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Raw-K-Bro - 4/26/2021


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The continued lack of AJ and Omos is disappointing. 

I skip past Ryker and Riddle segments.

I don;t really give a fuck about Alexa at this point and skip or ignore her segments. 

Feeling similarly about Drew vs. Braun vs. Lashley and whatever they are doing with Dijak and Mace.

The 6-women tag was ok.

Charlotte coming back so soon via fine payment and an apology was a thing. I don't really like or dislike it. Looks like they are finally moving forward with Sonya being after Peirce's job with this. Mandy/Charlotte was pretty decent, probably Mandy's best showing since her loser leaves WWE match with Sonya last year. Hopefully they give her more chance to impress a bit.

1 hour ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

Oh, and all the women on the roster are heels now. 

Naomi and Lana haven't done anything heelish or assholish in recent times I think.

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The fact that a company with a system that produced The Revival, American Alpha, The Street Profits, and Heavy Machinery is still running "singles guys with nothing to do right now" tag teams on top is...something.

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1 hour ago, StuntmanCrowley said:

and poor Benjamin/Alexander.  They deserve better.

There's gotta be more to the Hurt Business breakup, right?  Either Cedric and Shelton had some sort of issue with Lashley or did something to piss off Vince?  They went from tag team champs and part of a hot stable to jtts who don't get angles, promo time, or even entrances in the space of a couple weeks.  Odd.

Didn't watch much of the show.  Tuned in late and tuned out for good when the Nia silliness thought.   Years ago, Metlzer or someone made a comment about WWE hiring failed Full House writers.  That's probably an insult to Full House.

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2 hours ago, Eoae said:

There's gotta be more to the Hurt Business breakup, right?  Either Cedric and Shelton had some sort of issue with Lashley or did something to piss off Vince?  They went from tag team champs and part of a hot stable to jtts who don't get angles, promo time, or even entrances in the space of a couple weeks.  Odd.

The general rumor is that absolutely no one but Vince wanted to break up the Hurt Business with MVP and Lashley trying to convince him to not do so.

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28 minutes ago, Eivion said:

The general rumor is that absolutely no one but Vince wanted to break up the Hurt Business with MVP and Lashley trying to convince him to not do so.

I wouldn't take that as rumor.  The guy is such a piece of shit that of course he'd do that just to spite those that liked the group.  God forbid people like something that's not supposed to be liked.

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7 minutes ago, NikoBaltimore said:

I wouldn't take that as rumor.  The guy is such a piece of shit that of course he'd do that just to spite those that liked the group.  God forbid people like something that's not supposed to be liked.

Lol, you're taking it a little too personally.  

That said, I feel like it was leaving money on the table.  Does the company still sell much merch during the pandemic?  Under normal circumstances, I'd guess crowds would have babyfaced the Hurt Business a good while back and then bought up HB merch.  

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If that's true about Vince wanting to break up THB, then those guys should have taken a stand like Roman, Rollins, and Ambrose did and say, "nope, not going to happen, we're not doing it."

And then if that fails, you go the Kofi route and have Lashley threaten and challenge Vince to a fight.

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6 minutes ago, Eoae said:

Under normal circumstances, I'd guess crowds would have babyfaced the Hurt Business a good while back and then bought up HB merch.  

I think the fear of the crowd babyfacing them and Lashley up at Wrestlemania is why Vince wanted them broken up. 

2 minutes ago, Craig H said:

And then if that fails, you go the Kofi route and have Lashley threaten and challenge Vince to a fight.

But then Lashley looks bad for beating up a 70+ year old man though Vince probably would have respected him more for it. Yeah, fuck it, they should have gone this route.

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8 minutes ago, Eoae said:

Lol, you're taking it a little too personally.  

That said, I feel like it was leaving money on the table.  Does the company still sell much merch during the pandemic?  Under normal circumstances, I'd guess crowds would have babyfaced the Hurt Business a good while back and then bought up HB merch.  

That did give off more of a hostile tone than intended so my apologies.  But I'm not taking it personally, just not surprised considering his history with cutting off things that gained traction that he didn't want to.

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35 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I think the fear of the crowd babyfacing them and Lashley up at Wrestlemania is why Vince wanted them broken up. 

Probably.  I don't agree, but I definitely think live crowds would have turned them by now.  The idea of babyface Lashley doesn't do much for me personally, but Lashley's been a heel for a long time, so it may be time to turn him (has he been a babyface during this run with the company?)

It could be worse.  Bryan Alvarez thought Baron Corben was the new member of the HB after he interfered in Lashley's match before WrestleMania.  Ugh.

I wonder how much sense Vince still has for these sorts of things.  It wouldn't surprise me if he's lost his touch for knowing when to push guys or not (a case can be made that he lost touch with the fans years ago).  Per Meltzer, The Shane-Braun "stupid" stuff was done because Vince thought fans would cheer Shane unless he did something really vile to get himself over as a heel.  I mean, I dunno that Shane is so innately likable that no one wants to boo him.  

On the other hand, I think they've done a better job figuring out who to push or not since Heyman was fired.  Only my opinion, but I never believed Aleister Black or Ricochet were going to get over very well.

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22 minutes ago, Eoae said:

I wonder how much sense Vince still has for these sorts of things.  It wouldn't surprise me if he's lost his touch for knowing when to push guys or not (a case can be made that he lost touch with the fans years ago).  Per Meltzer, The Shane-Braun "stupid" stuff was done because Vince thought fans would cheer Shane unless he did something really vile to get himself over as a heel.  I mean, I dunno that Shane is so innately likable that no one wants to boo him.  

 

remember that Evil Mr. McMahon was a late pivot and that he thought "Bret Screwed Bret" and kvetching about Bret not doing "the time honored tradition" would make him a babyface post-Montreal

some of it's not age, it's echo chamber

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27 minutes ago, Eoae said:

I wonder how much sense Vince still has for these sorts of things.  It wouldn't surprise me if he's lost his touch for knowing when to push guys or not (a case can be made that he lost touch with the fans years ago).  Per Meltzer, The Shane-Braun "stupid" stuff was done because Vince thought fans would cheer Shane unless he did something really vile to get himself over as a heel.  I mean, I dunno that Shane is so innately likable that no one wants to boo him.  

Vince has lost enough sense for these things that he really shouldn't be steering the ship at the very least. When Shane returned he got Bryan and above levels of cheers from the audience. They did enough though with his last run to end most of that good will over time. He might have gotten some cheers, but he was never going to be loved or anything. If anything I suspect the fear was more about how much they damaged Braun this past year.

27 minutes ago, Eoae said:

On the other hand, I think they've done a better job figuring out who to push or not since Heyman was fired.  Only my opinion, but I never believed Aleister Black or Ricochet were going to get over very well.

Ricochet was the type of guy who needed a mouth piece or to stay in NXT. He has charisma, but he can't talk worth a damn time. I actually didn't think he was doing too well when they were pushing him in those feuds with AJ and Joe. Black on the other hand can talk ok and has enough physical charism to bypass his weaknesses as a character. He was just used poorly. I'm not even a fan, but even I can't deny he has way more potential than what they have gotten out of him so far. He is hurt more by being a guy Vince likely doesn't get than his own shortcomings.

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The weird Vince-mandated character turn that sticks with me is Vince breaking up Legacy thinking the crowd would get behind DiBiase Jr. and propel him on a huge babyface run.  Instead, the crowds babyfaced Orton - the sociopath with a rage disorder who only a short time earlier feuded with the McMahons, punting the male McMahon's in the head and rko'ing Stephanie then trying to kick her in the head.  There was nothing likable about Orton's character back then, but the crowds cheered him rather than woodman Ted Jr.  Meltzer and Alvarez occasionally bring this up and claim most people in the company thought it was a bad idea and that there was no sign from fans that they wanted a Ted Jr. babyface push.  But Vince persisted.

DiBiase's push died almost immediately and he and Cody floundered.  That probably wasn't a big loss.  But Orton turned babyface and arguably never recovered from that.  Apparently. Randy wasn't really in favor of the turn and seemed mostly bored during his face run.  Fans kinda soured on him around this time and i'm not sure he's ever gotten his momentum back.   He was a very good heel from the Randy News Network days through Legacy.  His stuff with Cena back then was great (I still remember him dragging Cena Sr, out of the crowd to beat on him).

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Orton prefers being a heel in general. He only started to be more ok with being a face once his children were born. I can never understand what they saw in Dibiase Jr. He did ok in his initial appearance, but Cody overtook him almost immediately as a character when the two joined as a team.

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1 hour ago, Eoae said:

The weird Vince-mandated character turn that sticks with me is Vince breaking up Legacy thinking the crowd would get behind DiBiase Jr. and propel him on a huge babyface run.  Instead, the crowds babyfaced Orton - the sociopath with a rage disorder who only a short time earlier feuded with the McMahons, punting the male McMahon's in the head and rko'ing Stephanie then trying to kick her in the head.  There was nothing likable about Orton's character back then, but the crowds cheered him rather than woodman Ted Jr.  Meltzer and Alvarez occasionally bring this up and claim most people in the company thought it was a bad idea and that there was no sign from fans that they wanted a Ted Jr. babyface push.  But Vince persisted.

DiBiase's push died almost immediately and he and Cody floundered.  That probably wasn't a big loss.  But Orton turned babyface and arguably never recovered from that.  Apparently. Randy wasn't really in favor of the turn and seemed mostly bored during his face run.  Fans kinda soured on him around this time and i'm not sure he's ever gotten his momentum back.   He was a very good heel from the Randy News Network days through Legacy.  His stuff with Cena back then was great (I still remember him dragging Cena Sr, out of the crowd to beat on him).

They never actually did the diBiase face turn though (well not on Orton). They teased it, but he never went baby until much later on when Cody was doing the 'clear mask' gimmick. But I think the problem was that I think WWE thought you could have diBiase pussy out of turning on Orton a bunch of times. That's what killed the turn, and that's why they didn't do it. I remember a few years on they messed up Beth Phoenix's babyface turn in a similar way and she never really got over as a babyface, despite fans clearly wanting to cheer her.

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I only watched like the first half hour of the show. After the tomato bit I decided to not watch the rest. It's a shame Bobby Lashley is stuck as champion during this terrible time. If ratings continue to fall, they will blame him when it's not his fault.

 

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