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AEW Fyter Fest II - 7/1 & 7/8/2020


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5 hours ago, Rev Ray said:

Mjf looked like he was trying to temp me into his stall at a bazaar in morroco in that ring robe.

Until the camera panned a little lower I thought he'd just stepped out of the shower. 

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I enjoyed this more than I thought I would. 

The opening tag was really good. I'm digging the HBK/Diesel slow burn they're apparently doing with MJF and Wardlow. Second the Jungle Jack love. He's one for the four cornerstones AEW should be building for three years from now. He, Guevara (if he gets his shit together,) MJF and Darby are the future main eventers of the company. Count me in the "Wardlow is gonna be a big star" camp. Got a real "Early Tom Hardy" thing going.

 

I saw Penelope Ford live at "Hell or High Water" last year. She has come one million miles since then. I almost skipped that match, and am very glad I didn't. Tremendous work from both ladies.

 

Private Party is great. S&O could've used a win, but I understand the decision.

 

It's amazing how much better a simple thing like "being comfortable with your gimmick" has made Jake Hager. As stupid as I thought Cody beating Vance for the TNT Title was, he's delivered. The Ricky Starks match this one have been inspired.

 

Tag Champs always bring it. Always. As much as I don't go for Kenny Omega's pretentious nonsense, there's a dynamic with him and Page that just works. 

 

Oh, and Jericho ruled all night. If you disliked his performance, you are wrong.

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Just an FYI, but Night Two results are out there. I read them, since I’ll be at work when it airs and... color me not too impressed. I’m sure the in-ring work will be top notch as usual though.

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Posted (edited)

So whilst it's subjective with regards whether Fyter Fest is a flop, they got beat in the ratings this week and we can pretty much guarantee they're getting beat again next week.

Edited by RunningFromAmerica
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34 minutes ago, RunningFromAmerica said:

So whilst it's subjective with regards whether Fyter Fest is a flop, they got beat in the ratings this week and we can pretty much guarantee they're getting beat again next week.

How is it a flop? Also, how is it a guarantee they'll have less viewers next week?

And while they may have had slightly less viewers total than NXT, they still won the demo by a large margin.

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, Craig H said:

How is it a flop? Also, how is it a guarantee they'll have less viewers next week?

And while they may have had slightly less viewers total than NXT, they still won the demo by a large margin.

I’m tired of reading the demo as the be all end all of ratings. Total viewers they lost (again), and the insistence on here that “but hey they won the demo, We ❤️ AEW” is just sad. It’s like Jericho’s Twitter trolling about it. Can’t some of us enjoy both NXT, and AEW? 

The easy way to guarantee they’ll have less viewers than NXT next week is the card is incredibly weak outside of the main event. So it will all come down to whether OC can outdraw the Double title match. Which isn’t something I’d be willing to bet on or guarantee. 

Hell the most hyped thing outside of OC/Jericho seems to be Nyla’s opponent/promo (this week it sounded more like a promo than a mystery opponent). So that too is a bad sign. 

Edited by MavsFan77
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I am disappointed a hot shotted, last second show with main roster talent beat a very well built wrestling show by a bit but I'll only say this: even when AEW was smacking the shit out of NXT, people were still focusing on the younger demographic as the key. It's not as if people defending AEW have done a massive course change because of where the ratings are at. They have lost for a while here though and there is no hiding that. I doubt they panic but they're probably not loving it. Goes back to them being short on true star power, so if they aren't going to rely on signing stars when they can (which isn't realistic all that often), they need to elevate a couple of people here over the summer so they aren't so reliant on Moxley and Jericho. 

Ratings matter but they don't matter as much as people make them out half the time, both now and when AEW was trouncing NXT. I wish there were a ratingz thread in the general sub folder so it could be all in one place though. 

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7 minutes ago, Oyaji said:

I am disappointed a hot shotted, last second show with main roster talent beat a very well built wrestling show by a bit but I'll only say this: even when AEW was smacking the shit out of NXT, people were still focusing on the younger demographic as the key. It's not as if people defending AEW have done a massive course change because of where the ratings are at. They have lost for a while here though and there is no hiding that. I doubt they panic but they're probably not loving it. Goes back to them being short on true star power, so if they aren't going to rely on signing stars when they can (which isn't realistic all that often), they need to elevate a couple of people here over the summer so they aren't so reliant on Moxley and Jericho. 

Ratings matter but they don't matter as much as people make them out half the time, both now and when AEW was trouncing NXT. I wish there were a ratingz thread in the general sub folder so it could be all in one place though. 

I agree completely with the idea of a ratings thread. That’s an excellent idea, and one the mods should consider as it seems like it would clean up the discussions (including ours) a bit. 

The one thing I’m not sure on though is that AEW would’ve won had Sasha/Bayley not been on NXT. I think they would have come up with a decent opening match anyhow, and just flipped the women’s 4 way to the main event slot if they didn’t have Sasha in the main event. 

We can agree too that AEW needs to elevate people, but I’m not sure who they’d be comfortable elevating right now. It seems like they’re hell bent on the top 4 being Mox, Jericho, Cody, and Cage. Which to me is a mistake as Cage wasn’t a draw for Impact, he’s constantly hurt, and to the casual fan he’s going to look like a steroid freak. I think they’d be better off with Hangman and Kenny in the top four or five (four replacing Cody and Cage, or five if they’re insistent on Cody being in the top grouping), but they don’t seem to want to position them there. I’d also push Pentagon as more of an upper mid card-low main event guy based on his popularity, and in ring ability. 

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Posted (edited)

Cage is a monster of the week for Moxley to beat and build up his title defenses, like Brodie Lee was. I'd be shocked if Cage isn't in the upper midcard glut after this.

Fyter Fest, for as good as it's been built, was always a conservative (in terms of risk taking and giving away big matches) TV special than anything must see. If you were hoping for title changes that was never going to happen unless they shock the world with PP beating Hangman and Omega. It was a good chance to temporarily show what some of the lesser pushed or newer acts can do when given the spotlight.

Regarding night 2:

Spoiler

I just looked at the reddit spoilers and what the fuck is up with Nyla's lack of a surprise?! Did they not have the mic playing through the speakers at the show? Was there nothing? A video package they'll show just on TV? Main event sounds awesome though. Rest of the show not so much. Maybe the 8 man tag. 

 

Edited by Oyaji
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It doesn't even need to be an AEW/NXT discussion; both can be successful on their own terms. In isolation though I'd imagine its tough to gather the current AEW programming is yielding the sort of engagement they'd hope for, whatever the reason. So the question then becomes whether the talent they've been adding enhances or detracts from the offering, and what changes to push them back towards momentum.

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, MavsFan77 said:

 

The one thing I’m not sure on though is that AEW would’ve won had Sasha/Bayley not been on NXT. I think they would have come up with a decent opening match anyhow, and just flipped the women’s 4 way to the main event slot if they didn’t have Sasha in the main event. 

I’m not particularly interested in protracted ratings discussions, but I don’t see how the drawing power of Sasha and Bayley can be denied.  They significantly outdrew everything else on NXT last night (and most everything on AEW), and they were the only thing to even get close to AEW in the 18-49 demo.  Sasha/Io is a huge match to the type of fan that watches NXT/AEW.

Their tag title match a few weeks ago was a big ratings draw, too, and that was against...Shotzi and Teegan, who are not big stars or anything and had 0.0% chance of winning.

They’re clearly bigger draws than most anybody else in NXT right now.  As they should be! Considering they’re main roster talent.

Edited by EVA
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11 minutes ago, EVA said:

I’m not particularly interested in protracted ratings discussions, but I don’t see how the drawing power of Sasha and Bayley can be denied.  They significantly outdrew everything else on NXT last night (and most everything on AEW), and they were the only thing to even get close to AEW in the 18-49 demo.  Sasha/Io is a huge match to the type of fan that watches NXT/AEW.

Their tag title match a few weeks ago was a big ratings draw, too, and that was against...Shotzi and Teegan, who are not big stars or anything and had 0.0% chance of winning.

They’re clearly bigger draws than most anybody else in NXT right now.  As they should be! Considering they’re main roster talent.

I agree they’re both (Sasha in particular) draws. My point was more that I think even without them that NXT would have booked a main event to win the night again. I wasn’t trying to take anything away from Sasha and Bayley, so I want to point that out. Hell in the NXT thread I’m praising Sasha so that definitely isn’t my intention. 

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On 7/1/2020 at 9:14 PM, J.T. said:

1st hour was awesome!  2nd felt a bit overbooked.

  • I enjoyed the ladies title match more than I thought I would.  Penelope Ford Is a much lesser shade of green that we've seen in previous weeks. When she works in some spots that actually soften her opponents up for her Cutter, she'll be GTG.  I was impressed with Penelope's progression as a worker.  She is coming along nicely.  Shida is Shida.  I love her dearly.  She's a big time cosplayer so I think for an event like this, she shoulda come to the ring dressed as Tifa Lockhart or something.

Other people in the thread have commented on it, but Shida's gear was Tifa Lockhart but she kept it with her primary red color scheme. She's had that since Double or Nothing so I'd assume she'd be in for a switch soon.

On 7/1/2020 at 9:51 PM, Casey said:

Santana & Ortiz were never going to Japan. They had an offer from WWE they were about to take but AEW came in last minute and they went with that.

Now think of what they’d be doing on WWE programming. Playing tennis with the Viking Raiders? Yeah, that’s good shit, pal.

They would be in NXT feuding with UE or Oney and Burch. I can't see them working in Japan, you'd really notice how small they really are unless they worked the Jr. Division.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, MavsFan77 said:

I agree they’re both (Sasha in particular) draws. My point was more that I think even without them that NXT would have booked a main event to win the night again.

I guess I’m not sure what you’re basing this belief on?

The history of NXT/AEW RATINGZ WARZ suggests there isn’t much that reliably wins for NXT besides:

1) Main roster talent (and even that’s no sure thing; see: Flair, Charlotte)

2) World title matches 

3) Mybe, possibly Keith Lee

2 of those three are tied up for next week, so I’m not sure what the “sure thing” ratings draw is without Bayley and Sasha.  Even the Mania Takeover that had the Gargano/Ciampa blowoff and the great women’s ladder match could only muster a draw with AEW in the overall ratings and, again, couldn’t win 18-49.

Edited by EVA
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11 minutes ago, EVA said:

I guess I’m not sure what you’re basing this belief on?

The history of NXT/AEW RATINGZ WARZ suggests there isn’t much that reliably wins for NXT besides:

1) Main roster talent (and even that’s no sure thing; see: Flair, Charlotte)

2) World title matches 

3) Mybe, possibly Keith Lee

2 of those three are tied up for next week, so I’m not sure what the “sure thing” ratings draw is without Bayley and Sasha.  Even the Mania Takeover that had the Gargano/Ciampa blowoff and the great women’s ladder match could only muster a draw with AEW in the overall ratings and, again, couldn’t win 18-49.

So basically you’re saying there’s no way they could’ve booked Keith Lee and Dexter Lumis vs Adam Cole and Roderick Strong as the main event, then had both singles matches next week? That’s an obvious main event option, and it would include one of your three reliable win options. 

The biggest thing from looking at the ratings breakdown as well as prior ones is that Kenny Omega isn’t a draw, and AEW should have found a different/better main event. I’ll admit had they went with OC/Jericho this week that they’d probably have won even with Sasha/Io being up against it. But they chose poorly especially once it was known NXT was using Sasha this week. I guess it’s just not cool to admit when AEW makes a poor choice that hurts their ratings, but if NXT did the same most of you would bury them. Let’s be honest most of us aren’t willing to give both promotions the same set of criteria for judging them. It’s either complete AEW fanboys who hang onto any small thing they can find to plug why it’s better, or NXT fans who think their show is best (which is definitely a much smaller minority). 

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3 hours ago, MavsFan77 said:

I agree they’re both (Sasha in particular) draws. My point was more that I think even without them that NXT would have booked a main event to win the night again. I wasn’t trying to take anything away from Sasha and Bayley, so I want to point that out. Hell in the NXT thread I’m praising Sasha so that definitely isn’t my intention. 

I'm not sure why you think that, given their complete inability to do that prior to the last two weeks...

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AEW is going to be fine. At this point they should be worried about putting on the highest quality show they can every single week. WWE is the one with the pressure on. They've been getting trounced regularly on Wednesdays by an upstart company. TNT seems to be completely on board with their show, the tag team division is absolutely bonkers, and they're still finding their footing. The fact that WWE has had to run through dream matches on their third brand show to put together any kind of winning streak says more about the ineptitude of the folks calling the shots in Stamford than it does about AEW as a brand. I have little doubt that there will be some new talent coming to AEW this month, while WWE has to try to continue to cut costs. I wish AEW would spend a bit to bolster the women, but they have a glut of young talent being allowed to do what gets them over, rather than being forced into cookie cutter roles on WWE tv. The 18-49 demo has always been AEW's and that bodes well for them. 

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3 minutes ago, just drew said:

I'm not sure why you think that, given their complete inability to do that prior to the last two weeks...

So let me see. NXT didn’t win in the ratings on April 8th and 15th? And before you try using the Charlotte excuse that doesn’t fly. The 8th was main evented (and has the entire second hour filled up by) the Gargano/Ciampa match and the 15th had Riddle/Thatcher vs The UE as the main event. But yeah NXT can’t ever beat AEW. Okay... 

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1 minute ago, MavsFan77 said:

So let me see. NXT didn’t win in the ratings on April 8th and 15th? And before you try using the Charlotte excuse that doesn’t fly. The 8th was main evented (and has the entire second hour filled up by) the Gargano/Ciampa match and the 15th had Riddle/Thatcher vs The UE as the main event. But yeah NXT can’t ever beat AEW. Okay... 

I was being facetious, but AEW has beaten nxt far more often than the other way around. It's the better product, and I have no doubt that as fans begin to return to arenas, that will hold true. nXt's biggest problem is the people booking it, and as long as HHH and HBK are in charge, it's gonna be the same nonsense, especially when Keith Lee goes to the main roster. 

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2 minutes ago, just drew said:

AEW is going to be fine. At this point they should be worried about putting on the highest quality show they can every single week. WWE is the one with the pressure on. They've been getting trounced regularly on Wednesdays by an upstart company. TNT seems to be completely on board with their show, the tag team division is absolutely bonkers, and they're still finding their footing. The fact that WWE has had to run through dream matches on their third brand show to put together any kind of winning streak says more about the ineptitude of the folks calling the shots in Stamford than it does about AEW as a brand. I have little doubt that there will be some new talent coming to AEW this month, while WWE has to try to continue to cut costs. I wish AEW would spend a bit to bolster the women, but they have a glut of young talent being allowed to do what gets them over, rather than being forced into cookie cutter roles on WWE tv. The 18-49 demo has always been AEW's and that bodes well for them. 

My question in response to this is where’s the awesome tag depth when the champions have beat everyone except for FTR and Private Party? I think there’s definitely talent in the division, but the way it’s been booked is so dumb. Focusing on two guys that should be higher up the card as singles guys while tying up the tag belts at the same time is never the right call. 

And what are these “dream matches” NXT has blown through? Io/Sasha yes, but I don’t see many on here clamoring for Keith Lee vs Johnny Gargano vs Finn Balor. Most of you complain about Johnny and Finn. Same with next weeks double title match. This board as a whole craps all over Adam Cole so that’s not a dream match either. Hell OC/Jericho comes across more that way than two of the matches I listed.

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The awesome tag depth is on tv every week. If you don't see it, that isn't on me.

And I don't think this board "craps on" Adam Cole so much as they see him for what he is; a 5'9 charisma vacuum spot-monkey with a body made out of pipe cleaners and a head like one of those Easter Island statues. My dream match for Adam Cole at this point is him vs. a nine week vacation. 

No one should be clamoring for that 3 way. Gargano is the plain manila folder of wrestling and Finn Balor should be one one of the main shows doing something that matters. Lee, too, for that matter.

They're having to play the "Sasha" card waaaaay too much, and that's only going to work so many times. 

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