Technico Support Posted June 25, 2015 Share Posted June 25, 2015 Exactly. Have a figurehead who only shows up specifically when a figurehead is needed and only then. Authority figures today are just a crutch for lazy and/or talentless writers who can't figure out any other way from A to B. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Babyfaces who don't cheat, even when their opponent is cheating loads and getting away with it. Heels who cheat because they can't win anything at all if they try to play it clean. Heels who work the ref, by complaining about how dirty the face is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuetsar Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Frankly, I just want an authority figure in the Jack Tunney mold. Someone who shows up once a month or so to make major rulings (suspensions, probation, etc.), announce a main event for a major PPV and the like. S/he doesn't pick sides, is not the primary focus of angles and does not become the star of the show. Just a figurehead who shows up once in a while to get the wheels rolling or continuing. JD The more senile the better. . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingus Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The more senile the better. . . .Heh. In my fantasies of running an indy comedy fed, I had the idea of featuring an authority figure who was a bipolar alcoholic, always shitfaced and very moody. That way, you could get away with ANY illogical booking decision or compromised storyline, by just explaining it away as being the drunken whim of a madman playing god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyMax46 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 The more senile the better. . . .Heh. In my fantasies of running an indy comedy fed, I had the idea of featuring an authority figure who was a bipolar alcoholic, always shitfaced and very moody. That way, you could get away with ANY illogical booking decision or compromised storyline, by just explaining it away as being the drunken whim of a madman playing god. Ian Rotten already does this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingus Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Ian Rotten already does this.I was gonna add "just like a real promoter", but decided that was too easy a joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Babyfaces who don't cheat, even when their opponent is cheating loads and getting away with it. Heels who cheat because they can't win anything at all if they try to play it clean. Heels who work the ref, by complaining about how dirty the face is. I've been thinking about the cheating thing the last few months. I'm not sure it works with today's audience. I don't want to climb on a soapbox, but I have to bring up the possibility that Americans have become inured to both lying and cheating. The fact that we have seen cheating babyfaces for a few generations just adds to this, making audiences yawn at cheating rather than getting angry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Babyfaces who don't cheat, even when their opponent is cheating loads and getting away with it. Heels who cheat because they can't win anything at all if they try to play it clean. Heels who work the ref, by complaining about how dirty the face is. I've been thinking about the cheating thing the last few months. I'm not sure it works with today's audience. I don't want to climb on a soapbox, but I have to bring up the possibility that Americans have become inured to both lying and cheating. The fact that we have seen cheating babyfaces for a few generations just adds to this, making audiences yawn at cheating rather than getting angry. Yeah, I kind of agree with this. I was having a conversation with one of my friends about how many people we expect to lie to us. We were talking about sports, and how if a coaches and players are required to talk to the media, only for us to complain about how they should shut up if they actually say something of note. We actually praise them for evading questions or just plain lying outright. Then it went to politics and all types of other shit, but we celebrate dishonesty a lot. So I don't know whether or not a pure, honest, fight for what's right babyface would actually get over with most fans. John Cena's career is basically him being all about truth, justice, and the American way, and he gets booed by half the audience every night. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Regal's line about Saint's stuff looking ridiculous when done by someone not utterly steeped in the style seems apropos here. Without the old British rule against attacking a downed opponent, there's no reason Tyson shouldn't have just kicked him in the head. Which is what makes the spot alright, since it was on Saturday Morning Slam, and the matches were laid out for kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted June 26, 2015 Author Share Posted June 26, 2015 Babyfaces who don't cheat, even when their opponent is cheating loads and getting away with it. Heels who cheat because they can't win anything at all if they try to play it clean. Heels who work the ref, by complaining about how dirty the face is. I've been thinking about the cheating thing the last few months. I'm not sure it works with today's audience. I don't want to climb on a soapbox, but I have to bring up the possibility that Americans have become inured to both lying and cheating. The fact that we have seen cheating babyfaces for a few generations just adds to this, making audiences yawn at cheating rather than getting angry. Yeah, I kind of agree with this. I was having a conversation with one of my friends about how many people we expect to lie to us. We were talking about sports, and how if a coaches and players are required to talk to the media, only for us to complain about how they should shut up if they actually say something of note. We actually praise them for evading questions or just plain lying outright. Then it went to politics and all types of other shit, but we celebrate dishonesty a lot. So I don't know whether or not a pure, honest, fight for what's right babyface would actually get over with most fans. John Cena's career is basically him being all about truth, justice, and the American way, and he gets booed by half the audience every night. I think the problem with this is that we don't really get to see the consequences of a heel cheating. If a heel cheats nowadays, it's not like he can bust a babyface open with an object or have the face sell an injury for longer than one or two shows. The cheating that is being done now is pretty tame due to restrictions on choking and foreign objects. I think that if a heel was allowed to hit someone with brass knuckles and bust open a face or make them do a stretcher job that kept them away for a month, that would garner heat and they wouldn't be celebrated for it. I thought they were going down the right track when Ambrose couldn't speak after Bray injured his throat ala Steamboat/Savage but he only sold the injury for two shows unlike Steamboat who couldn't speak for weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cwoy2j Posted June 26, 2015 Author Share Posted June 26, 2015 I'd like to see more in ring interviews like Mean Gene used to do in WCW. Not guys in the back, not looking at the interviewer OR the camera, and just staring off while giving their promo and holding that face for 5-10 seconds after the interview ends as they wait for a fade to black or transition to another backstage thing. Yes. This definitely should come back. I used to love that Gene would have weekly interviews with The Horsemen which basically just consisted of Flair ranting about whatever was on his mind and Woman hitting on him in the background. Those type of interviews really help get a guy's character over and they have to read and react to the crowd moreso than if they're just in the back reading off of cue cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingus Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I'm not sure it works with today's audience. I don't want to climb on a soapbox, but I have to bring up the possibility that Americans have become inured to both lying and cheating. The fact that we have seen cheating babyfaces for a few generations just adds to this, making audiences yawn at cheating rather than getting angry. It really doesn't make any difference today at all. Heels get booed for what they do, faces get cheered for what they do, and most of the crowd's anger at heel cheating gets directed at the referee for being a blind idiot anyway. Especially since there's not much psychology to modern cheating, how it rarely leads to the heels getting a victory which they couldn't have achieved cleanly. Yeah, I kind of agree with this. I was having a conversation with one of my friends about how many people we expect to lie to us. We were talking about sports, and how if a coaches and players are required to talk to the media, only for us to complain about how they should shut up if they actually say something of note. We actually praise them for evading questions or just plain lying outright. Then it went to politics and all types of other shit, but we celebrate dishonesty a lot. So I don't know whether or not a pure, honest, fight for what's right babyface would actually get over with most fans. John Cena's career is basically him being all about truth, justice, and the American way, and he gets booed by half the audience every night.Absolutely. We live in a "Gotcha~!" society, where everyone is just waiting for our famous people to make a simple human error or to say something dumb or offensive. Hell, we've got an entire industry devoted to this, the tabloid news vultures. Ergo, our celebrities and politicians and various public figures have learned to be as cautious and generic as possible whenever speaking publicly, and to say absolutely nothing that hasn't already been vetted by two lawyers and three publicists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEN! Posted June 27, 2015 Share Posted June 27, 2015 Regal's line about Saint's stuff looking ridiculous when done by someone not utterly steeped in the style seems apropos here. Without the old British rule against attacking a downed opponent, there's no reason Tyson shouldn't have just kicked him in the head. Which is what makes the spot alright, since it was on Saturday Morning Slam, and the matches were laid out for kids. When I was a kid watching on Saturday morning, I saw Randy Savage crush Ricky Steamboat's larynx with the ring bell and Ron Bass slice open Brutus Beefcake's head with spurs. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OSJ Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Wrestlers "buying TV time" to bitch about something. Usually a bad call by the ref, missing a foot on the rope, or some other sort of shenanigans to justify a re-match. Used properly this is a great spot top put over an angle, launch a feud properly, get some heat on the heel, etc. I'll never forget face-Flair doing this and showing a heel-Piper using a foreign object to beat him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sydneybrown Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 Giant heels killing "local talent" in 2 minutes. Not everything needs to be back and forth. This. 50/50 booking is the worst thing to ever happen to pro wrestling. Not every series has to be fucking Benoit/Angle levels of competitive. No, 6-10 hours of competitive wrestling matches every week is the worst thing to ever happen to pro wrestling. You can't have 25-40 matches every week 52 weeks a year with talent that rarely rotates without making most of your roster look like crap. Guys have to lose. Even Steven booking at least gives you a roster full of Kofi Kingstons and Sheamuses instead of a roster full of Zack Ryders. And I'm not a fan of it either, but that's the reality. We're never going back to 2 hour RAWs or Superstars squashes. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingus Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 I haven't met anyone who wasn't literally elderly who actually wanted to go back to All Squashes, All The Time. That's impossible in today's wrestling market, where fans expect every show to deliver some exciting action and competitive matches. But couldn't we have at least one or two quick squashes per show? It's an easy way to efficiently kill time and keep any angle from progressing too quickly, two things that modern wrestling has serious problems with. How many undercard guys travel to Raw on a regular basis, only to be used in the background of promo segments or, at best, as the guy taking a fall in a meaningless more-than-four-people tag match? Being allowed to destroy a jobber and get a quick, flashy, decisive win on TV is the easiest method in the world of making some random unappreciated curtain-jerker look like they could actually be a legitimate threat in the ring. Wrestlers "buying TV time" to bitch about something. Usually a bad call by the ref, missing a foot on the rope, or some other sort of shenanigans to justify a re-match. Used properly this is a great spot top put over an angle, launch a feud properly, get some heat on the heel, etc. I'll never forget face-Flair doing this and showing a heel-Piper using a foreign object to beat him. This could still work if it actually looked like paid programming. Like, it looked as if the wrestler had genuinely self-financed a cheap infomercial segment and then paid to have it aired as one of the program's commercials. Problem is, it's usually more like "Randy Orton somehow bought TV time to stand in the middle of the ring on a live Raw broadcast and monologue for twenty minutes". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Weak Machine Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 "The following announcement has been paid for by the New World Order." 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted June 28, 2015 Share Posted June 28, 2015 NXT basically has squash matches, so the cliche has been brought back and done well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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