WORLDS END - 12/30/2023

[Octopus]

7 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

It was an ultra-exaggerated, even more contrived version of the Dusty finish. It teases a babyface beating the heel champion and winning the title but ultimately ends with the title back on the heel champion. Made even dumber and worse by the fact they set up a title shot battle royal on the same night to have Killswitch win only to promptly hand over the shot back to Christian after he lost. Dumb garbage.

Different feelings on this one, friend. I was kicking my tentacles so hard when these shenanigans started happening. Christian is such a stinker. If this was a Dusty Finish than I am joyously coughing from moving beloved family heirlooms around in my dusty attic. 

[John from Cincinnati]

57 minutes ago, Andrew POE! said:

I'm surprised that WWE is even entertaining the idea of taking him back, especially considering the fight he had with Sammy Guevara.

They can probably look at the fact that they employed him for however long without much real punching and shrug and tell themselves it’s the other place and they’ll be fine. 

[TheVileOne]

1 minute ago, Octopus said:

Different feelings on this one, friend. I was kicking my tentacles so hard when these shenanigans started happening. Christian is such a stinker. If this was a Dusty Finish than I am joyously coughing from moving beloved family heirlooms around in my dusty attic. 

My problem with this is they've been doing this business with Christian controlling Killswitch/Luchasaurus and basically abusing him since going back to the Jack Perry feud. They've teased him turning on Cage since it looked like he was going to attack Nick Wayne's mom. I just don't see how much longer they can drag this out because they were already doing the PPV rematch here with Copeland after he lost the first title match on TV. 

If they can make some sort of compelling development here with how Christian is controlling Killswitch and what secret he has here maybe this can work, but I dunno. This felt counter-intuitive. 

[Octopus]

7 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

My problem with this is they've been doing this business with Christian controlling Killswitch/Luchasaurus and basically abusing him since going back to the Jack Perry feud. They've teased him turning on Cage since it looked like he was going to attack Nick Wayne's mom. I just don't see how much longer they can drag this out because they were already doing the PPV rematch here with Copeland after he lost the first title match on TV. 

If they can make some sort of compelling development here with how Christian is controlling Killswitch and what secret he has here maybe this can work, but I dunno. This felt counter-intuitive. 

Maybe Christian has an amulet that controls all dinosaurs 

[TheVileOne]

To share something positive here, the timing between Nigel and Adam here was perfect. And Nigel was great, as per usual, on commentary last night.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/18vdm0x/spoilers_aew_worlds_end_nigel_mcguinness_gets/?ref=share&ref_source=link

EDIT:

Twitter version:

https://twitter.com/DrainBamager/status/1741456534511776028

Edited December 31, 2023 by TheVileOne

[Matt D]

7 minutes ago, Octopus said:

Maybe Christian has an amulet that controls all dinosaurs 

This just makes me frustrated we didn't get the Lucha Underground invasion with Matanza and Dario as the devil.

[Octopus]

 

Hey guys, Samoa Joe is champ

[Cobra Commander]

Christian Cage is actually one of the more realistic cult leader characters in wrestling compared to the ones that just use spooky magic. Christian's operating more in the spirit of "guy running a self-help service to find vulnerable people to exploit" cults

For all the talk and jokes about Jack Perry returning, just bring Jack Perry back in the Christian group as if they abducted him off the streets and put him in a reeducation camp.

[Cobra Commander]

I had a different more graphic version of "guy running a self-help service to find" ready.. which upon thinking about it, would make it sound more like Christian was doing a Tucker Max gimmick as opposed to the almost Keith Raniere gimmick he's doing.

It's been long enough but I still don't think you could do a Tucker Max ripoff gimmick without accidentally causing your dumbest male fans to get behind the guy.

[odessasteps]

When I was working for MCW, Jimmy Cicero was doing a pyramid scheme type gimmick called Total Quality Management and I saw so many of those books when I shelved the business section of Borders in the late 90s. 
 

As for cult leaders … 

 

[Cobra Commander]

I'm guessing doing a satire of Crossfit would hit a little too close to home for the wrestlers that seem like big time Crossfit guys

but in the spirit of Christian's group, i'm expecting that Killswitch and Wayne give all their money to Christian and get a stipend in return.

[odessasteps]

Who did the WWE evil personal trainer gimmick? Was that Nova and the Simon System? 

 

Edited December 31, 2023 by odessasteps

[Kev]

1 hour ago, TheVileOne said:

To share something positive here, the timing between Nigel and Adam here was perfect. And Nigel was great, as per usual, on commentary last night.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/18vdm0x/spoilers_aew_worlds_end_nigel_mcguinness_gets/?ref=share&ref_source=link

EDIT:

Twitter version:

https://twitter.com/DrainBamager/status/1741456534511776028

This moment was good. But as a counterpoint, Nigel’s heel schtick is awful. It stinks of toxic WWE commentary from 2018-21ish. There’s no need for a commentator without any storyline background in the company to be making himself such a character. He’s so much better just doing straight colour with the occasional dad joke thrown in. (As an aside, heel commentators generally feel like a relic).

I’m slightly more sympathetic if this is leading to a Danielson match. But if that is happening, I presume it’d be at Wembley with him as hometown hero, so the aggressive heeling seems counterproductive.

Also, why the fuck has he insisted on running with ‘clam digger’ as an insult? (I’m being semi-rhetorical, I think I get it, it’s just terrible). 

[TheVileOne]

3 minutes ago, Kev said:

This moment was good. But as a counterpoint, Nigel’s heel schtick is awful. It stinks of toxic WWE commentary from 2018-21ish. There’s no need for a commentator without any storyline background in the company to be making himself such a character. He’s so much better just doing straight colour with the occasional dad joke thrown in. (As an aside, heel commentators generally feel like a relic).

I’m slightly more sympathetic if this is leading to a Danielson match. But if that is happening, I presume it’d be at Wembley with him as hometown hero, so the aggressive heeling seems counterproductive.

Also, why the fuck has he insisted on running with ‘clam digger’ as an insult? (I’m being semi-rhetorical, I think I get it, it’s just terrible). 

He's calling Danielson a clam digger because he's saying Danielson is like this hobo hipster type who likes to dig clams out of the sand. Also, Nigel is a former wrestler, and he has history with a lot of the talent and guys in AEW like Danielson. Even if it doesn't lead to anything, I don't see a problem. This has been a part of heel wrestling commentary as long as there has been heel color commentators. 

[Octopus]

 

Triple Crown Champion, a belt I thought I wouldn’t care about, held by the least clam-digger on the roster, Eddie Kingston.

Just give me unnecessary choppy and exploder suplexy dream matches. Daisuke Sekimoto, Katsuhiko Nakajima, more Ishii, Shinto Takagi, Barbaro Cavernario, maestros like Satanico and Negro Casas, Masakatsu Funaki, Timothy Thatcher, and CHRIS HERO. 

[Kev]

13 minutes ago, TheVileOne said:

He's calling Danielson a clam digger because he's saying Danielson is like this hobo hipster type who likes to dig clams out of the sand. Also, Nigel is a former wrestler, and he has history with a lot of the talent and guys in AEW like Danielson. Even if it doesn't lead to anything, I don't see a problem. This has been a part of heel wrestling commentary as long as there has been heel color commentators. 

Oh I get it all, it’s just incredibly hacky. I think I’ve mentioned here before that part of my issue is that, as a Brit, I’m overly conscious of other Brits doing such overtly Americanised schtick as it feels hugely forced and inauthentic. 

And I’d stand by the point that heel commentators are generally an outdated concept. Heenan is usually held up as the standard, but that made a lot more sense as it was an extension of his heel manager character. Nigel doesn’t have that wider role to play up to so what purpose is the heeling serving?

I think the ideal modern variation is the heel sympathising commentator, like Taz. He can add heel psychology, explain motivations, etc. while still sounding like a real human and not putting too much attention on himself over the actual wrestlers. 

[Eivion]

Curious, why does everyone keep assuming Andrade is going back to WWE when he has been very vocal about wanting to wrestle in NJPW again? 

[Sublime]

2 hours ago, Cobra Commander said:

For all the talk and jokes about Jack Perry returning, just bring Jack Perry back in the Christian group as if they abducted him off the streets and put him in a reeducation camp.

This is the best way to bring Jack Perry back and then eventually he and Killswitch can turn on Christian at the same time and you have a Boy and his Dinosaur vs Christian and Nick Wayne feud right there 

[Octopus]

I’m a Nigel fan. But out of respect for @Kev I’m watching Samoa Joe kick Nigel and squeeze his head with his thighs:

[NoFistsJustFlips]

3 hours ago, TheVileOne said:

It was an ultra-exaggerated, even more contrived version of the Dusty finish. It teases a babyface beating the heel champion and winning the title but ultimately ends with the title back on the heel champion. Made even dumber and worse by the fact they set up a title shot battle royal on the same night to have Killswitch win only to promptly hand over the shot back to Christian after he lost. Dumb garbage.

The Dusty finish is a finish reversal. They basically did a reversal last night. 

Why do you watch AEW? You clearly don't like anything they do. Maybe for your own sanity you should stop forcing yourself to hate watch?

It made 100% sense. As much sense as any MITB cash in can. A bit more actually because the contract was unsigned and Christian signed it on the spot. They put the extra thought into it to give it a touch of real world details. I basically called this entire finish (except the Christian sub in) this week. It's good booking on multiple levels and keeps things interesting. The match was really solid. The audience got a nice cathartic moment because Edge finally beat the shithead heel and everyone got to celebrate. The heel left with more heat because he found a shitty loophole to get the belt back. The underling has more sympathy on him for being abused yet again. It's literally wrestling 101. An up and down story telling roller coaster with feel good moments and bum out moments.

All you do is complain and point out how everything sucks. At least accompany your negative takes with an alternate way to do things that wouldn't suck in your opinion. Because otherwise every post you make is the same. This sucks. That sucks. This is the worst. It's fine if those are your real feels. But for the love of god add some constructive content to your criticisms.

[Kevin Wilson]

8 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

It made 100% sense. As much sense as any MITB cash in can. A bit more actually because the contract was unsigned and Christian signed it on the spot. They put the extra thought into it to give it a touch of real world details. I basically called this entire finish (except the Christian sub in) this week. It's good booking on multiple levels and keeps things interesting. The match was really solid. The audience got a nice cathartic moment because Edge finally beat the shithead heel and everyone got to celebrate. The heel left with more heat because he found a shitty loophole to get the belt back. The underling has more sympathy on him for being abused yet again. It's literally wrestling 101. An up and down story telling roller coaster with feel good moments and bum out moments.

I didn't mind it in theory, the only thing I didn't like is they really didn't make it clear that Killswitch could give it away to anyone he wanted to. On one hand, if they mentioned that it would have tipped us off as to what would happen, but on the other hand it just felt like something they made up at the moment to fit into the storyline.  I liked the match a lot, and the end result of Christian keeping the belt I have no problem with, the execution on how we got there just felt a little made-up on the spot.

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

11 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said:

I didn't mind it in theory, the only thing I didn't like is they really didn't make it clear that Killswitch could give it away to anyone he wanted to. On one hand, if they mentioned that it would have tipped us off as to what would happen, but on the other hand it just felt like something they made up at the moment to fit into the storyline.  I liked the match a lot, and the end result of Christian keeping the belt I have no problem with, the execution on how we got there just felt a little made-up on the spot.

I have a feeling if they had made it clear, it would've telegraphed what they were doing since (if I recall correctly), this is the first time AEW has done an any time, any place title shot as a reward for winning a match.

[Matt D]

10 minutes ago, Sparkleface said:

I have a feeling if they had made it clear, it would've telegraphed what they were doing since (if I recall correctly), this is the first time AEW has done an any time, any place title shot as a reward for winning a match.

One of the announcers (Tony?) did let it slip earlier in the night and/or match.

”Christian would just make him give him the shot anyway.” Or something like that.

Edited December 31, 2023 by Matt D

[John E. Dynamite]

28 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said:

I didn't mind it in theory, the only thing I didn't like is they really didn't make it clear that Killswitch could give it away to anyone he wanted to. On one hand, if they mentioned that it would have tipped us off as to what would happen, but on the other hand it just felt like something they made up at the moment to fit into the storyline.  I liked the match a lot, and the end result of Christian keeping the belt I have no problem with, the execution on how we got there just felt a little made-up on the spot.

I liked the finish because it happened to Adam Copeland. Not just because it's a callback/tribute, but because there's an element of fair play to it. Edge was the one who codified the now-common trope of briefcase cash-ins happening after long matches and beatdowns. So having it happen to him like this is legitimate dramatic irony.

[TheVileOne]

39 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Why do you watch AEW? You clearly don't like anything they do. Maybe for your own sanity you should stop forcing yourself to hate watch?

It made 100% sense. As much sense as any MITB cash in can. A bit more actually because the contract was unsigned and Christian signed it on the spot. They put the extra thought into it to give it a touch of real world details. I basically called this entire finish (except the Christian sub in) this week. It's good booking on multiple levels and keeps things interesting. The match was really solid. The audience got a nice cathartic moment because Edge finally beat the shithead heel and everyone got to celebrate. The heel left with more heat because he found a shitty loophole to get the belt back. The underling has more sympathy on him for being abused yet again. It's literally wrestling 101. An up and down story telling roller coaster with feel good moments and bum out moments.

All you do is complain and point out how everything sucks. At least accompany your negative takes with an alternate way to do things that wouldn't suck in your opinion. Because otherwise every post you make is the same. This sucks. That sucks. This is the worst. It's fine if those are your real feels. But for the love of god add some constructive content to your criticisms.

Like you said it was a shitty loophole. It was never established that Killswitch can exchange the title shot with anyone he chose. It wasn’t done organically. Why did AEW allow it? When Ted DiBiase tried to buy the WWE title reign from Andre, WWE said no in storyline and said a monetary exchange of a title champion status is not allowed. The whole mess was badly executed.
 

Secondly, I gave multiple pieces of constructive criticism for last night’s show and said things I liked about the show. I will continue to comment on things where I see fit whether I dislike them or not.