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Dolfan in NYC

Raw Is JUSTICE FOR THE REVIVAL - 2/11/2019

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47 minutes ago, sabremike said:

Honestly you are better off not knowing because it would lower your opinion of humanity by at least 10,000%.

I'm legit curious to know all the shit that Ronda went through.  If you're up for it please PM me.  I personally see her as a piece of shit but am open to things like this.

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2 minutes ago, Raziel said:

Your problem with that argument is simple.  WWE doesn't have stars.  They have interchangable cogs that can be replaced quickly, except for Brock and Ronda, who get them mainstream press.  

 

Besides the two MMA fighters, the only other star in WWE, is the WWE.

Well, yeah, but that's what is slowly killing the fanbase off.

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Just now, Brian Fowler said:

Well, yeah, but that's what is slowly killing the fanbase off.

But until the stock price falls, the bottom line is negative, the board ceases to make fucktons of money in dividens, and the TV deals bottom out, nothing's changing.

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Well, hey, I just saw a tweet with someone apparently completely seriously saying Becky is the most over performer in the company's history, specifically more over than Rock or Austin ever were. So... The internet scares me.

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2.462 million viewers. 

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38 minutes ago, just drew said:

I don't accept them as a great team. Because I don't think they are. I will concede that some of that is a "me" problem. I am predisposed to liking something less the more people tell me I should like it. The Revival is fine. I understand why people think their matches are objectively good. That's not what grabs my attention. There are probably a hundred guys on the roster who can "have good matches." Neither guy is capable of drawing me into a story they're trying to tell with their promos or physical charisma. The good news is the WWE won't be in any hurry to split the team up, because neither guy is a viable singles star.

 

Yeah, I'm probably too hard on them. I just have to roll my eyes and cringe when wrestling twitter talks about people like the Revival and what they "deserve." I'm as "fuck this company" as the next guy, but to act like the Revival are the poster boys for the lack of competence on WWE's part when it comes to what they have on their roster is laughable. I will also admit to not having the sentimental attachment to old-school tag team wrestling that a lot of people have. Like, I think the Midnight Express is the greatest tag team of all time, but my favorite tag team of all time is The New Age Outlaws, because they could talk and they did interesting things with compelling opponents. I get that the Revival also has to operate under the constraints of current WWE and their supposed "no stars" mentality, but Otis from Heavy Machinery has done more in the month he's been up to engage my attention than the Revival has since they came up. Maybe my tastes are in the minority. After all, I did once commission a t shirt that reads "workrate is for virgins." But I cannot wrap my head around the idea that all it takes to be a "great" tag team is competent work and bragging on twitter about how great you are. I dare say that in any other era of WWE, Revival would be JTTS level at best, and a lot of their "greatness" is propped up by the lack of emphasis on tags in current WWE. 

Taste is all variable and viable, and preferring over the top characters is common enough anyway. I think people generally—and me specifically—were quibbling, not just because we like their matches, but because the arguments seem a bit goalpost shifty. They were too short until they weren’t; their matches weren’t good enough until they were; the “rehearsal” thing mattered until it didn’t; now they lack character and “it” and the matches don’t matter much. Which is a fine opinion to have. I do think it’s noteworthy that they get dead crowds into their matches, though, so people do seem to connect. And if everyone else on the roster could have matches of a similar quality, it’s hard to figure why they mostly don’t. 

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30 minutes ago, muhammedboehm said:

Why would they need another three way if Becky beats Charlotte?

Ronda loses her belt without being pinned.
Becky gets her Wrestlemania moment, but feels it's tainted by not having beaten Ronda.
More heat on Charlotte for being given yet another undeserved opportunity, which also furthers her toward an eventual face turn after The Authority lose patience with her, and gives credible justification for why she'd be a 2IC in a Horsewomen vs Horsewomen feud.
Allows Becky to beat both cleanly in two consecutive main events.

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About The Revival: for me, southern style tag wrestling is the best kind of wrestling. And these guys have mastered the format and structure of southern style year wrestling, while combining it with more modern in-ring work. I think the DIY Toronto match is a serious contender for best match in WWE history.

Plus, their gimmick or traditionalist who hate all this new fangled nonsense is great.

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28 minutes ago, RolandTHTG said:

Are we discounting the idea that they don't see Ronda/Becky as a one on one next year or at Summerslam?

Plenty left on the table to get there.

The problem is Ronda is only signed through Mania.  She has strongly expressed her opinion that she wants to start a family ASAP, so they need to a) get the belt off her by then, b) run the absolute best match they can with her, and c) promote that match like hell to all the casuals to make the most money possible in the shortest amount of time.  

Running the solo with Becky makes her a superstar when she beats Ronda.  Running the trio with Becky and "Ric Flair's Daughter" (theoretically) adds more money to the pot.  So both arguments can be made.   

What they don't have, according to all reports I've read, is time. 

 

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What if they add Dean Ambrose to the match?

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I forgot about it last night, but reading the thread here I realized this whole "the WWE is the star" is the biggest problem. Vince himself said it last night "Becky, you think you're bigger than the WWE". 

Just when someone starts to get that rocket going that will take them to the next level, the WWE always undercuts them one way or another. I am fully convinced that while Roman might have been "Vince's guy", he didn't want him becoming so big that he'd join The Rock in Hollywood and leave him high and dry. I'm in no way saying Becky was on that trajectory, but they always do things to undercut people. I'm honestly convinced Becky would lose at Mania this year just because she needs more odds to overcome. 

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7 minutes ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

The problem is Ronda is only signed through Mania.  She has strongly expressed her opinion that she wants to start a family ASAP, so they need to a) get the belt off her by then, b) run the absolute best match they can with her, and c) promote that match like hell to all the casuals to make the most money possible in the shortest amount of time.  

Running the solo with Becky makes her a superstar when she beats Ronda.  Running the trio with Becky and "Ric Flair's Daughter" (theoretically) adds more money to the pot.  So both arguments can be made.   

What they don't have, according to all reports I've read, is time. 

 

I've wondered about that - how much is legit, how much is trying to muddy the waters of the main event. I suspect she'll go away from Summerslam till around the Rumble. I'd be surprised if they do a triple threat, there's not a rematch at the PPV afterwards (possibly with Ronda leaving after that)?

On the other hand, there's also the possibility she has her Mania match, has her kid and tries to emulate Serena and comes back to fight Becky at Mania 2021 when people have long since stopped caring.
 

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30 minutes ago, Beech27 said:

Taste is all variable and viable, and preferring over the top characters is common enough anyway. I think people generally—and me specifically—were quibbling, not just because we like their matches, but because the arguments seem a bit goalpost shifty. They were too short until they weren’t; their matches weren’t good enough until they were; the “rehearsal” thing mattered until it didn’t; now they lack character and “it” and the matches don’t matter much. Which is a fine opinion to have. I do think it’s noteworthy that they get dead crowds into their matches, though, so people do seem to connect. And if everyone else on the roster could have matches of a similar quality, it’s hard to figure why they mostly don’t. 

Fwiw, they are short. Much shorter than 5’10. But you’re right about subjectivity. And they could be worse, I guess. They could be Seth Rollins...

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Also, I don't think any of us mentioned that Meltzer reported Ambrose flat out refused to cut the promo they wrote him that explained the turn, and ended up just delivering the "slay the beast" line without whatever context it was written to have.

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33 minutes ago, West Newbury Bad Boy said:

How busy is Linda? Maybe she can be the next bandage they apply to their chainsaw wound. 

Vince and WWE says the ratings are down because of injuries and no Roman and older guys being phased out. There's also other stuff they don't want to mention but wouldn't look good media wise. Vince also mentioned before that ratings don't matter so much anymore. They just don't want the eventual decrease to the 1.0 range right now and would rather have 2.9. The lower the rating falls they would have to adjust the show to drastic measures.

They're also trying to plan to update houseshows. But that could just be reducing them.

Profits and Revenue wise they're not so concerned. They're safe for another 10 years with the money they make.

Whatever happens, they don't want anyone getting bigger than the brand and that's obvious. Even more so with Roman gone.

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The interesting thing here between "the Charlotte choice to take over Becky Lynch" and "the Revival winning the titles" is how secretly related they are.

Charlotte may be a bad decision, but ultimately: The same reason that people are excited about The Revival, ostensibly a heel tag team, finally getting their face honor of getting to the top of the mountain to win the big one, is the same reason that Charlotte is suddenly thrown in the match because reasons. 

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1 hour ago, RolandTHTG said:

Does anyone remember amongst Bryan winning two matches and closing the show as champion it was at the expense of Batista and Randy Orton?

Slightly different situation here because Bryan going over Hunter one on one was the crowning moment, that was the entree. The triple threat was his victory lap, an ice cream sundae.  

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2 hours ago, muhammedboehm said:

Some of the other evidence for Ronda disliking the Boos was it wasn't short after the Becky Ronda promo where she fumbled the lines that the reports of her wanting to take time of to have a baby/go part time came out.

That isn't evidence. That's you speculating that the two things are related. It was reported that she always planned to leave when she wanted to start a family. 

 

36 minutes ago, just drew said:

Fwiw, they are short. Much shorter than 5’10.

You're really insistent about this, so do you want to share with us what you're basing it on? Nobody's forcing you to like the Revival but these arguments aren't holding up. 

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49 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said:

Also, I don't think any of us mentioned that Meltzer reported Ambrose flat out refused to cut the promo they wrote him that explained the turn, and ended up just delivering the "slay the beast" line without whatever context it was written to have.

This is what we should be gnashing our teeth about. Not the promo so much, but how they managed to completely botch a heel turn that was hotter than fish grease on the Fourth of July in just four months.

They went from having a Dean Ambrose who was barely able to contain his seething rage to him breaking at the idea of his friend being gone for who knows how long and snapping on his other friend with whom he has severe trust issues. He could have been the resident anarchist, lurking behind the arena and cutting promos about the world's despair.

But instead we get a slapdash/quasi-comedy heel who said Roman deserved leukemia with and a babyface in Rollins who has no idea what he stands for. First, he's defending Roman against Dean. Then, he's got put Dean down like a mangy dog. Next, it's his boyhood dream to be where he is. And now, he's got to slay Brock and will dance with the Devil to do so. Choose a plan and stick to it for more than two weeks, will ya?

I wouldn't be surprised if they use all this to facilitate a Rollins turn. They've got Triple H sniffing around Rollins a bit, Heyman is in the mix. Rollins is an anomaly to me. His in-ring work screams face, but his overall demeanor suggests heel, but he's only acceptable as a whiny, give him a baby bottle heel. (shrugs) 

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7 minutes ago, MORELOCK said:

That isn't evidence. That's you speculating that the two things are related. It was reported that she always planned to leave when she wanted to start a family. 

 

You're really insistent about this, so do you want to share with us what you're basing it on? Nobody's forcing you to like the Revival but these arguments aren't holding up. 

I’ve stood about 8 feet away from Scott Dawson on multiple occasions. 

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5 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

If they aren't 5'10" then what are they? 5'9"?  This sounds like an argument over an inch at most.  

You’d be surprised how many times I’m my life an inch has mattered. I think they’re probably 5’8, but for the sake of moving along I won’t bring it up again.

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58 minutes ago, Phantom Lord said:

I forgot about it last night, but reading the thread here I realized this whole "the WWE is the star" is the biggest problem. Vince himself said it last night "Becky, you think you're bigger than the WWE". 

Just when someone starts to get that rocket going that will take them to the next level, the WWE always undercuts them one way or another. I am fully convinced that while Roman might have been "Vince's guy", he didn't want him becoming so big that he'd join The Rock in Hollywood and leave him high and dry. I'm in no way saying Becky was on that trajectory, but they always do things to undercut people. I'm honestly convinced Becky would lose at Mania this year just because she needs more odds to overcome. 

Ironic, in a way. It probably drove Roman to pursue Hollywood faster. And when he returns to WWE, he'll have leverage to get more out of Vince because he's actually a more valuable commodity as his mainstream profile grows.

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