Matt D Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Honestly. If Rollins wasn't next in line, I'd view Neville as a serious elite 8 candidate. And no, Ishii would be losing by just as much if not more. I think, frankly, Neville's done a lot of things that Rollins has done better than Rollins. (I just think Cesaro's better than both of them) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I would agree to that as well, but Rollins has that triple threat match in his back pocket. It's his punk card that he can drop on whomever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I would agree to that as well, but Rollins has that triple threat match in his back pocket. It's his punk card that he can drop on whomever. But Neville can counter with the Zayn match which, was also one of the best matches from the voting period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 It's a MOTY contender against possibly the best triple threat match of all time. That's a tough fight. I honestly have no idea what makes it out alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 It might be the best match in the history of a sub-promotion, though. It's also, arguably, a bigger feel good moment than the Bryan win given the crummy build and last second reverse course on that. The Bryan vs HHH match means a lot more to me than the Three-Way. The Zayn vs Neville match probably means more than that. Also having Brock in a match is sort of like cheating. A big question is this: did Neville bring more to the Zayn match with his subtle heeling than Rollins brought to the three-way with his athleticism and timing. I think Neville certainly brought more to the FEUD. I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 Well one could argue that all the matches mentioned in favor of Neville (well with the exception of the Titus O'Neill match) - Neville wasn't the best worker in the match. I feel like I have to say this every time - I am indifferent on Neville. I don't mind him. The things I like I he doesn't get to do as much anymore (the taking an ass beating from a "larger" opponent - I think the Owens match is the only one I can think of from the time period). I just enjoyed Cesaro more. I sometimes favor a guy who is doing entertaining stuff despite shitty booking (I am not consistent with that belief but no one one here is) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Good points. I don't know either. Right now though, I completely love Neville's heeling and RESPECT~! more than Rollins being a weasel. EDIT: This was in response to Matt. Rippa's points are very valid and I'll admit to having a difficult time of watching stuff in a vacuum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Out of curiosity Craig, have you seen the Sin Cara match? It obviously didn't have the hype/booking/payoff of Zayn/Neville (and is now, in the last hour or so, probably on the verge of being overhyped), but for a random, meaningless throw away match that doesn't even air in the US until weeks later on the Network, it was really good and was obviously with a lower quality guy than Zayn. And this is not a knock on Neville by any stretch (I'll probably vote for him over Rollins). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Z Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I think the strongest argument for Neville is not Neville/Zayn, but the two Neville/Brodus Clay matches. Watch Neville drag that guy to the two best matches of his career. That's why he should win the whole tournament in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I thought it was pretty clear Neville was head and shoulders above Balor in there match, and thought he out performed Owens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 9, 2015 Author Share Posted March 9, 2015 I agree with you about the Balor match but that might be more because I still am struggling to come around on Balor. (Though - the most memorable stuff in that match for me was of Neville's doing.) It's funny - I liked Neville's stuff from the last time period more. But again - he was getting singles matches against the Wyatts which was up my alley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikoBaltimore Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I am fine with Neville winning, but Cesaro gets my vote. The booking issue is what kept him from having a better shot at moving up. Hard to fault him that much for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DylanWaco Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I thought the Neville/Balor match was pretty good, but nothing about it blew me away, and I wouldn't cite it as a particularly great match. I will say that I'm starting to be swayed slightly on the idea that I am underrating Neville a bit, in the sense that I thought there were aspects of what he did in the Zayn feud that were really good, and I did like several matches he was involved with that I forgot about. That said I agree with Rippa's point that ultimately he is just "there" to me. And I still don't think he is particularly good at controlling a match in compelling ways from the top OR building heat from his selling/working on the bottom. I am more than positive that I would consider the average Cesaro performance during the period, to be better than the average Neville one. And I still don't think Neville has a more volume than Cesaro either. I also can't even imagine Neville having the matches with Sheamus that Cesaro did, let alone the match with Cara. I'd be happy to be proven wrong on that, but until I am I can't vote against Cesaro in a match up like this, and I definitely don't see how he Neville was CLEARLY better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Do you think Rollins could have had those Sheamus matches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRGoldman Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 In previous years, the major point of contention has been a debate on quantity vs. quality. I think we are having a similar argument this year, but in the guise of the importance of booking. It seems like people who value story and progression tend to think that NXT workers had better years, while main roster guys a lot of times have more highly regarded matches, but have long periods of wheel spinning to go along with it. I'm not saying anything one way or another, just it's interesting how we dress up the arguments as the years change. I'm voting for Cesaro simply because Neville has never done anything for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Neville improved so much in the voting period and I would argue he finished stronger than anyone else on the roster. His last two months have been incredible. For that alone he deserves my vote. Most importantly, he didn't screw DB last year. What a travesty. Let's take a midcarder with a few high end matches over one of the most meteoric rises in pro wrestling history! That's right, it's SPITE VOTE time! Funny thing is, people are somehow trying to use the fact that Nevillie's best match from the time period was against SamI Zayn as a negative for Neville. In a contest against the guy who won last year solely because his best matches were against Sami. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Funny thing is, people are somehow trying to use the fact that Nevillie's best match from the time period was against SamI Zayn as a negative for Neville. In a contest against the guy who won last year solely because his best matches were against Sami. False, he also had great matches with Cena and Orton. Fact. I'd love to see the Cesaro who looked like a monster in the finishing stretch of the Orton match face Brock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Cesaro had really good matches with just about anyone they let him have great matches with. Also, if the Real Americans were given a full voting period to have matches as good as they were putting out just before they broke up, they do be getting elite 8 buzz off that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Cesaro is a better wrestler than Neville. Neville, however, had better matches in the time period than Cesaro. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stay Gold Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I think the first match between Neville vs Brodus also took place in the time period. I really, really enjoyed that one. People might be forgetting that one since it was a while ago. Clay's best match? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Z Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I think the first match between Neville vs Brodus also took place in the time period. I really, really enjoyed that one. People might be forgetting that one since it was a while ago. Clay's best match? I just said that on the last page and everyone chose to ignore me. Both matches were fantastic and in the time period (4/17 and 5/1). Unfortunately I can't find video of either one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCM Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Most of the reason I went with Neville is due to his improvements in non wrestling stuff. His character work during and after the Zayn match(the knee injury one) from November was outstanding. Cesaro is great bell to bell, but brings nothing else to the table. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stay Gold Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I think the first match between Neville vs Brodus also took place in the time period. I really, really enjoyed that one. People might be forgetting that one since it was a while ago. Clay's best match? I just said that on the last page and everyone chose to ignore me. Both matches were fantastic and in the time period (4/17 and 5/1). Unfortunately I can't find video of either one. Ah, sorry bud. I missed it. Could've sworn I read through every post. I wasn't as big on the second match though. Not sure why. Just remember being so impressed by the first one. Totally surprised by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 I voted for Cesaro because he's still been in a lot of good matches even if they weren't as hyped and my knock on Neville is that he wasn't the best guy in the match in most of his catalogue. Cesaro is nearly always the best guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godfrey Posted March 9, 2015 Share Posted March 9, 2015 Neville has improved leaps and bounds this year whereas Cesaro had some serious backsliding before finding his feet again teaming with Kidd. Some of that was the booking, yes, and his in ring work was never in question, but some of it was on him. Of course, it's hard to show a lot growth when you're booked to lose for months on end... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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