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FEBRUARY 2021 Discussion of Wrestling


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12 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

For Christian - it was "just" multiple concussions. Like with Bryan and Edge, they had surgeries that "healed" them. There isn't really a "you had surgery, you are healed" cure for concussions.

And because of the increased attention being paid to concussions - the WWE was very concerned about having him wrestle

You would like to believe that for a variety of reasons (better testing, better understanding of concussions, etc...) that the WWE doctor felt okay enough to clear him and not the cynical reason of "he was gonna sign with AEW" 

The way the Edge thing played out if I remember correctly, because he was kinda vague with his wording in his Network doc, was that he got independently cleared by like 3 or 4 different doctors. And for years WWE said that wasn't good enough, "no" means "no". So then he had a meeting or phone conversation with Tony Kahn where he received a hefty offer. But out of respect for all WWE has done for him he went to Vince and laid it out for him. I am cleared. I want back in WWE and my doctors say it's safe. But if you wont have me the competition will. And WWE immediately wrote a big ass check and "no" no longer meant "no".

I'm going to assume Christian did the exact same thing. He did the Bryan hyperbolic chamber rehab and doctors cleared him. He has no more risk of a concussion than any other person. So he probably went to Vince and said I want back in WWE, but if "no" still means "no", I'm setting up a meeting with Tony Kahn.

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54 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

Youd also think a veteran could work a battle royale and get eliminated without any shots to the head. 

Eh, simple normal bumps can contribute to brain damage, and he took a few. One way or another he's cleared.

(Him vs Bryan could be amazing, but the idea of Christian vs Omega is so damn intriguing.)

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20 minutes ago, Andy in Kansas said:

He's going to feud with Miz and Morrison and there'll be a bunch of Miz TV segments and you'll shut up and like it!

Maybe follow that up with a Corbin match. 

Wondering: has anyone every gotten hurt in a match vs Miz, save for him completely failing to catch the guy on a dive?

Edited by Matt D
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The Yoko doc was good as expected. I forgot how awesome he was when I was a kid. It's kinda crappy that his belt wins and losses came from shenanigans, but oh well. A few good stories, like him giving Rikishi a literal blank check to get the heat turned on in his new house, and Pritchard talking about having to buy him gallons of oil so he could fry up "turkey ass" (pretty sure that's what he said, though I've never heard of it), which he would proceed to slather with mayo and eat like six of. 34 man... way, way too young to go.

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1 hour ago, Brian Fowler said:

Honestly, Christian vs Miz sounds fun.

See, E+C in full goofball mode, cutting promos with Miz and Morrison about being bigger chick magnets, and flash photography vs digital/photoshop etc could be a great use of some older guys who can still give a bit in the ring. It would also raise the tag belts up a little I think, given the tag scene in WWE is basically DOA right now.

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4 hours ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

The way the Edge thing played out if I remember correctly, because he was kinda vague with his wording in his Network doc, was that he got independently cleared by like 3 or 4 different doctors. And for years WWE said that wasn't good enough, "no" means "no". So then he had a meeting or phone conversation with Tony Kahn where he received a hefty offer. But out of respect for all WWE has done for him he went to Vince and laid it out for him. I am cleared. I want back in WWE and my doctors say it's safe. But if you wont have me the competition will. And WWE immediately wrote a big ass check and "no" no longer meant "no".

I'm going to assume Christian did the exact same thing. He did the Bryan hyperbolic chamber rehab and doctors cleared him. He has no more risk of a concussion than any other person. So he probably went to Vince and said I want back in WWE, but if "no" still means "no", I'm setting up a meeting with Tony Kahn.

That's how I remember it when watching Edge: The Second Mountain documentary. 2020 gave us some of the best wrestling documentaries ever:

Dark Side of the Ring: Benoit and Dark Side of the Ring: The Last Days of Owen Hart. WWE Untold: Bayley and Sasha Banks Take Over Brooklyn, Undertaker: The Last Ride and Edge: The Second Mountain.

The best wrestling documentaries to go with those:

Wrestling With Shadows, Daniel Bryan: Just Say Yes! Yes! Yes!, Bret Hart: The Best There Is, Was and Ever Will Be DVD, The Rise and Fall of ECW and Cheating Death, Stealing Life: The Eddie Guerrero Story.

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2 hours ago, Matt D said:

Wondering: has anyone every gotten hurt in a match vs Miz, save for him completely failing to catch the guy on a dive?

That's the only one I recall. Kofi Kingston hurt The Miz with a STIFF Trouble in Paradise leaving him bloody and a scar he still has from it:

Man, that thud.

Edited by The Natural
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Hey, just as an FYI, there is a metric ton of CWA and USWA on Amazon Prime. I was looking for the Memphis Heat documentary (which is for rent or buy even though it came out in fucking 2011) and there are just tons of full episodes listed along with it. I'm watching the last USWA episode of 1990; they did a top ten and it had both Bam Bams on it? Weird. Orndorff was on it too and I didn't even think he worked Memphis (most everybody probably worked Memphis really, unless they were fully locked in to a territory). Of course I wouldn't put it past Jerry Jarrett to just list random wrestlers that were popular and didn't work there, or only came in for a one-off.

Edited by Curt McGirt
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LOL at Christian getting some spotlight.  So if Vince never sees much in you for your whole career, all you need to finally get a push in WWE is to retire and then wait long enough to become one of the "Legends" that gets brought back for a pop. 

Speaking of the Yoko doc, I saw a clip of it and holy shit when did Vince get old?  I haven't watched WWE in 4 years and now I understand what they mean when a podcast I listen to refers to his voice as "Palpatine-y."  He also got that Old Guy Plastic surgery that looks so unnatural. 

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2 hours ago, RIPPA said:

I was gonna mention it but Natural beat me to it

The only one hurt in a Miz match was Miz

And even Miz doesn’t get hurt that often. There’s really nothing he could have done about that kick but he has had zero breakdown injuries like torn muscles or separations.

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1 minute ago, NikoBaltimore said:

I know that Miz has what DB called a "soft style".  But while he knows he's not as good as others Miz did pretty well in regards to getting money and fame relatively unscathed.  It's fun to rip on him but I kind of appreciate that.

Sewer rat may taste like pumpkin pie, but I'm still not going to eat the filthy motherfucker.

That's cool for Miz (it really is, not being sarcastic), but I still don't want to watch him.

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17 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Christian is one of the most under rated dudes of all time. The match I'm really hoping happens is Edge & Christian vs The Usos. Would love to see Christian vs Bryan, AJ, Ali, & Ricochet too. But E&C vs The Usos would tear the house down.

Christian really is. Shame Christian was underrated to WWE when compared to Edge with main events, world titles and immediate HOF induction. Christian only finally won a world title when Edge retired in 2011 and only had two brief reigns as World Heavyweight Champion. I read that Randy Orton regretted not saying to Vince that he shouldn't go over for it. Scandal that Christian still isn't in the HOF.

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Miz like everyone else in WWE could have benefitted from better writing and plot progression. When he was given the ball to do something, he could really knock things out of the park. They just never wanted to do it. Which they never want to do with anyone in case they accidentally create another star.

 

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The Miz's best role is as the manager of a tag team that can't talk who works occasional six-man tags and sometimes gets his ass kicked while fulfilling the "five minutes alone with X wrestler(s)" after a hot feud that his wards lose.

The freshest thing this, or any company, could do is to use some of these pro wrestling tropes from the '80s that still do hold up, maybe slightly molded for modern sensibilities where necessary. This is why the last two shows that I made time to watch weekly were NXT between 2014 and 2016 and NWA Power(rrr). It's been forty years; please recycle some of that stuff. 

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Saw Miz at three house shows over about four years, and he was the highlight of all of them. One was right at the beginning of Hollywood Miz, and he was working a simple "don't touch the face" bit in a nothing match that everyone was biting on. The next was at the height of the Mizdow act, which was impossibly over so of course they dropped it and did nothing with Sandow. The third was a tag match against a couple of the Shield guys where the whole match was built around Miz keeping his shirt on and eventually getting it pulled over his face like a dummy. In between your run of the mill WWE stuff, Miz's antics were easy wins with those crowds. I really think there are probably stretches where Miz was one of the more enjoyable house show guys in the company.

Of course then I'd try to watch him on the next Raw or SmackDown and he's in another bland, overdone MIz TV segment and I'd lose interest again. That's WWE for ya. 

Edited by Andy in Kansas
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I had a familiar experience with Miz on a house show opener against Cesaro based around his sunglasses and eventually Cesaro putting them on during the match to a big pop. Miz put him over with a giant swing into the sharpshooter for those keeping track at home. Miz is really good at house show bullshit which is the best kind of bullshit in my mind.

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Exactly. Their shitty post-Attitude era show that they've built with no real room for spontaneity or improvisation where you have to do X promo with Y scripting that uses the same weird phrasing and then work Z match where you dive to the outside and there's a break and then when you come back, you do the same near-fall sequence as everyone else that they apparently have quadrupled down on in many key ways basically takes a guy who is a very good talker and a natural heat machine and makes him into a bathroom break type of guy. 

And like, I enjoy shows that basically have the same structure and setup - I can binge me some Law and Order or Murdoch Mysteries or what-have-you - but even procedurals play with their setup by the fourth or fifth season into the show. Also, the writing and acting is way better. I mean, no knock on The Miz, but he's no Sam Waterston. Then again, even Sam Waterston might struggle to perform the shitty, over-written dialog that WWE started writing over a decade ago. 

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