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He must now face Nakanishi in a 30 minute singles match. Let's see what he's really made of! Also, if Nakanishi can go longer than 5 minutes without just throwing in the towel due to being tired from doing his own offense.

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Was all about backstage politics and not wanting NJPW in charge. Anyway, the owner's a NJPW fanboy and there are former staffers from NJPW in the back. 

And I just realized..seems the isolation policy has ended?

Edited by D.Z
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So I'm telling people in a Facebook group that I'm in about how NJPW rose from a shitshow to the phenomenon that it is today. Admittedly, I didn't watch it a lit in the mid-2000's for the obvious reasons, and I would hear about how bad it was from sites like Strong Style Spirit or whatever. What exactly is "Tenzan must suffer"? Was Inoki or Choshu fucking him over?

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58 minutes ago, Thomas Bugg said:

So I'm telling people in a Facebook group that I'm in about how NJPW rose from a shitshow to the phenomenon that it is today. Admittedly, I didn't watch it a lit in the mid-2000's for the obvious reasons, and I would hear about how bad it was from sites like Strong Style Spirit or whatever. What exactly is "Tenzan must suffer"? Was Inoki or Choshu fucking him over?

Mid-2000s was generally decent. it was just such a downfall with aces losing their potential due to bad booking and the IWGP Heavyweight Title being hot potatoed around way too much. Tenzan was just never intended to be in the ace position. Also at least one of his  title losses was kind of an accident. Can't recall what happened exactly, but that match with Kojima was supposed to be a draw.

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Didn't Tenzan's back just give out on him? It's a shame considering how good Tenzan was and how badly he'd eventually break down. In saying that, we did get a fun Kojima/Nakamura out of that accidental switch. 

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I forgot he won the second time because he accidentally KO'd Nagata with a moonsault in the semifinals of a title tournament Nagata was supposed to win. And the tournament only happened because Nakamura got hurt. So it's kinda like a double accident win. 

If they had just stuck to the original plan (Tenzan wins the G1, pins Takayama in the Dome main event, finally has his long run with the belt), they would have been fine. Pulling the title win off the Dome took all the air out of the balloon for when he finally did beat Takayama. 

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Am I the only person who doesn't think that highly of Tenzan? Awkward, dangerously sloppy, and needed a superior opponent to do great things. He's not bad but I think he actually got more than what he "deserved". 

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9 minutes ago, Oyaji said:

Am I the only person who doesn't think that highly of Tenzan? Awkward, dangerously sloppy, and needed a superior opponent to do great things. He's not bad but I think he actually got more than what he "deserved". 

He was never a favorite for me. I never found myself clamoring for him to have a big run with the belt, but I also only started watching around 04 so I can see why people who were following him before that might have been pulling for him to succeed.

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Agreed. It's either the G1 final vs. my boy Jun at his peak or the match I loved to fucking BITS as a kid: May 6, 2002, Cho-Ten vs. GOTCH-ISM (Nakanishi/Nishimura) going broadway for the tag titles. I have no idea how that match holds up but I remember they did a great job of using smoke and mirrors with Nakanishi picking up an "injury" leaving (the criminally underrated and underused) Nishimura to sell his ass off for the Cho-Ten. Nakanishi makes the heroic return to rapturous applause and kicks ass but it's still not enough. 

I know he was a throwback and lacked Tenzan's charisma and colour but Nishimura was twice the wrestler Tenzan was. It's a shame Nishimura didn't get to do more during that awesome run he went on when he returned from beating cancer. I'm reading the portion of Eggshells where Inoki-ism is running wild and it's bringing a lot of bad memories back. As we've recently discussed, there was a lot of good wrestling going on despite the booking and business decisions being made but what could have been... WHAT COULD HAVE BEEN?

edit: oh shiiiiiiit. I totally forgot about Nishimura being the white meat babyface that the returning MiSu destroyed in those really neat matches! Wait.. what? Nishimura won the first match and then they had two draws? I do not remember it going down that way at all. I need to see those.

Edited by Oyaji
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9 hours ago, Oyaji said:

Am I the only person who doesn't think that highly of Tenzan? Awkward, dangerously sloppy, and needed a superior opponent to do great things. He's not bad but I think he actually got more than what he "deserved". 

No, I never really got the fascination with him either. Which was weird for me since lots of old timers were basically using his usage as an example of how fucked up NJPW is.

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9 hours ago, Oyaji said:

Am I the only person who doesn't think that highly of Tenzan? Awkward, dangerously sloppy, and needed a superior opponent to do great things. He's not bad but I think he actually got more than what he "deserved". 

I never appreciated Tenzan until I actually went back and watched some of his stuff when they looked like they were building him to be the ace as well as a lot of old TenKoji stuff. Maybe as I was getting into NJPW at that time, I look at him through rose-tinted glasses a little bit. 

Definitely preferred Kojima and Nagata to him though in terms of his direct generational rivals. 

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14 hours ago, Oyaji said:

Agreed. It's either the G1 final vs. my boy Jun at his peak or the match I loved to fucking BITS as a kid: May 6, 2002, Cho-Ten vs. GOTCH-ISM (Nakanishi/Nishimura) going broadway for the tag titles. I have no idea how that match holds up but I remember they did a great job of using smoke and mirrors with Nakanishi picking up an "injury" leaving (the criminally underrated and underused) Nishimura to sell his ass off for the Cho-Ten. Nakanishi makes the heroic return to rapturous applause and kicks ass but it's still not enough. 

I know he was a throwback and lacked Tenzan's charisma and colour but Nishimura was twice the wrestler Tenzan was. It's a shame Nishimura didn't get to do more during that awesome run he went on when he returned from beating cancer. I'm reading the portion of Eggshells where Inoki-ism is running wild and it's bringing a lot of bad memories back. As we've recently discussed, there was a lot of good wrestling going on despite the booking and business decisions being made but what could have been... WHAT COULD HAVE BEEN?

edit: oh shiiiiiiit. I totally forgot about Nishimura being the white meat babyface that the returning MiSu destroyed in those really neat matches! Wait.. what? Nishimura won the first match and then they had two draws? I do not remember it going down that way at all. I need to see those.

Your Nishimura talk reminds me that he pretty damn good match with Kawada for the Triple Crown and a likewise great match with Fujinami in Draditioin which is the only time I've actually seen reversing the figure four win a match

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Nishimura and Fujinami vs Mutoh and Kea for the IWGP tag belts is a forgotten classic. I remember a spot where Mutoh hits the Shining Wizard on Fujinami by springing off Kea's chest while Fujinami has Kea in the Dragon Sleeper. Unless I dreamed that spot but I'm pretty sure it's in the match. I still love Tenzan tho. 

Edited by Belgian_Waffle
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