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SEPT WRESTLING DISCUSSION THREAD

RIPPA

By RIPPA
in The PROFESSIONAL WRESTLING

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DMN

DMN

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With the Network allowing me to go back and watch a lot of ECW, especially from very early on, I'm realizing that, despite it having a lot of flaws, and a disputable impact (in terms of whether it's a positive or negative impact, it indisputably had an impact) on wrestling, while the matches, for the most part, don't really hold up (for me, personally), the promos and characters do. So many of my favorite characters spent time in ECW;

 

The Franchise has always been one of my favorite guys. I don't think the character works for him on a larger level, he'd be a midcard guy (like he was) in WWF/WCW, but it does in ECW, and it's great.

 

Tommy Dreamer, even if he's something of a joke now, is a great, great, babyface, who earned his spot by getting his ass kicked over and over, and just never giving up. He's John Cena without the title reigns, and I think that actually makes a lot of difference.

 

New Jack is one of my favorite dudes of all time. Yeah, he's not the greatest wrestler in the world, though I do think he's underrated, in that he's not the worst, either, but he's totally believable in every thing he does.

 

Taz might be my favorite wrestler of all time who's not an 'all-time great' (like my other favorites, Terry Funk, Roddy Piper, Savage, and Jake). Part of it is the moveset, part of it is the attitude. I just can't figure out how he went from the badass dude cutting badass promos in ECW to 'let the pigeons loose!'. It's a sad devolution. I actually don't mind his height, because in actual wrestling, height is an overrated stat, anyway.

 

Sabu is, arguably, one of the greatest professional wrestlers of all-time. Definitely the most unique. If I had to describe him in one word, it's 'legit'. Everything about Sabu screams 'this dude is real' to me.

 

You have Paul E. cutting promos, even dudes like Ian and Axl Rotten are really entertaining in ECW. I even like Justin Credible!

 

A lot of ECW might not hold up, but the characters honestly do.

 

On a side note, I just want to say that 'Paperback Ryback' might be my favorite username of all time, kudos, bro.

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Yo-Yo's Roomie

Yo-Yo's Roomie

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That's an interesting question: how much of Taz' believability as a badass was just Heyman being really, really adept at protecting guys and playing to their strengths?

More important question: why doesn't the WWE protect guys and play to their strengths?

 

 

That's the thing I don't get either. It seems they go out of their way to make guys look like idiots. I remember when they put The Hart Dynasty on commentary and it was cringe worthy. On the one hand, yes, The HD should learn to talk better and sell themselves better but on the other hand, they clearly weren't ready for that sort of thing and were awful talkers, so why even put them in that position in the first place? Why not give them a manager or a valet?

 

 

Thing is, Tyson Kidd is back in NXT and week by week has become better on the mic. He's not amazing, but he's good at portraying his character and would be fine in that spot on commentary now.

 

What WWE needs to do is not pull guys up to the main show so quickly where they are going to get lost in the fray anyway; some of these guys get killed right off the bat by being put into situations that they need more practice in. 

 

 

The worst part about that is that it wasn't just Kidd and Smith being put in a situation they shouldn't have been in, it was them being put in a position they shouldn't have been in, and then Michael Cole pointing out to everyone how terrible they were in that situation. The whole thing was set up to expose them. Sometimes I think JBL is the worst commentator ever, but then I remember heel Michael Cole.

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Spritenaut 32

Spritenaut 32

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New Jack is batshit crazy but in the relm of ECW and Pro Wrestling it worked.

 

New Jack & the Gangstas were a license to print money in Smoky Mountain (and, on several occasions, an invitation to start a riot).  Jack could have been huge if he was a better worker and more controlled personality. 

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Zakk_Sabbath

Zakk_Sabbath

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Dundee's Memphis Scaffold shit puts him in another fucking league from shitty Taz.  Taz is a fucking wimp.

 

I dunno man. I like what little Dundee stuff I've seen, but maybe it's a generational divide type situation-- I'd take Taz every day of the week as a promo and in the ring. Just personal opinion, of course

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Phantom Lord

Phantom Lord

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Reguarding The Sandman in WCW, I liked how he was first introduced as Raven's snooty rich neighbor Jim. That whole emo rich kid Raven storyline they did with him and Kanyon for a few weeks (and in typical wcw fashion went nowhere) was so much fun.

 

Waspy rich suburbanite Sandman might be one of the great wrestling missed oppurtunities ever. I mean if he went back to ECW and did a whole "I'm rich" gimmick and traded in Metallica for Symphony music and the beer for Wine there might have been legit riots at ECW shows from the hate he could have gotten.

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Zakk_Sabbath

Zakk_Sabbath

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Reguarding The Sandman in WCW, I liked how he was first introduced as Raven's snooty rich neighbor Jim. That whole emo rich kid Raven storyline they did with him and Kanyon for a few weeks (and in typical wcw fashion went nowhere) was so much fun.

 

Waspy rich suburbanite Sandman might be one of the great wrestling missed oppurtunities ever. I mean if he went back to ECW and did a whole "I'm rich" gimmick and traded in Metallica for Symphony music and the beer for Wine there might have been legit riots at ECW shows from the hate he could have gotten.

 

I thought it was going to lead to a tag involving some configuration of Sandman/Raven/Piper/Kanyon so I was super stoked about it.

 

 

 

 

Question to all (I thought of this while going mad dog flooding the Nitro thread in the Network section, because, fuck it, that's what I'm doing all night):

 

Arn doesn't get hurt and retire in 1997. What is the state of WCW moving forward?

 

 

 

A butterfly effect option, if I may:

 

 

  • No NWO Horsemen parody, no neck injury for Syxx later that month while working with Flair, thus no FedEx release for Waltman, no X-Pac debuting in the WWF after XIV, no meteoric HHH rise in 1998 while leading DX... yada yada yada, the entire fucking business is different today.
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BurningBeard

BurningBeard

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Funnily enough, with all this ECW talk, I was watching WWE Vintage last night and it was an ECW special showing (somewhat) the transition from Eastern to Extreme. Out of all the footage shown the only thing that hadn't aged well was Shane Douglas. His promo style was awful (he sounds like an odd mix of psycho Backlund and Flair) and how could a belly to belly ever be a finish in the land of extreme??

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Brisco

Brisco

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Waspy rich suburbanite Sandman might be one of the great wrestling missed oppurtunities ever. I mean if he went back to ECW and did a whole "I'm rich" gimmick and traded in Metallica for Symphony music and the beer for Wine there might have been legit riots at ECW shows from the hate he could have gotten.

Would the S&M version of Enter Sandman have worked?

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Patrick B.

Patrick B.

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My eternal memory of ECW Shane Douglas was from a PPV where he was doing commentary with Joey Styles.  After Taz beat Bam Bam Bigelow, he had this gigantic spaz attack and just ranted endlessly about how Bigelow wasn't tapping out but was, in fact, REEEEEACHING FOR THE ROOOOOPE!  HE WAS REEEEEACHING FOR THE ROOOOOPE!  REEEEEACHING FOR THE ROOOOOPE!

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muhammedboehm

muhammedboehm

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You know, the Raven storyline in WCW was interesting continuity when you consider that in ECW, it was established that Raven had attended summer camp. I always imagine Raven's parents sending him to summer camp, hoping it would reform him but failing miserably.

I don't know why but reading that lead to images in my head of Raven's parents sending Blue Meanie to fat camp and Raven coming back and the parents looking at each other and saying 'baby steps'

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Vincey Greene

Vincey Greene

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So I'm skipping around the "beginning of the nWo" Nitros. I think Hogan was a good choice for the third man but his inherent hokeyness in my opinion did the angle no favors.

What if it had been Savage? Savage being a heel isn't as novel but he's nearly as iconic as Hulk and his intensity was always off the charts. I think it would have been rad.

Edit to add an additional thought: Randy was also more receptive to doing business by all accounts so maybe the angle wouldn't have eventually buried everyone except the nWo and maybe WCW wouldn't have self destructed.

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BurningBeard

BurningBeard

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I remember listening to a Nash shoot talking about the nWo and when they went to film the first set of promos - he was just utterly disappointed as Hogan was being pure Memphis heel as opposed to cool and cutting edge.

 

The production guy was just like "Don't worry, we can fix it" and thus you got this:

 

...which is still pretty hokey so imagine how bad it actually was

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