Thomas Bugg Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 I really fucking wish WWE would stop doing that shit already. They've done it on numerous occasions and, with a few exceptions like Daniel Bryan and CM Punk, the results are horrible. It fucks up careers and makes for insufferable TV. One example that immediately comes to mind is what they did with R-Truth. Here was a guy who turned heel with an attack on John Morrison (said attack will be appearing in the Heel Beatdowns thread when I can find it) and immediately started cutting promos that cemented his heel status. I mean, he was a GOOOOOOOOD R-Truth!!! Then he formed a team with the Miz (another prime example) and they immediately began raising hell in WWE. All of a sudden R-Truth gets turned face and immediately loses everything that made him popular to begin with. Another prime example is Zack Ryder. Here's a guy who was white hot in 2010-11. He gets turned face which actually worked for a bit. But look at him now- barely getting matches on Main Event, and losing those. I mean damn, just future endeavor the dude already if you're not gonna do shit with him. I'm sure there are countless other examples of heels getting turned face and losing their entertaining edge, but these are two that immediately come to mind at the moment, and with popular heels like Cesaro, The Shield and the Wyatts, another nauseating face is bound to "grace" our TV screens soon. And I know that this has happened in wrestling on countless occasions other than just WWE, but since WWE is the major promotion on TV I'm picking on them specifically. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 You passed over possibly the biggest example of this, Sheamus. He was awesome as a bully heel, ending Noble's career, beating Triple H down with a pipe and generally being a bad ass dude and then he became a smiling happy babyface. I read an interview with him a few years ago where he said he worked hard so that his gimmick wasn't an Irish stereotype and now he's a happy go lucky Irish guy who loves to fight people. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 They've been doing this for years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Ahhh so true, I never really think back to that time but when i do Diesel did become a lame face, actually so lame that it was the first time I started to loose interest in wrestling and stopped watching it weekly and not caring. So yeah looking back at history Austin and the Rock are exceptions to his trend, maybe if WWE didn't always drastically change characters when they turn face people would be more interested in the product and turns would actually work better...No that can't be true Del Rios face turn was amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Bugg Posted January 30, 2014 Author Share Posted January 30, 2014 Del Rio is an example of WWE having an awesome gimmick, face or heel, and completely fucking it up altogether. Now he's just.....there! And damn good example with Kevin Nash. Though sticking him in feuds with Mabel didn't exactly help his cause. I think it maybe could've helped if they kept him defending the WWF title against actually good wrestlers like Shawn Michaels (another exception to the rule). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Commander Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 wasn't Michaels essentially intolerable for a giant portion of his 96 Face run too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Comedian Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 While The Rock and CM Punk may be partial aversions because they maintained popularity with fans, you could argue that they both got stale very quickly as faces. It's just hard to translate smugness and arrogance to a face character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Spanish Waiter Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 While The Rock and CM Punk may be partial aversions because they maintained popularity with fans, you could argue that they both got stale very quickly as faces. It's just hard to translate smugness and arrogance to a face character. 2000 Rock is not a valid answer. 2013 Rock is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Bugg Posted January 30, 2014 Author Share Posted January 30, 2014 wasn't Michaels essentially intolerable for a giant portion of his 96 Face run too? Yeah, but it had more to do with us as males jeering him whenever tweenage girls would yell for him. That's been happening in wrestling for years. Him being insufferable was more to do with him being a dickhead behind the scenes than on TV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sublime Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 While The Rock and CM Punk may be partial aversions because they maintained popularity with fans, you could argue that they both got stale very quickly as faces. It's just hard to translate smugness and arrogance to a face character. That's true, especially for CM Punk. The Rock was able to last longer because of stuff like his relationship with Mick Foley, it gave him a relationship that grounded him more in reality. He was an arrogant prick but he had a good side. Punk never had that, that is where WWE could have used having Cabana under contract or they could have used Kofi for the role to. People are only gonna side with the asshole for so long before they realize he's just an ass, but make him look like a likable ass and they'll stick around longer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 They spent a long time on Rock's character changing, instead of it happening over night. His '99 babyface stuff he is still almost pure heel, except for who he is feuding and teaming with. He didn't really "turn" until Rumble 2000 when he helped Mick out. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Mann Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Even Austin in his heyday, at least, was a foulmouthed beerswilling contemptuous redneck but even HE had enough moral character to not want to see the Virgin Mary forcibly wed to Satan.And yes, that storyline was a ridiculous clusterfuck on the whole but that part was crucial character-wise. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Bugg Posted January 30, 2014 Author Share Posted January 30, 2014 So with the last two posts, it really goes back to these know-fuckall-about-wrestling WWE Creative guys that are ruining the characters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muhammedboehm Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 It would also help if the current roster actually at times acted like they know each other beyond the time the spend in the ring wrestling or cutting promos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 That at least dates back to the attitude era. That whole "really, they haven't talked since RAW about the big misunderstanding that cost them the tag team titles?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nofuture Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd. Is part of the problem that if you're too good of a heel nowadays, the fan's are going to start cheering for you. Yet, those same qualities that got you over get neutered when you turn face because you have to pander to the fans. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Mann Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd. That's because in some small way, we are ALL Little Jimmy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Bugg Posted January 30, 2014 Author Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd. That's because in some small way, we are ALL Little Jimmy. This moment right here should've ensured that R-Truth stay an entertaining heel for a long time. They probably ran out of ideas though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evilwaldo Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd.Is part of the problem that if you're too good of a heel nowadays, the fan's are going to start cheering for you. Yet, those same qualities that got you over get neutered when you turn face because you have to pander to the fans.That was the problem with the Shield and Wyatt's. They were just too good at being a heel they crossed the line to face in the eyes of the crowd. Part of that problem is having weak faces to match up against. Who are the strong face teams to give the heels a run?The Uso's are maybe a year away from being huge faces but in the meantime the crowd is cheering for the Wyatt's. Creative gets hilariously confused when the crowd starts to get behind heel teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallacy! Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 I really hope they don't do this with Roman Reigns, but they probably will. I envision him coming out, smiling and slapping hands with everyone at ringside and trying to get the crowd to sing along with some unintelligible samoan chant while he sets up for the spear. One thing that irked me when Randy Orton turned face a couple of years ago was how he brought back his old top rope pose. I can't even begin to rationalize the thought process that led to them thinking that was something they should do just because he's a babyface. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hooker Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 I think it has more to do with the WWE just cutting the fucking legs out from under wrestlers constantly. The R-Truth example is a great example. His heel run was fantastic, where he was making the desires of his character both immediately understandable and empathetic as well as coming up with inventive new stuff every week (he came out in a confederate soldier outfit one week, for fuck's sake!). He may not have been getting tremendous heat (although, the heat he was getting was perfectly fine), but this was contributing to some terrific television. Even the hokey wrestling stuff he did, like throwing water in a fan's face, came off far better than, say, someone like Orton would have done with the same spot. But, he was never someone that the WWE was actually going to get behind, so they took an interesting act and removed all the TV time and shoved it back down the card, and kept doing that, until he was back to "What's Up?" R-Truth again. I swear, if Roman Reigns ever dared to show something new and interesting, he wouldn't be getting pushed. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sydneybrown Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 I swear, if Roman Reigns ever dared to show something new and interesting, he wouldn't be getting pushed. Kinda like Carlito busting out a middle rope somersault plancha out of nowhere and that became his entire comeback. It was awesome at first, and then that was all he did. I feel like they know Roman is the future but can't figure out how yet, and they don't want to risk an easy angle and lose two guys on it. The obvious Ambrose-Rollins split is too obvious, and I'm hoping they stay that course. What I really hope is the Shield turns face, and Roman kicks ass while the others enjoy the glory, and when Roman gets his title shot or is about to win, THAT'S when they strike because that's when their true feelings come out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 The great R Truth heel turn went south into a face turn because Lil Jimmy got over with the crowd. That's because in some small way, we are ALL Little Jimmy. This moment right here should've ensured that R-Truth stay an entertaining heel for a long time. They probably ran out of ideas though. It's so easy to forget just how amazing Truth was during that heel turn. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kafkonia Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Truth should've gotten at least one PPV main event shot against Cena. Or at least temporarily replaced Del Rio in his interminable WHC merry-go-round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now