A Sincere and Well-Intended Open Letter to AEW

[Gordi the former AEW fan]

Dear All Elite Wrestling,

 

All of us here at the DVDVR strongly suspect that people from AEW at least occasionally lurk on these boards. Many of us kind of suspect that Tony Khan himself still looks in from time to time.

It's my genuine hope that this thread will gain the attention of someone at AEW who has the power to do something about this. I am not kidding about that. I hope I have earned enough goodwill here that the mods will allow this thread and my fellow posters will respond here in good faith (even if they strongly disagree with me)

 

Anyway:

I am a fan. I have been a fan since day one. I love your wrestling shows, I love your video game, I proudly wear your t-shirts and hoodies.

I want AEW to live forever. 

I mean this sincerely, and I intend it not as a complaint but as genuine advice:

Please stop spitting in the face of your true fans and hardcore supporters.

I am specifically talking about AEW Fight Forever, and the current debacle of overcharging for low-value DLC.

It's a legit debacle. People are FURIOUS. And, the people who are most upset are those of us who love AEW and love Fight Forever the most. Those of us who bought in on day 1 and support you wholeheartedly and very much want your pro wrestling promotion and your video game to succeed.

We all happily paid full price for what is clearly an unfinished game, trusting you when we were told that there would be a lot more game to come.

Specifically, every person I know who plays Fight Forever has been hoping for: More match types, and a far more robust creation suite for making CAWs. 

I personally am very much hoping that we will eventually get a GM mode. That seems like a no-brainer. Tony Khan is OBVIOUSLY a fan of EWR-type pro wrestling booking sim games. As am I. As are all of my friends who play wrestling games. PLEASE give us a booking sim mode on Fight Forever. We don't even have a way to book cards/shows in the game, as things stand now. It sure would be fun to book a tournament in the game!

We would all love more wrestlers, and continued updates to the wrestlers we have. Only a third of the wrestlers in the Continental Classic are available in the game now. Bryan, Kingston, Mox, and Andrade. No Claudio, Swerve, Garcia, Lethal, Briscoe, Jay, or Brody King. Keith Lee is available for download at an extra charge.  That's two thirds of the wrestlers in the tournament not available unless you paid for the Limitless Bunny download. (I have made a decent Claudio CAW, with the very very very limited resources available). You'll probably want to charge us for Garcia, Swerve, Switchblade, etc... I don't agree with that, but it is what it is. It's standard "screw the customers" stuff rather than spitting in our faces. But...as far as I know, there isn't even any sign that most of them are even on the way. 

You gave us updated costumes for Jericho, Mox, Kenny, Luchasaurus, Britt... and a new hairdo for Trent. For free! And that was much appreciated. More of that, if possible, please and thank you.

Instead of what we have been begging for: You gave us a Fortnight-type game. You are reportedly going to give us a Mortal Combat type ladder mode.

Nice. Thank you. Nobody I know was ASKING for that, but it's (somewhat) better than nothing.

But the current wide-spread impression is that the new mode, the new Dynamite arena, (and the new CAW Santa hat and reindeer horns that LITERALLY NOBODY was asking for) are ALL going to be behind a pay-wall. That we will have to purchase the (WILDLY overpriced) season pass or at least pay for more downloadable wrestlers to get at even that meagre extra content.

And there is zero hint that anyone is working to give us any of the things we have been asking for since launch. 

Again, this is after we PAID FULL PRICE FOR AN UNFINISHED GAME, trusting that you'd fill it out for us.

And again, people are FURIOUS about this. Not just any people. Hard core fans. The YouTube guys who have been promoting and defending this game for months are all making angry videos now. The comment sections are unanimous in agreement with them. All of my friends who play this game (a small group, but we are all passionate AEW fans) are in stunned disbelief that we are being screwed over by the company we have loved and supported from Day One and had been waiting for and dreaming of, for years.

THOSE OF US COMPLAINING NOW ARE NOT THOSE WHO HAVE BEEN BELLYACHING ABOUT EVERY LITTLE THING SINCE THE GAME WAS RELEASED. We have been happily enjoying the half-a-game we were given at launch while patiently waiting for you to deliver the rest of the premium-priced experience that we paid for. And repeatedly telling the bellyachers to just be patient.

Your company has so much good will. The impression you are giving here is that you are eager to burn through that good will as fast as possible. When good will is dwindling, as it is now, it can be built back up.

Once the good will is gone, however, it's gone for good.

 

I am sure people are willing and happy to pay for The Acclaimed. Everyone loves them, after all. I don't agree with that model, but I can accept it. Just, please don't hide basic gaming content behind that same paywall. 

 

Look at No Man's Sky, for example. Like Fight Forever, it was a victim of very high expectations at launch and people were disappointed by what they got out of the box. But, they kept adding content and updates FOR FREE and now they have a massively successful game and and endless supply of customer good will! It's a good example! Please consider following it.

 

Please consider making a Huge Announcement about how there will be more content coming that is not behind a paywall. Please go back to being the company that listens to and respects and communicates with its fans.

Even if AEW and AEW Games are separate corporate entities (I don't know what the actual case is, here) the VERY bad impression currently being generated by the latter is certainly going to have an affect on the former.

Please put out this fire. 

 

Thank you, 

In all sincerity,

 

Gordi Whitelaw,

AEW fan.

 

 

Edited November 24, 2023 by Gordlow

[twiztor]

i looked into buying this the other day. still no Samoa Joe? still no cage match?

your reference to the Continental Classic/Fight Forever crossover is scathing and a HUGE oversight. i mean, i guess this is the ultimate outcome of Tony's "new toy" mentality, but big OOOOF. 

my wait continues.

[NikoBaltimore]

I want to buy the DLC but I need assurances that there's more coming than what's announced.  The MK stuff sounds neat but it's not out now and as much as I love The Acclaimed I can't justify getting this.  Plus of all times to do it it's when Christmas season which means I'd rather spend it on shopping for others or on an actual game (hello, Steam sale!)  I still believe in the game and want to support them with everything.  But I need to hear more about what they're promising and confirming and not just going off of potential leaks.  The thing I want the most are more wrestlers and I heard one of the guys from the game say that it depends on how successful the game is.  Which is kind of bullshit as it's dangling this carrot in front of many on the roster who would love royalty checks and putting pressure on the fans to buy everything.

The other thing too is I don't believe they're going to have yearly games come out like WWE does with theirs.  For all we know this could be something where they just add a bunch of stuff over time and eventually everybody gets in.  Maybe it keeps the game fresh for some, maybe it doesn't.  Me personally I'd rather have everything all at once and go fucking nuts.  But if it's a healthy mix of lots of free updates with some low priced DLC then sure it could work.  But I'm not getting that impression with these season passes.  The other thing too is I know Kenny has given updates before on the AEW Games Youtube channel when the game was being worked on.  He's been mostly quiet since launch and if there was ever a time for him to address things it's now.

EDIT:  Okay, so checking the AEWGames Discord here's what one of the devs is saying.  "Every pack has quite a bit more with it than listed, working on getting a full list that i can give public."  He wasn't sure why this wasn't done from the start but they're working on fixing that.  Also, "The season 2 was released before any feedback or discussions of improvements. So hopefully season 3 will be the one which they listen to the fans etc and implement feedback."  He said all that can't be announced now due to them putting out fires from the backlash plus corporate stuff.  But he said they're working on getting out there what is included and the roadmap.  It might take a week but more likely a couple weeks to get that out there.  So he is honest but also at the mercy of NDAs and needing to get things cleared which is understandable.  I'll likely get the pass though maybe not today due to online shopping/Steam sales.  But at least there's a promise of something to be announced.

Edited November 24, 2023 by NikoBaltimore

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

I deleted the game from my PS5 hard drive back in August after trying to make a halfway passable Tsukasa Fujimoto and failing miserably due to the lack of CAW assets, and haven't really missed it. To see that there's a second season pass that those who bought the Elite edition don't get access without paying to is really disappointing. That really feels like a double-dip, especially considering the first season pass added very little to the game outside of a few characters that should have been in the base game to start with, and almost nothing to create people with.

It almost feels like the devs are trend-chasing, and that historically does not bode well for game development.

[Shartnado]

I bought this game's Elite Edition for my nephew upon release (for PC). A few weeks back he finally showed it to me and I was actually embarrased that I had basically forced that abomination upon him. I mean, he never has to play it if he doesn't want to but still that was not cool. Also, there were zero other players online when he showed it to me. I don't play games, my nephew is not a wrestling fan, there was nothing but the aforementioned goodwill that made me buy that game for him. There were no winners in this one, except for AEW for the short term, in a good old "fuck you, we got your money"-sense, even if it wasn't their intention.

[Octopus]

And the story mode is dumb

[Ramo2653]

Viewing the game as an update of the old AKI engine, it's fine but has a lot of room for improvement. I don't think this version will get there however.

The roster always seemed weird to me particularly the women's roster. The names are solid (I think the only missing regulars from what looks to be a 3Q 2021 cut off period are Emi and Penelope Ford, Velvet too), but some of the models are rough (the DLC Bunny is especially awful since they had extra time to work on it).

The men's roster is curious, if I'm Uno, I might be miffed since I promote and stream games and I'm not even included. But there are a few names that caught me off guard being missing like Santana and Ortiz, Hager (having 2 out of 5 members of your main heel faction for most of your company's life span seems odd), Butcher and Blade, Private Party, The Gunns, Kip, Spears, the rest of SCU etc. I'm not even saying to include all of these folks, but they have their songs in the game and it's glaring they're not in it. Heck Max provided some songs for the game and they're DLC.

The actual gameplay is fine although you can run into a habit of signature spam. Haven't touched Stampede since I'm not crazy about multi man matches personally. The story mode is repetitive since there isn't a great way to explore the different paths. Not being able to update the stats of an non-CAW in the story mode is also a choice. Also, the in game currency is odd, you end up with way more money than you'll ever spend very quickly so you just sit on it. And with the game options, I cannot figure out for the life of me why you can't just turn on the option for count outs or DQs. 

And I can't commit to the season 2 DLC without knowing what else is included and if they can't disclosure it before the first part is released, it indicates to me it's not properly mapped out which indicates bad planning and management.

[username]

They made a huge miscalculation when making this game (besides the dev time likely taking a year-plus longer than intended): they somewhat wisely realized they could only get the base of something worthwhile done for the first game; the issue is that they mistakenly believed they could deal with that as DLC and in truth they never will, the game needs a sequel and any effort spent on DLC for a dying (as a long tail experience) game is reducing the chance that said game ever gets made. Release some character packs but all real development needs to be spent on a full new release built entirely atop of what's been established, it is literally the only path to where everyone wants things to get.

[John from Cincinnati]

I didn’t buy the game and I’m not an angry YouTube guy, so now I’m worried I’m not a “true fan.”  

 

No Switchblade is wild. He just headlined a PPV! Hope y’all get better stuff. 

[Octopus]

@Gordlow, do you play on Switch? 

[Ramo2653]

2 hours ago, John from Cincinnati said:

I didn’t buy the game and I’m not an angry YouTube guy, so now I’m worried I’m not a “true fan.”  

 

No Switchblade is wild. He just headlined a PPV! Hope y’all get better stuff. 

There isn't an official roster cut off date, but if you look at the original roster and who's on it, it's sometime in Q4 2021 with Punk and Bryan being in the game. Season 1 DLC looks like Q1 2022 since Danhausen debuted then. Since we don't have any updates about the S2 stuff who knows. More details would be great.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

On 11/24/2023 at 7:08 PM, Ramo2653 said:

Viewing the game as an update of the old AKI engine, it's fine but has a lot of room for improvement. I don't think this version will get there however.

The issue there, IMO, is that the first fwo Def Jam games and the early Smackdown titles for PS2 already 'updated' that engine to  near-perfect degree - this felt to me more like a janky re-creation. Which would've been fine if all the bells and whistles were there (or adequately road mapped for the future) but content-wise, this was a LOT closer to World Tour than No Mercy. Hell, it was probably closer to Power Move Pro Wrestling. Just absolutely no meat on the bone whatsoever - if you're a creative type, there's nothing for you here.

I'm hoping for more concrete news on a release for Ultra Pro Wrestling - it seems like it's well-poised to scratch that AKI/THQ itch:

https://youtu.be/dyiOBPYt7aA?si=CmnUKa9dX9rf9Ja3

[The Green Meanie]

On 11/27/2023 at 8:47 AM, Zakk_Sabbath said:

'm hoping for more concrete news on a release for Ultra Pro Wrestling - it seems like it's well-poised to scratch that AKI/THQ itch:

https://youtu.be/dyiOBPYt7aA?si=CmnUKa9dX9rf9Ja3

Came in here to mention this game, however, it's not a good look when you're blatantly stealing the intros from WCW/NWO Revenge and Wrestlemania 2000. They've uploaded some more recent videos that aren't as egregious thankfully.

[Goitre]

I can't fathom buying Clue, the boardgame, and opening it up to find a note saying there's no Col. Mustard, wrench or ballroom yet. Scrabble, but they'll send me the vowels later.

But I'm old so I can't fathom people who sell incomplete games, nor the people who purchase them. 

Goitre, waiting for Domino's to deliver the pepperoni on my pizza separately sometime in the next few months.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Goitre

[Zakk_Sabbath]

5 hours ago, The Green Meanie said:

Came in here to mention this game, however, it's not a good look when you're blatantly stealing the intros from WCW/NWO Revenge and Wrestlemania 2000. They've uploaded some more recent videos that aren't as egregious thankfully.

I mean, I get your point - why not carve your own niche? - but hey, nostalgia sells. Half the hype for AEWFF was just "Hey, remember those N64 games?" And it didn't even end up being a close approximation! So I think the appetite for such a homage is definitely there, it's just a matter of UPW sticking the landing better than FF.

I've said it a million times, but the biggest shame in all of this is how many new fans could've been made...

And, FWIW: I'm not necessarily one of those folks clamoring for a wrestling game based on something from 4 gens ago - however, I'm an avid 2K player, and with the way it constantly crashes, deletes data randomly, etc. what I really want is a game that functions like a current gen, but is visually similar to those games (as to be less graphically intensive, hopefully leading to more stability)

Edit: I wanna use FirePro as an example here. It's not my cup of tea, like, at all, but the level of customization (despite looking like an SNES game) is fantastic. I'd be down for something along those lines but in a slightly more modern package.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Zakk_Sabbath

[Curt McGirt]

On 11/23/2023 at 10:33 PM, Gordi the former AEW fan said:

Keith Lee is available for download at an extra charge.

Because of course he is. Can we get him on TV more often for a price of equal or lesser value? Surely we can chip in together on that. 

[Log]

I get points for workouts, doctor checkups, etc from my insurance that I can then cash in for gift cards. I had enough to get a Nintendo gift card that covered the cost of FF and all the add-ons. So, I’m not really out much of anything for the game. That said, it doesn’t seem unfinished to me as much as just bare bones. I tend to play a game a ton when I first get it and then move on anyway. I unlocked Owen and Brodie, then kind of lost interest. I picked it back up when the new players were added to try them out, but that’s about it. My son still plays it a ton, so that’s a plus. 

[Octopus]

And the story mode is dumb

[The Green Meanie]

15 hours ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I mean, I get your point - why not carve your own niche? - but hey, nostalgia sells. Half the hype for AEWFF was just "Hey, remember those N64 games?" And it didn't even end up being a close approximation! So I think the appetite for such a homage is definitely there, it's just a matter of UPW sticking the landing better than FF.

I've said it a million times, but the biggest shame in all of this is how many new fans could've been made...

And, FWIW: I'm not necessarily one of those folks clamoring for a wrestling game based on something from 4 gens ago - however, I'm an avid 2K player, and with the way it constantly crashes, deletes data randomly, etc. what I really want is a game that functions like a current gen, but is visually similar to those games (as to be less graphically intensive, hopefully leading to more stability)

Edit: I wanna use FirePro as an example here. It's not my cup of tea, like, at all, but the level of customization (despite looking like an SNES game) is fantastic. I'd be down for something along those lines but in a slightly more modern package.

Oh no doubt, I agree that the nostalgia angle is well-played and not without merit, however, the video LIFTED THE EXACT SAME MOVEMENTS from both games, it was totally blatant. AEW FF did it better IMHO, by saying it was inspired by and made by the folks that made those games we all loved, whilst not being direct copies. Initially once I got a console that could actually play the game (more on that later) I looked into it and decided there wasn't enough in there (yet) to interest me in a purchase. At this point, it's going to take a bit more to sway me to pay full price. As a discount? Maybe.

Fire Pro is great not only due to the customization but also BECAUSE it looks like an SNES game.

AEW constantly saying Fight Forever was "available on your favorite console" had me always reply with "they're coming out with one for the SNES?!"

[Zakk_Sabbath]

7 hours ago, The Green Meanie said:

Fire Pro is great not only due to the customization but also BECAUSE it looks like an SNES game.

To be totally clear, it's the bell-to-bell that turns me off on those, nothing graphically - I kinda dig the vintage look, really. My 'timing' is just absolutely horrendous, the control scheme is just too much of a shift for me from the grapple-based system that's been used basically from the WCW games up to 2K19.

11 hours ago, Octopus said:

And the story mode is dumb

It sure is. Why the hell am I getting a history of the cheesesteak?! Let me go fight a guy in the dressing room or something. The Smackdown/SVR games might have been a better inspiration here than the older stuff - even the goofy bullshit was really fun. I remember one from high school where Undertaker uses his powers to turn your male character into a lady in order to fight for the women's title - I mean, cmon. That's awesome outside the box type stuff. 

This story mode sucks so bad that when I started reading @Logw's post, I legitimately thought at first when describing cashing in the wellness credits, that it was part of the story I missed. Like yeah, I've already gotta go out to eat and to the gym, why wouldn't I get points for my doctor visits, workouts, checkups...

[The Green Meanie]

26 minutes ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

My 'timing' is just absolutely horrendous, the control scheme is just too much of a shift for me from the grapple-based system that's been used basically from the WCW games up to 2K19.

It's definitely a learning curve. However once you get it down, it's like a bicycle.

[Curt McGirt]

They need to have an add-on where Danielson injures himself every couple matches.

[Octopus]

21 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:

They need to have an add-on where Danielson injures himself every couple matches.

The character is temporarily locked after every three matches 

[MoeCristyV.1.6]

And a Special Announcement DLC. Takes up 10GB on the HDD, but after you downloaded it, its just a T-shirt for your character. A Bryan Danielson shirt. 

[Coletti]

6 hours ago, MoeCristyV.1.6 said:

And a Special Announcement DLC. Takes up 10GB on the HDD, but after you downloaded it, its just a T-shirt for your character. A Bryan Danielson shirt. 

For comparison, the new God Of War rogue-lite DLC is less than 8gb