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POST SURVIVOR SERIES 2018 DISCUSSION THREAD

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It needs to be said that diehards like us are now arguing what women deserve the main event match at WrestleMania, on top of when we're carrying on about how Bayley and Sasha and Asuka are misused. And there's depth in the roster when you consider what a star Alexa Bliss has become. Or the The Riott Squad can carve up a lot of really good quality TV time with whoever you put them with. Or that Ember Moon is a pretty great hand (without much in the way of character) or the IIconics are really good stooge heels. 

Have they ever talked about giving the women their own show? Hell, I'd watch Smackdown weekly if it was just everyone in the women's division.

This is just the progressive in me really happy that women's wrestling is a thing in my life. They have so much talent and they're being used really well. That's not to say the booking is perfect (it never is). But they have a whole bunch of people who can absolutely main event any pay-per-view they want. Awesome to see.

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8 minutes ago, just drew said:

Idk. The Charlotte thing kinda reminds me of when they thought the “yes chant” was over, not Daniel Bryan. People like violence. Becky’s gonna keep getting the better reaction. If they have to run Charlotte/Ronda, Becky/Nia is a decent consolation prize, but the $ is Becky/Ronda

Yes and no.

This was absolutely not Big Show vs Randy Orton from Survivor Series 2013. 

Or maybe it was in a world where that match hugely worked?

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As much as id like the idea of a womens show.....I still think it's a great thing that we could have a womens main event for mania at some point.  The women are absolutely killing it.

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It should at least be really clear that Charlotte can do pretty much anything and the only problem with her has been stale booking/writing.

That whole match was crazy fast and intense and would have stolen the show even without the beat down at the end. But that was seemed like the beginning of a potentially legendary feud with how much Charlotte can do and how much Ronda can take and to have a babyface with a deadly submission and a heel who has psychologically traumatized her is perfect.

But then there's Becky. There's always a Becky somewhere. It does seem like WWE is getting a little addicted to the Becky heat. Now they've had Charlotte do it and it was amazing. Next they'll have Ronda do it. Maybe that's great and the women's division can be the new non-PG part of the card. But the crowd is an issue because they are so conditioned now to

1) Not want to cheer Charlotte

2) turn on Ronda at a moment's notice just because she's a babyface and an "outsider"

3) Already made up their tribal mind that Becky is the thing they chant no matter what they're watching in front of them

and I don't trust creative to book a triple threat that is anything but a storyline clusterfuck.

Honestly I'd be happy if we just got a nice long Charlotte/Ronda feud with a 70s feel of brutality and intensity to look back on in a nice comp. tape without the writing fucking it up.

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12 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

I was thinking this too.  What did Ronda do to you? She came into WWE and is working a full time schedule. She is pretty damn great right now. She's improving in all areas very quickly. She's on the road with the boys (or girls).  She's busting her ass.  But now people wanna boo her?   Why?  And Charlotte,  who was receiving boos all year,  is now getting cheered all of a sudden because she turned heel.  

I blame creative for a lot of things and I do believe Vince has lost it but the fans are wildly inconsistent too.  I am starting to believe a little bit in the "blame the fans" rhetoric. 

 

I think Charlotte got cheered because she was the proxy for Becky. The moment Becky returns, I'm not sure Charlotte can retain being over like she was tonight

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I was nervous watching the first half of Lesnar vs. Bryan with Bryan's health issues, those went into the second half of the match. I will say I preferred Lesnar vs. Styles to Lesnar vs. Bryan but I've seen the former twice while the latter just the once.

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Can't be the only one who heard the "Same old shit" chants to Brock Lesnar's lame ass routine. Bang on that.

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7 minutes ago, Matt D said:

Yes and no.

This was absolutely not Big Show vs Randy Orton from Survivor Series 2013. 

Or maybe it was in a world where that match hugely worked?

I agree that the match was much better, and I don’t want to take away from Charlotte. She was fantastic. I do think part of the reason Charlotte got cheered like that is because she’s Becky’s proxy. I’m worried that they’ll go away from Becky/Ronda, though they could do that at the Rumble. Non title, if they’re both still the champs.

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12 minutes ago, Greggulator said:

 Have they ever talked about giving the women their own show? Hell, I'd watch Smackdown weekly if it was just everyone in the women's division.

They've talked about it and I could see it happening eventually but what I really want is more story lines for the women without a belt.  Just straight up grudge matches.  

We talked about the two title matches that are possible for WrestleMania.  But outside of that it's a five hour show.  Why not book Sasha vs. Asuka in a singles match or finally do the Sasha vs. Bayley angle or Sasha vs. Trish that everyone wants to see or do Ember Moon vs. Asuka again etc.   That's what I want to see for the division. 

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5 minutes ago, The Natural said:

Can't be the only one who heard the "Same old shit" chants to Brock Lesnar's lame ass routine. Bang on that.

You definitely weren't.

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Paul's "OMG he is going to kill him" reaction was great.  Didn't like Brock kicking out of two knee strikes, but I have come to expect it with Brock matches.

Oh and Ronda is awesome.  I haven't watched  much of the weekly stuff lately, but her PPV matches don't disappoint.  Easily match of the night.

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Fuck it, just book all the women for Mania and just have Brock and Bryan defend their titles and throw all the men into one giant battle royale or something. I'm sure we could all come up with a Mania card with all women with two token men's title matches and one "get every man on the card" battle royal. 

Ripley v Storm

Bazler v Cross - NXT Women's Championship

Sasha v Bayley

Pat Patterson Memorial Battle Royal (They'll change it when they remember Pat's still alive)

Asuka v Moon

Naomi v Lita

Bryan v Ali - WWE World Championship

Mickie v Trish

Charlotte v. IIconics - 2 on 1 elimination handicap match

Brock v. McIntyre - WWE Universal Championship

Becky v. Rousey - Winner is the Undisputed Women's Champion

 

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5 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

They've talked about it and I could see it happening eventually but what I really want is more story lines for the women without a belt.  Just straight up grudge matches.  

We talked about the two title matches that are possible for WrestleMania.  But outside of that it's a five hour show.  Why not book Sasha vs. Asuka in a singles match or finally do the Sasha vs. Bayley angle or Sasha vs. Trish that everyone wants to see or do Ember Moon vs. Asuka again etc.   That's what I want to see for the division. 

I think the only time we got extended angles for Women without a title being involved was Nikki's initial SD run after the first brand split. But those angles were all focused around people being mad at Nikki which is I guess a good example of having a developed character?

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13 minutes ago, The Natural said:

I was nervous watching the first half of Lesnar vs. Bryan with Bryan's health issues, those went into the second half of the match. I will say I preferred Lesnar vs. Styles to Lesnar vs. Bryan but I've seen the former twice while the latter just the once.

I thought we were going to get more of Bryan working on Lesnar's knee (like the famous Morishina match at ROH Manhattan Mayhem II) before his knee went out on him in the F5 setting up the Yes Lock. Great spot that as was the Triangle to F5.

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1 minute ago, badfish69 said:

Paul's "OMG he is going to kill him" reaction was great.  Didn't like Brock kicking out of two knee strikes, but I have come to expect it with Brock matches.

That was my biggest issue. One, yeah but not two.

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Fans are conditioned to shit on Brock matches now and rightly so.  By the end of the match everyone was on the edge of their seat and the online reaction seems to be overwhelmingly positive.  I do think Brock has been lazy but so was the booking.  Tonight proved they can do so much more with him than they have been.  He will bump and sell his ass off if it's required. He took some sick shots and a couple crazy bumps this evening.  He's getting paid a lot of money,  they should require that performance from him more often,  tonight showed he is still capable.   I know @Matt D and others don't want to hear that but I really think Brock has a lot left in the tank if they push him into competitive feuds. 

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1 minute ago, The Natural said:

I thought we were going to get more of Bryan working on Lesnar's knee (like the famous Morishina match at ROH Manhattan Mayhem II) before his knee went out on him in the F5 setting up the Yes Lock. Great spot that.

Manhattan Mayhem II was a great show.

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Have we discussed Drake Maverick peeing his pants yet?

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1 minute ago, Web Conn said:

Have we discussed Drake Maverick peeing his pants yet?

 

43 minutes ago, The Natural said:

Drake Maverick at Survivor Series:

DrBuRDEU0AA03nE?format=jpg

 

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2 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

They've talked about it and I could see it happening eventually but what I really want is more story lines for the women without a belt.  Just straight up grudge matches.  

We talked about the two title matches that are possible for WrestleMania.  But outside of that it's a five hour show.  Why not book Sasha vs. Asuka in a singles match or finally do the Sasha vs. Bayley angle or Sasha vs. Trish that everyone wants to see or do Ember Moon vs. Asuka again etc.   That's what I want to see for the division. 

I want that, too. But while I know everyone complains about how they have too much TV time... they have a finite amount of television time and a lot of material they want to capture. It's a balancing act. If you want to get Sasha vs. Bayley as a feud without a title and really tell the story, what men's stuff do you get out of the way on Raw? Does this mean there are now even less tag feuds going on then? Less time for Elias to do his thing?

Or who loses time so we can get an Asuka vs. Naomi feud over something on Smackdown?

It's just the nature of having a loaded roster. Someone loses out. Creative choices have to be made. I really do want to see a great sub-feud though.

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4 minutes ago, Ramo2653 said:

I think the only time we got extended angles for Women without a title being involved was Nikki's initial SD run after the first brand split. But those angles were all focused around people being mad at Nikki which is I guess a good example of having a developed character?

Nikki is an easy target.  They did the whole "you slept your way to the top" story three times.  Now,  maybe they are headed that way.  Riot Squad and Natalya are cooking something up and Mandy seems to be getting stuff to do over on SDL,  it's not enough time being allocated to women feuds but it's a start.  

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4 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Fans are conditioned to shit on Brock matches now and rightly so.  By the end of the match everyone was on the edge of their seat and the online reaction seems to be overwhelmingly positive.  I do think Brock has been lazy but so was the booking.  Tonight proved they can do so much more with him than they have been.  He will bump and sell his ass off if it's required. He took some sick shots and a couple crazy bumps this evening.  He's getting paid a lot of money,  they should require that performance from him more often,  tonight showed he is still capable.   I know @Matt D and others don't want to hear that but I really think Brock has a lot left in the tank if they push him into competitive feuds. 

You know those photos of people with wheelbarrows full of money in the Weimar Republic? That's all of us after a Brock match, victims of inflation.

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I've seen a lot of complaining (not as much here as other places) from people upset that Nia got "rewarded" with the big win tonight and angry about how they are using Becky's legit injury now as a story to get Nia more over as a heel. I wonder how long those people have been watching wrestling. Turning a legit injury in to a storyline is as old as wrestling itself. I mean,  I BROKE YAHOO'S LEG, OWEN 316, even Rollins exploding Cenas nose as a more recent example. But I guess since Becky is the chosen one right now and hating Nia is the "cool thing" all of a sudden this is exploitative and "only happening because who Nia is related to". 

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WWE confirming what we knew, cares little for the Kickoff matches. Poor Smackdown going 6-0. Usually it's the draft where Smackdown gets the kicking.

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31 minutes ago, Web Conn said:

Have we discussed Drake Maverick peeing his pants yet?

I would have been ok with it if Spud pulled a catheter bag full of water out of his pants after the match and pointed to his head, showing he outsmarted the Big Show. As just an excuse to throw in some Vince toilet humor, it was dumb.

On a side note, removing full catheters from decedents is absolutely disgusting. Hospital, nursing home staff, and hospice nurses are supposed to do that, but very rarely do, in my experience.

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