TheVileOne Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 1 hour ago, L_W_P said: I'm actually the complete opposite when it comes to the backstage BS: I hate it and it actively takes away my interest in the product. We live in a post kayfabe world. I don't need these guys to hate each other for real to be invested, in fact, I want them to all get along and have a happy work environment. That was a huge part in founding AEW right? To provide the happy alternative to WWEs soul crushing "Vince doesn't like me/Creative have nothing for me" workplace? Not saying they all need to be buddies, but the whole "work->shoot->work" stuff is just... shit. Honeymoon period of AEW is over and it's never coming back. Just ask Miro. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, L_W_P said: I'm actually the complete opposite when it comes to the backstage BS: I hate it and it actively takes away my interest in the product. We live in a post kayfabe world. I don't need these guys to hate each other for real to be invested, in fact, I want them to all get along and have a happy work environment. That was a huge part in founding AEW right? To provide the happy alternative to WWEs soul crushing "Vince doesn't like me/Creative have nothing for me" workplace? Not saying they all need to be buddies, but the whole "work->shoot->work" stuff is just... shit. Agreed. Edited April 18, 2023 by The Natural Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 3 hours ago, Krone said: I'm 32, so the height of the Monday Night Wars I was about 7-9 years old and wasn't really into wrestling the way I would be until about 2002. One of the first things that I was introduced to was rajah.com which led me to all the backstage rumors, gossip, etc and I loved reading about that stuff. Now a days, I don't have to go to any specific website to see it because it'll pop up in my Twitter feed relentlessly (without even following said people, thanks Musk) so I will just read it and graze over it. The problem I have with this backstage shooty stuff is that it seems like everyone is doing it which makes it seem less... cool? I can imagine seeing the fallout from Bret/HBK at SS '97 was interesting to some people, but now if you want to know the full story you got Sean Ross Sapp or someone else tweeting it out 5x a day. It's much more in your face than I can imagine it was back in the 90's when you really had to search for that stuff which I don't think makes me feel as much "in the know" as before. Everyone knows the backstage happenings now unless you aren't on the internet. YouTube will share backstage gossip, Facebook has the pages that'll randomly pop up and show you the backstage stuff, it's just so much easier to see now. I got to imagine it's like finding out how a magician does a trick. When you first figure it out, it's pretty cool; but by the 100th time it's just sort of like "yeah okay". Strictly speaking off the cuff, I think a big part of this was Something to Wrestle With - which was the first podcast I really listened to that broke down a lot of the backstage happenings and kind of uncovered the magic of the business somewhat. Maybe I'm being naïve, but Conrad Thompson and his litany of podcasts IMO really broke down that barrier to a broader audience of "exposing the business" if you will and it's just continued to grow with time. It started with Prichard, but now you can listen to Foley, Jarrett, Bischoff, Arn, you name it break down and go behind the scenes like you couldn't before. For instance, young me was enamored with the Rise and Fall of ECW DVD. Loved that shit. But I've tried to go back and watch it, and it's like if I really want to hear the unfiltered true story I can find a bunch of that stuff just on YouTube alone. Social media and the rise of technology has led to literally everything being way more available and it just makes the fun of being "in the know" not as... fun anymore? I mean how many wrestling "journalists" are there now compared to back in the 90s? Seems like there's one for every five fans. Couple that with wrestlers being a lot more accessible now and you kind of took the veil off of a previously pretty shrouded business. Everyone's exposed now. Imagine if Punk didn't have Instagram to keep everything going and we were just left in the dust wondering what was going to happen. Or Dax updating on a weekly basis. I imagine the people who were older during the Monday Night Wars and grew up watching wrestling several years before that felt the same way a vast majority of us (including you and me) 25 years ago. The veil lifting started well before the MNW. It just reached it's apex several years afterwards because obviously the internet boom and then the social media boom. There were brutal and nasty territory wars in the 70s and 80s, but I don't remember folks calling the competition's talent transvestites and other extremely insensitive slurs, outright shitting on the competition, and giving out spoilers for taped shows. It was well before my time, but I never heard of Bruno Sammartino or Jack Brisco burning up wrestling newsletters talking about some writer got the finish wrong of an upcoming match and reported insider news incorrectly. Funnily enough, when Niners brought up Bret not too long ago, I believe either that day or the day before I watched the Raw from 4/7/1997 where Shawn Michaels cuts the most unhinged 10 minute shoot promo about Bret Hart with Vince in the ring. That's the Raw where likely more than half the roster is in South Africa including Bret so literally 9 guys have to wrestle on the show (Austin wrestles twice cause Sid shoot no showed) and also wrestle again for the portion being taped for the next week since that's being split between matches from both Muncie, IN and Johannesburg. At no point did Shawn make a coherent point within that ten minutes. Perhaps even worse, the crux of one of the points he fails to make (that Bret doesn't run the company, Vince does) is having to openly ask Vince if he runs the company to which Vince has to very reluctantly openly acknowledge he runs the company. Now there have been points where Vince has been acknowledged or acknowledged himself as the owner so the whole "we never knew Vince was the owner prior to the Mr. McMahon character" thing falls apart. In the summer of 1994 when he got acquitted, he pretty much confirmed he at least was a higher up cause he wanted to brag about beating the U.S. government on Raw commentary. There is a weird, very long diatribe from Vince directed at Phil Mushnick from an episode of WWF Superstars in December 1995 totally unconnected from the show. Then, Austin in 1996 whenever he did commentary with Vince all but inferred Vince ran the company and he should push Austin. Then heel J.R. during the whole fake Razor and Diesel angle openly referred to Vince as the person who runs the company. However, to have Shawn catch him off guard as part of a petty tirade and not be a planned part of the show like all those other times or Vince doing it himself freely goes totally against the wrestling you would have saw in the generations before. The groundwork for a lot of the magic being gone was laid THEN. We just adore it cause for many of us, that's OUR era. 5 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 30 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said: I imagine the people who were older during the Monday Night Wars and grew up watching wrestling several years before that felt the same way a vast majority of us (including you and me) 25 years ago. The veil lifting started well before the MNW. It just reached it's apex several years afterwards because obviously the internet boom and then the social media boom. There were brutal and nasty territory wars in the 70s and 80s, but I don't remember folks calling the competition's talent transvestites and other extremely insensitive slurs, outright shitting on the competition, and giving out spoilers for taped shows In 1991, Bobby Heenan said that comparing the WCW World title to the WWF World title was like comparing Ice Cream to horse manure. On WWF telly, even. Terry Funk never said Ric Flair looked like a transvestite, but he did say Flair looked like an anorexic Barbara Bush. But it was part of the 89 feud, so it was OK. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tarheel Moneghetti Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 48 minutes ago, TheVileOne said: Just ask Miro. Just don’t ask him to job. 2 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 4 minutes ago, AxB said: In 1991, Bobby Heenan said that comparing the WCW World title to the WWF World title was like comparing Ice Cream to horse manure. On WWF telly, even. Terry Funk never said Ric Flair looked like a transvestite, but he did say Flair looked like an anorexic Barbara Bush. But it was part of the 89 feud, so it was OK. Bobby always used the horse manure line to compare something to something else (he did it like 25 times the brief time he managed the Narcissist). That was a go-to. However, that is still technically part of the same generation as a storyline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Log Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 2 hours ago, L_W_P said: I'm actually the complete opposite when it comes to the backstage BS: I hate it and it actively takes away my interest in the product. We live in a post kayfabe world. I don't need these guys to hate each other for real to be invested, in fact, I want them to all get along and have a happy work environment. That was a huge part in founding AEW right? To provide the happy alternative to WWEs soul crushing "Vince doesn't like me/Creative have nothing for me" workplace? Not saying they all need to be buddies, but the whole "work->shoot->work" stuff is just... shit. My enjoyment of the gossip, etc. isn't in how it relates to the on-air product. I'm just petty and enjoy hearing about people's bullshit. (insert Michael Jackson popcorn gif) <- Me 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerva Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 So are we getting an AEW brand split based on whether you don't want to work with Punk or you don't care if you work with Punk? Jesus even WCW didn't do shit like this and they could be done about 4 or 5 splits frankly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 1 minute ago, hammerva said: So are we getting an AEW brand split based on whether you don't want to work with Punk or you don't care if you work with Punk? Jesus even WCW didn't do shit like this and they could be done about 4 or 5 splits frankly. It’s all about whether you agree with me about Adam Page. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octopus Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 6 minutes ago, hammerva said: So are we getting an AEW brand split based on whether you don't want to work with Punk or you don't care if you work with Punk? Jesus even WCW didn't do shit like this and they could be done about 4 or 5 splits frankly. I like a 5 brand split. Dynamite - The Elite & friends Collision - CM Punk supporters Rampage - Not ready for prime time but still good DARK - NXT ROH - People that still keep in touch with Gabe 5 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammerva Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 So if we are doing a brand split then are we doing 2 PPV like 2004 and 2005 WWE? I mean you can argue they need more PPV so they won't have 5 hour shows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 17 minutes ago, Octopus said: I like a 5 brand split. Dynamite - The Elite & friends Collision - CM Punk supporters Rampage - Not ready for prime time but still good DARK - NXT ROH - People that still keep in touch with Gabe Shit, in a more sensible world: Dynamite - A show for Crew 1 Collision - A show for Crew 2 Rampage - ROH's version of pre USA NXT with various guys and gals from the other two brands who aren't in a major storyline right now. Dark - B show for Crew 1 like Heat for Raw Dark: Elevation - B show for Crew 2 like Velocity for SD 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 When it comes to CM Punk/FTR vs. The Elite/Chris Jericho, I'd much rather watch Punk/FTR. I definitely prefer Omega to the Bucks who do little for me. Best Omega is NJPW Omega. I'd imagine Bryan Danielson to be in the Punk/FTR camp plus he seems such an easy going guy who nobody has a problem with. Think Samoa Joe would be a CM Punk guy as well based on their past history. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 9 minutes ago, hammerva said: So if we are doing a brand split then are we doing 2 PPV like 2004 and 2005 WWE? I mean you can argue they need more PPV so they won't have 5 hour shows. I don't see anyone having a brand exclusive PPVs/PLEs anymore just cause that worked out badly since they didn't build enough legit programs to do a 3 hour show. Dudes were out there having matches on PPV cause someone looked at them funny and wrestling to zero heat or fan response. Yeah, I don't see that being desirable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Elsalvajeloco said: I don't see anyone having a brand exclusive PPVs/PLEs anymore just cause that worked out badly since they didn't build enough legit programs to do a 3 hour show. Dudes were out there having matches on PPV cause someone looked at them funny and wrestling to zero heat or fan response. Yeah, I don't see that being desirable. You could theoretically get a bit more value out of something like Battle of the Belts though? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elsalvajeloco Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Matt D said: You could theoretically get a bit more value out of something like Battle of the Belts though? Yep, that was exactly what I was thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porksweats Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 Just now, Matt D said: You could theoretically get a bit more value out of something like Battle of the Belts though? Battle Of The Belts, the once a Quarterly Time of year where the Elite of Dynamite and Collision collide to do battle for their belts! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octopus Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, hammerva said: So if we are doing a brand split then are we doing 2 PPV like 2004 and 2005 WWE? I mean you can argue they need more PPV so they won't have 5 hour shows. Dynamite gets Double or Nothing and Full Gear Collision gets Revolution and All Out. Rampage gets more TV Specials but isn’t big enough for a PPV Dark deserves nothing outside of @Matt D write ups RoH has its own PPV schedule Forbidden Door and All In (the years they do it) are shared. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octopus Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 WHO GETS QUAKE BY THE LAKE THO?!!!!?!?!!???!!?! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 Just now, Octopus said: WHO GETS QUAKE BY THE LAKE THO?!!!!?!?!!???!!?! In addition to: St. Patrick Day's Slam Dynamite. Grand Slam Dynamite. The biggest TV show AEW does. Winter is Coming Dynamite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 2 hours ago, TheVileOne said: Honeymoon period of AEW is over and it's never coming back. Just ask Miro. He has Twitter; fucking ask him yourself. And then post the response here. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 2 hours ago, Octopus said: I like a 5 brand split. Dynamite - The Elite & friends Collision - CM Punk supporters Rampage - Not ready for prime time but still good DARK - NXT ROH - People that still keep in touch with Gabe Sounds like the new GM Mode in wwe2k 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octopus Posted April 18, 2023 Share Posted April 18, 2023 19 minutes ago, odessasteps said: Sounds like the new GM Mode in wwe2k If so, my dude Penta’s special meter would be unbeatable with the taunting. 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Natural Posted April 19, 2023 Share Posted April 19, 2023 6 hours ago, Octopus said: If so, my dude Penta’s special meter would be unbeatable with the taunting. As would my rage meter. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Octopus Posted April 19, 2023 Share Posted April 19, 2023 27 minutes ago, The Natural said: As would my rage meter. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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