, just because he loved the atmosphere and loved being there. He also loved the work the girls were putting in. He thought they were busting their ass to try and get the attention that WWE's women's division was getting.

Talking to Punk after the backstage fight between Punk/Steel & the Elite:

Quote

"All the boys in the locker room were drinking and having a good time, and we were hugging, I have picture of me and Jay Lethal on the ground together just laughing our ass off. I had my wife and daughter there, Cash had his girlfriend. It was such a great time. After our match was over, I shower up, we had a couple of drinks with the guys real quick, grab my girls, and head back to the hotel. I was laying in bed and I got a text from one of the wrestlers that said, 'is this shit true?' I had no idea what he was talking about. Right after that, I got a call from my buddy CM Punk and he told me what happened. I said, 'You're lying to me dude. There is no way that happened.' He was covered in blood from the match. He FaceTimed me, it was that night. He said, 'I want to let you know, you're going to hear some things. I want you to hear it from me. This is what happened.' I said, 'Dude, are you okay? Do you need anything? I'll come right now to help you out, get you cleaned.' 'No, no, everything is fine, it's died down, we're good.' That's when I first heard about it."

Obviously, I wasn't there. Who I perceive to be God is the only person who really knows the truth. Everyone is going to have their own version in their head. We've all done it before, we've made what we perceive to be the truth. What I've heard that is reported, there are elements of truth in it, but then there are also some things that raise a red flag to me. It seems like we're only getting a portion of the story or what this journalist wants to put out, whether he has a bias or grudge against one of the parties, that's just how I felt. I also knew that I didn't know the whole story. I also felt that the stories that I heard from a few people, I don't feel like they would blatantly lie to me. I do think there are bits of truth, but I also believe that some fans have read too much into it and I think they should let what happened, happen, and it die down. When it's all said and done, I can't tell you that I know 100% of the truth and I can't tell you that the journalist reporting is 100% of the truth. I know what I perceive to be the truth and from the things I've read and heard, there is partial truth and partial things that are a bit exaggerated.

 

If he can see Punk coming back to AEW:

Quote

"I can tell you what I hope, because I don't know. Everyone knows about the legalities of the situation and no one is really expressing what is going to happen, what has happened, and what won't happen. I can tell you, all I can be truthful about, I can only tell you what I know and what I perceive to know, I hope that he comes back. I feel that AEW should have the Young Bucks in their locker room. AEW should have Kenny Omega in the locker room. I know that I feel AEW should have CM Punk in the locker room. With those four entities, it makes our talent roster so much deeper and better. It's four guys who want to be the best. Regardless of what any of us think personally, I know that we all want to be the best and I know we all want the best for professional wrestling. It's given us a life that we could never have otherwise."

"This is my plea to all four guys. Please find a way to make it work. If we can make it work, we can set up the future of professional wrestling for a long time and we can change the course of professional wrestling for a very long time. When you think about it, unselfishly, we're doing this for 20-30 years down the road so guys and girls can make a living."

[Krone]

5 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Do you really not see how you have kind of just equated Tony Khan to a savior and WWE as the devil with these comments. Wrestling is not more popular or respected than it was before AEW. WWE/NXT was never trying to wipe all promotions out. This is the type of stuff I think is unhealthy regardless of who people are being hyper positive or negative towards.

https://www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2018/11/wwe-reportedly-has-right-to-purchase-uk-indie-promotions-648364/

I feel like this says otherwise, but we can agree to disagree I guess.

[Octopus]

@Casey, is it on AddFreeShows early or something? I don’t think I have that episode until Thursday. I’ll miss Regal but I’m very excited to listen. 

[Casey]

I’m not sure, I just assumed Sapp got access to it early since all of that was in a Fightful article.

[Eivion]

2 minutes ago, Krone Meltzer said:

https://www.wrestlinginc.com/news/2018/11/wwe-reportedly-has-right-to-purchase-uk-indie-promotions-648364/

I feel like this says otherwise, but we can agree to disagree I guess.

Not sure why you think wrestling journalism which is 97% rumors somehow confirms WWE were trying to take over the world but ok.

[Elsalvajeloco]

27 minutes ago, Casey said:

If he can see Punk coming back to AEW:

Not calling myself Nostradamus of anything, but one of the first things or at least relatively right everything went down is exactly what Dax is saying about figuring out how to make all this work. Shit, maybe it won't work just cause one or more parties is an asshole. However, in the history of pro wrestling, every successful and highly successful promotion has had AT LEAST one person like that. So you owe it to the business to at least try to make it work.

Also, the part where he is saying everyone is having fun right after the show speaks to why maybe they aren't really ready to do scrums in pro wrestling. Personally, I have no problem with them and find them sort of fascinating for a worked sport. However, you have to decompress after a long ass show and probably been at the building since the early afternoon.

[Dolphman 3000]

10 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Not calling myself Nostradamus of anything, but one of the first things or at least relatively right everything went down is exactly what Dax is saying about figuring out how to make all this work. Shit, maybe it won't work just cause one or more parties is an asshole. However, in the history of pro wrestling, every successful and highly successful promotion has had AT LEAST one person like that. So you owe it to the business to at least try to make it work.

I have a feeling Dax and Cash are going to see what happens with Punk before making a decision on their future next year

Hopefully the "let's all work together and make money from this" amends happen sooner rather than later

[LoneWolf&Subs]

Once Punk started throwing out lawsuit threats, that’s when “Trying to make things work” ended.

[Matt D]

All I can say is that Dax is obviously someone talking to all parties and even for an opinionated guy, that’s a hell of a thing to say if Khan or Punk wouldn’t want him to say it.

Edited December 27, 2022 by Matt D

[Elsalvajeloco]

3 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Once Punk started throwing out lawsuit threats, that’s when “Trying to make things work” ended.

Well, I mean Randy Couture was suing or about take legal action against UFC right before he agreed to fight out the rest of his deal and fight Brock. Shit like that happens. I don't think it's like Punk/Cabana for example where it's end of relationship for good territory.

[Casey]

3 minutes ago, LoneWolf&Subs said:

Once Punk started throwing out lawsuit threats, that’s when “Trying to make things work” ended.

 

34 minutes ago, Eivion said:

Not sure why you think wrestling journalism which is 97% rumors somehow confirms WWE were trying to take over the world but ok.

Not about the same topic, but I feel like this applies to the Punk/Elite situation. And Dax touched on it, as well. All of the reporting seemed massively one sided from the get-go. There’s a very specific reason why AEW leaks went mostly dry immediately following All Out.