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2023 NFL OFFSEASON


RIPPA

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33 minutes ago, RIPPA said:

Lamar Jackson confirms that he requested a trade on March 2

 

And to show you what an absolute "fuck you" this was... he tweeted this as John Harbaugh was sitting down with the press at the annual owner's meeting.

I do enjoy the folks on Twitter pretending that wasn't 100% intentional. 

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47 minutes ago, Kuetsar said:

Good luck with that. What an ass. . . 

How does trying to get paid what you're worth make you an ass?  If you want more money at work are you an ass?  If they don't think he's worth the money they can trade him,  but it doesn't look like they want to do that either. So,  if anyone is being an ass it is the Ravens who want him to play for them, but aren't willing to pay the cost to keep him. They could have solved this by paying him, but they didn't. Now they burned the bridge to their franchise quarterback, and he doesn't want to play for them any more. Once again,  whether they like it or not,  the price of franchise quarterbacks has gone up. It's not going back down,  the longer you wait,  the more it is going to cost. If your quarterback is good enough to keep,  you have to pay him more than the last guy. Russell Wilson,  Kyler Murray,  and Deshaun Watson set the floor,  and no one in their right mind thinks any of them are better than Lamar Jackson. If you want him,  you have to pay for him.  Why would he accept anything less?

Joe Burrow is coming up next,  and he's going to be negotiating against the cheapest franchise in the league. That might be even more of a shit show. 

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Not hiring an agent makes him an ass. Burning the bridges with the Ravens makes you an ass.  He's not Mahomes or Josh and they both took less to help their team compete. I bet Burrow and Herbert will settle for "lesser" contracts too. You'll pardon me if I don't cry tears for a guy who thinks $133 million guaranteed, with up to $200 million if he's still in the NFL in three years is not enough. And is too dumb and stubborn to hire a professional to help him with his business. No one is giving up 2 1st rounders for what may be damaged goods, and the Ravens aren't taking any less. 

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1 minute ago, Kuetsar said:

Not hiring an agent makes him an ass. Burning the bridges with the Ravens makes you an ass.  He's not Mahomes or Josh and they both took less to help their team compete. I bet Burrow and Herbert will settle for "lesser" contracts too. You'll pardon me if I don't cry tears for a guy who thinks $133 million guaranteed, with up to $200 million if he's still in the NFL in three years is not enough. And is too dumb and stubborn to hire a professional to help him with his business. No one is giving up 2 1st rounders for what may be damaged goods, and the Ravens aren't taking any less. 

Just because someone else is willing to take less money for a job that is worth more money does not mean that anyone else is obligated to take less money. The Ravens are well within their rights to say no,  but he's well within his rights to tell them to fuck off. It would be one thing if the Ravens spent the money saved on his rookie contact to sign a bunch of great talent around him,  but he's been playing with a pu pu platter of skill position talent his entire career. One again,  if the Jets were smart they'd stop negotiating with Green Bay and trade for Lamar. It will actually be cheaper. 

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53 minutes ago, supremebve said:

Just because someone else is willing to take less money for a job that is worth more money does not mean that anyone else is obligated to take less money. The Ravens are well within their rights to say no,  but he's well within his rights to tell them to fuck off. It would be one thing if the Ravens spent the money saved on his rookie contact to sign a bunch of great talent around him,  but he's been playing with a pu pu platter of skill position talent his entire career. One again,  if the Jets were smart they'd stop negotiating with Green Bay and trade for Lamar. It will actually be cheaper. 

Aren’t you the same guy that crapped all over OBJ because he tore his ACL? Well what’s Lamar done the last two seasons besides get hurt, and then fake an injury to not play? God lord you’re easily the most hypocritical poster on this part of the site. 

How would the Jets giving up their next two first round picks for a guy like that benefit the team? Plus you’re stuck paying him at minimum $200 million guaranteed so when he flames out within the next 3 years you’re screwed. 

Please offer up more of your brilliance though, and once again explain how one injury prone guy is better than another that’s asking for a much smaller contract. 

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34 minutes ago, LF2 said:

Aren’t you the same guy that crapped all over OBJ because he tore his ACL? Well what’s Lamar done the last two seasons besides get hurt, and then fake an injury to not play? God lord you’re easily the most hypocritical poster on this part of the site. 

How would the Jets giving up their next two first round picks for a guy like that benefit the team? Plus you’re stuck paying him at minimum $200 million guaranteed so when he flames out within the next 3 years you’re screwed. 

Please offer up more of your brilliance though, and once again explain how one injury prone guy is better than another that’s asking for a much smaller contract. 

They'd be giving up just as much for a guy who is going to be 40 when the season starts and wasn't very good last season. The odds of Lamar flaming out in the next 5 years is pretty low,  but Rodgers might be done right now.  There is no reason to believe that Rodgers,  who is the highest paid quarterback in the league,  has more in his tank than Lamar Jackson. Lamar is 26, and even though he has been injured nothing required surgery. A sprained ankle and a sprained PCL are not career altering injuries. 

And as far as OBJ goes, a wide receiver who's last great season was in 2016 who has two major knee surgeries is not nearly as valuable as a quarterback who has won an MVP and can win games by himself. You can find someone as good as OBJ on pretty much every roster in the league. There may be 50 receivers as good as OBJ right now,  but Lamar Jackson is one of the best 5-10 quarterbacks on the planet. If you're building a roster you hope and pray to get a quarterback as good as Lamar Jackson,  but you only sign someone on the level of 2023 OBJ if you don't have any other choice. You'd rather develop a rookie or get someone familiar with the system than go out of your way to sign a 30 year old receiver with bad knees. One is the face of your franchise the other is just another dude on the roster. If you can't see why I'd want one and not the other,  it's probably because you don't want to see it,  and that's your problem not mine.

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13 minutes ago, Dolfan in NYC said:

New England is Lamar Jackson's preferred destination

Excuse me while I vomit. 

I want to like Lamar so bad,  but being a Raven then a Patriot would guarantee that I'll never actually root for him.

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The issue with Lamar is that he isn’t really angling to be paid fairly.  He’s angling to get $1 more dollar than DeShaun Watson got.  I mean, that’s a lot of money for a guy with one playoff win.  Ravens seem willing to pay Lamar a lot more per year that the $32.4 he’ll get if he signs the franchise tag tender offer. That figure is the average of the top five salaries right now.  Ravens also seem willing to guarantee a large chunk of it.  So it seems reasonable Lamar would be signed if he was willing to become the third or fourth highest paid qb in the league, with maybe 2/3 or so of it guaranteed.

I like Lamar but he has one career playoff win.   He has enough potential to deserve to be paid like one of the top guys, but win something before you start asking to be paid like THE top guy.  

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1 hour ago, supremebve said:

They'd be giving up just as much for a guy who is going to be 40 when the season starts and wasn't very good last season. The odds of Lamar flaming out in the next 5 years is pretty low,  but Rodgers might be done right now.  There is no reason to believe that Rodgers,  who is the highest paid quarterback in the league,  has more in his tank than Lamar Jackson. Lamar is 26, and even though he has been injured nothing required surgery. A sprained ankle and a sprained PCL are not career altering injuries. 

And as far as OBJ goes, a wide receiver who's last great season was in 2016 who has two major knee surgeries is not nearly as valuable as a quarterback who has won an MVP and can win games by himself. You can find someone as good as OBJ on pretty much every roster in the league. There may be 50 receivers as good as OBJ right now,  but Lamar Jackson is one of the best 5-10 quarterbacks on the planet. If you're building a roster you hope and pray to get a quarterback as good as Lamar Jackson,  but you only sign someone on the level of 2023 OBJ if you don't have any other choice. You'd rather develop a rookie or get someone familiar with the system than go out of your way to sign a 30 year old receiver with bad knees. One is the face of your franchise the other is just another dude on the roster. If you can't see why I'd want one and not the other,  it's probably because you don't want to see it,  and that's your problem not mine.

How? The Jets aren’t giving up their next two firsts for Rodgers. Even their coach acknowledges they might wait until July (thus keeping the 13th pick in the draft) to trade for him. But keep painting the narrative however you’d like so it favors a QB that’s hurt all the time. How was Rodgers “not very good last season” or “might be done now”? Let’s look at his numbers from last year:

64.6 completion percentage, 3,695 yards, 26 TDs, 12 INTs, 32 sacks taken

Compare that to your buddies stats from last year

62.3 completion percentage, 2,242 yards, 17 TDs, 7 INTs (in 5 fewer games), 26 sacks taken

So what story does that tell? That the much older QB completes more passes, and eats fewer sacks than a running QB? That’s not the story Lamar or you should want told. Hell let’s compare Rodgers from last year to Lamar’s best season (all the way back in 2019):

66.1 completion percentage, 3,127 yards, 36 TDs, 6 INTs, 23 sacks taken

Thats literally the only year of his career that Lamar can say was better passing wise than Rodgers last season (and his worst as a starter). I’d love to see you post Lamar’s awesome 2021 numbers and use them for a reason that he’s a) better than Rodgers or b) worth more $200 plus million guaranteed. And no his lack of receivers don’t count unless you’re giving Rodgers the same excuse for last year.

As for OBJ you’ve clearly got your head sideways on that. He was a large part of that Rams offense two years ago, and they don’t win the Super Bowl without him. But yes please continue to carry on in an unintelligent manner and list the 50 active receivers who are better than him so I can laugh you off the board.

P.S.

Claiming to be a Bills fan and lusting after Lamar (like you did when you complained about him wanting to go to New England) is just tacky. You’ve already got a much better version of him.

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6 minutes ago, Tarheel Moneghetti said:

The issue with Lamar is that he isn’t really angling to be paid fairly.  He’s angling to get $1 more dollar than DeShaun Watson got.  I mean, that’s a lot of money for a guy with one playoff win.  Ravens seem willing to pay Lamar a lot more per year that the $32.4 he’ll get if he signs the franchise tag tender offer. That figure is the average of the top five salaries right now.  Ravens also seem willing to guarantee a large chunk of it.  So it seems reasonable Lamar would be signed if he was willing to become the third or fourth highest paid qb in the league, with maybe 2/3 or so of it guaranteed.

I like Lamar but he has one career playoff win.   He has enough potential to deserve to be paid like one of the top guys, but win something before you start asking to be paid like THE top guy.  

Lamar is angling to be paid fairly.  Being paid more than people you out perform is not too much to ask. Watson is the 5th highest paid quarterback.  Watson is the name that keeps coming up, but Russell Wilson and Kyler Murray's contracts are bigger than his. Lamar is better than all 3 of them,  and there is no reason why he should, take less money than any of them. Mahomes and Allen have the 2 biggest contracts, and I don't think either contract is controversial. If you want to say you don't want to give him as much as either of them,  fine,  but I wouldn't take a dime less than Watson,  Murray, or Wilson.  

Next year's top 5 QB salaries. I don't think he's asking for Rodgers money,  but I don't see any reason why he should take less money than Daniel Jones.

TOTAL CASH

Aaron Rodgers GB, QB$59,515,000 

Deshaun Watson CLE, QB$46,000,000

Daniel Jones NYG, QB$46,000,000

Patrick Mahomes KC, QB$40,450,000

Kyler Murray ARI, QB$39,000,000

 

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4 hours ago, supremebve said:

Lamar is angling to be paid fairly.  Being paid more than people you out perform is not too much to ask. Watson is the 5th highest paid quarterback.  Watson is the name that keeps coming up, but Russell Wilson and Kyler Murray's contracts are bigger than his. Lamar is better than all 3 of them,  and there is no reason why he should, take less money than any of them. Mahomes and Allen have the 2 biggest contracts, and I don't think either contract is controversial. If you want to say you don't want to give him as much as either of them,  fine,  but I wouldn't take a dime less than Watson,  Murray, or Wilson.  

Next year's top 5 QB salaries. I don't think he's asking for Rodgers money,  but I don't see any reason why he should take less money than Daniel Jones.

TOTAL CASH

Aaron Rodgers GB, QB$59,515,000 

Deshaun Watson CLE, QB$46,000,000

Daniel Jones NYG, QB$46,000,000

Patrick Mahomes KC, QB$40,450,000

Kyler Murray ARI, QB$39,000,000

 

I love when you leave out facts. Rodgers salary is that large because they had to pay him last year or trade him (which coming off another MVP year wasn’t going to happen), and Jones is only making that because his deal is basically a 2 year deal. Lamar got offered more than that, but turned it down, because it wasn’t all guaranteed. Quit trying to make people feel sorry for someone that 95% of us won’t feel bad for. 

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Leaving out facts is comparing Lamar and Rodgers' stats while completely leaving out rushing numbers. 

And OBJ averaged 38 yards a game for the Rams. He was much better in the playoffs but c'mon. 

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1 hour ago, Tabe said:

Leaving out facts is comparing Lamar and Rodgers' stats while completely leaving out rushing numbers. 

And OBJ averaged 38 yards a game for the Rams. He was much better in the playoffs but c'mon. 

That is a tricky slope since we were told ten pages ago that Daniel Jones' rushing stats don't count when evaluating him. So if they can't be considered for Jones, they can't be considered for Lamar either (Jones had 7 rushing TDs last year, Lamar had 3). The fact is, everyone is going to skew an argument online that works for their own agenda, that's just how discussions on the Internet works 🙂

If Lamar is worth as much as Lamar thinks he is, he'll get an offer he wants. I don't think the Ravens mind trading him, they just want the proper compensation for it, but teams aren't going to jump at the chance at losing multiple first round picks and signing a $300 mil contract. Personally, I think Lamar is over-valuing himself. I think he is a fringe top 5 quarterback (before someone asks - I'd rather have in 2023 Mahomes, Allen, Hurts, and Burrow with a clump of Lamar/Rodgers/Herbert/Lawrence after that). His stats have been lackluster since 2020, which was two injuries ago. If he can get top five money from a team, I'd be happy for him, I'm always in favor of players getting paid. I just don't think he's there and I think this is going to be very messy unless he can find a desperate team (like the Colts) that will bite the bullet and give him what he wants.

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I think it's also unlikely a team gives him both the money he wants and gives up the assets to get him.

But if the NFL didn't have the franchise tag system that basically prevents guys from hitting unfettered free agency, and he would only cost the money, I'm pretty sure multiple teams would 

It's just a generally bad idea to trade assets in order to pay a guy huge money.

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6 hours ago, Kevin Wilson said:

That is a tricky slope since we were told ten pages ago that Daniel Jones' rushing stats don't count when evaluating him. So if they can't be considered for Jones, they can't be considered for Lamar either (Jones had 7 rushing TDs last year, Lamar had 3). The fact is, everyone is going to skew an argument online that works for their own agenda, that's just how discussions on the Internet works 🙂

 

I didn't say that Daniel Jones' rushing stats don't count when evaluating him.  I said that rushing touchdowns for a quarterback aren't necessarily replicable year over year, so throwing fewer touchdowns than games played three straight years is a much bigger deal than rushing for seven touchdowns once.  The odds of him continuing to throw fewer than one touchdown a game is very high, but the odds of him running for seven or more touchdowns is very low.  Lamar Jackson's rushing stats are consistent over time, Daniel Jones' rushing stats are not.  Therefore, one of these players rushing stats are more relevant to the discussion than the other.  My point stands, I do not want a quarterback who throws fewer than a touchdown per game.  Only 3.4% of Daniel Jones passes are touchdowns, which is 191st out of 210 all-time (Lamar Jackson is at 6.1%, 10th all time).  If someone can come up with a counter argument for that, I'd love to hear it

I'd also like to point out that nobody is going to post every relevant stat for every argument.  One, that would be impossible.  Two, no one has any reason to quote any stat that isn't directly related to what they were talking about.  So, no I didn't say why Aaron Rodgers makes as much money as he does, because it doesn't actually matter to Lamar Jackson.  The only thing that matters is the price for a franchise quarterback, which is what Lamar Jackson is and how he is asking to be compensated.  I don't know why you would prefer a 40 year old quarterback over a 26 year old quarterback, when the compensation will be similar.  As far as I know there has been exactly one great 40+ year old quarterback, and he wasn't a weirdo who may or may not decide to fuck off and do peyote in the desert.  People keep saying, "The Jets won't have to give up two first round picks for Aaron Rodgers," when we don't actually know what the trade will be.  I'd also argue that two first round picks are less valuable than one franchise quarterback, but maybe that's just me.  If I was the Jets, who have very good young skill talent and a couple of great defensive pieces, I'd trade the picks and pay Lamar Jackson.  Most of their existing talent is on a rookie contract, and you'll get the best out of Lamar in the next 3-5 years.  It's a risk, but one I'd be willing to take.  

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9 hours ago, Tabe said:

Leaving out facts is comparing Lamar and Rodgers' stats while completely leaving out rushing numbers. 

And OBJ averaged 38 yards a game for the Rams. He was much better in the playoffs but c'mon. 

Thank you for proving my point. He had two catches for 52 yards (and one of their 3 TDs) in the Super Bowl after having nine catches for 113 yards in the NFC Championship game. The Rams don’t win either game without that production (plus he made it harder to double Cooper Kupp who as a result had amazing games in both). But yes please discredit me.

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11 minutes ago, supremebve said:

I didn't say that Daniel Jones' rushing stats don't count when evaluating him.  I said that rushing touchdowns for a quarterback aren't necessarily replicable year over year, so throwing fewer touchdowns than games played three straight years is a much bigger deal than rushing for seven touchdowns once.  The odds of him continuing to throw fewer than one touchdown a game is very high, but the odds of him running for seven or more touchdowns is very low.  Lamar Jackson's rushing stats are consistent over time, Daniel Jones' rushing stats are not.  Therefore, one of these players rushing stats are more relevant to the discussion than the other.  My point stands, I do not want a quarterback who throws fewer than a touchdown per game.  Only 3.4% of Daniel Jones passes are touchdowns, which is 191st out of 210 all-time (Lamar Jackson is at 6.1%, 10th all time).  If someone can come up with a counter argument for that, I'd love to hear it

I'd also like to point out that nobody is going to post every relevant stat for every argument.  One, that would be impossible.  Two, no one has any reason to quote any stat that isn't directly related to what they were talking about.  So, no I didn't say why Aaron Rodgers makes as much money as he does, because it doesn't actually matter to Lamar Jackson.  The only thing that matters is the price for a franchise quarterback, which is what Lamar Jackson is and how he is asking to be compensated.  I don't know why you would prefer a 40 year old quarterback over a 26 year old quarterback, when the compensation will be similar.  As far as I know there has been exactly one great 40+ year old quarterback, and he wasn't a weirdo who may or may not decide to fuck off and do peyote in the desert.  People keep saying, "The Jets won't have to give up two first round picks for Aaron Rodgers," when we don't actually know what the trade will be.  I'd also argue that two first round picks are less valuable than one franchise quarterback, but maybe that's just me.  If I was the Jets, who have very good young skill talent and a couple of great defensive pieces, I'd trade the picks and pay Lamar Jackson.  Most of their existing talent is on a rookie contract, and you'll get the best out of Lamar in the next 3-5 years.  It's a risk, but one I'd be willing to take.  

You keep recycling the same garbage repeatedly. The Packers GM literally spoke to the media yesterday and said the number 13 pick doesn’t have to be included. Thus showing that your two first round picks for Rodgers narrative is a false one. What does he gain by lying? His team is the one trying to get as much as possible for Rodgers.

Two first round picks are worth less than a franchise quarterback if you’re getting one of: Mahomes, Allen, Burrow, Herbert, or Lawrence. You know the guys that have no (or in Allen’s case minimal) injury history, and that have shown elite talent. 

Lamar is living proof of that old adage that the best ability is availability. When it comes to him you never know when he’s going to play, or when he’ll take a four week injury and pout like a spoiled man child and miss the rest of the season (last season).

The biggest thing that turned me off to Lamar was the season opener last season at MetLife against the Jets. Before the game CBS aired the national anthem as it was the 21st anniversary of 9/11. The Jets players and coaches were shown standing, crying, and singing along as were most of the Ravens including Coach Harbaugh. When the camera found Lamar he’s sitting on the bench wearing a hat, and looking like he’d rather be anywhere but there. I don’t get how anyone can disrespect the anthem, or our country on that day especially in a city that close to where the attacks happened.

 I love how on the metric you’re all of a sudden gung ho for that Lamar is just barely ahead of Russell Wilson too. 6.1 to 5.9%  Plus you left out how Jones completed only .1% fewer of his passes than Lamar in 2021, and that he completed a higher percentage than Lamar last year. Maybe we should bring up how Lamar has thrown more picks than Jones through the four years Jones has been in the league too. But I’m sure INTs don’t count against a QB right? 

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First, I didn't say that Green Bay would get two first round picks.  I said that we don't know the compensation.  Two draft picks are only as valuable as the players you pick with them.  There is always a chance that those picks will be used on players who will never contribute.  I don't value draft picks as much as I value players who are actively contributing to a roster.  If they have to trade multiple starters for Aaron Rodgers, that is a bigger price in my opinion than two first round picks.  Those picks are lottery tickets, those players are the cash you get when you win.  That cash has more tangible value, and Green Bay isn't about to give up Aaron Rodgers for nothing.

Russell Wilson is going to end up in the hall of fame, that's not an indictment.  Jones inability to throw touchdowns is a much bigger deal than Lamar throwing a couple more interceptions than him.  

I didn't think anyone could be more annoying than the NFL is rigged guy, but here we are.  

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16 minutes ago, supremebve said:

First, I didn't say that Green Bay would get two first round picks.  I said that we don't know the compensation.  Two draft picks are only as valuable as the players you pick with them.  There is always a chance that those picks will be used on players who will never contribute.  I don't value draft picks as much as I value players who are actively contributing to a roster.  If they have to trade multiple starters for Aaron Rodgers, that is a bigger price in my opinion than two first round picks.  Those picks are lottery tickets, those players are the cash you get when you win.  That cash has more tangible value, and Green Bay isn't about to give up Aaron Rodgers for nothing.

Russell Wilson is going to end up in the hall of fame, that's not an indictment.  Jones inability to throw touchdowns is a much bigger deal than Lamar throwing a couple more interceptions than him.  

I didn't think anyone could be more annoying than the NFL is rigged guy, but here we are.  

I agree that giving up certain players for Rodgers is worse than giving up picks. However Green Bay knows they can’t start Love while still having Rodgers 60 million (it’s 59 right?) on the books for this season. So come July if it gets that far they’re going to take less to trade him. Especially if the Jets agree to eat most of the salary in return. That’s been my point all along. 

What has Jones had at receiver or tight end? Lamar has always had Mark Andrews and more competent receivers (notice I’m not saying good, just more competent) than Jones. 

I think we can agree then that each of us finds the other annoying. Especially after your Jerry Rice bull crap during the previous Jets discussion now your backtracking on Rodgers and Lamar crap. 

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42 minutes ago, supremebve said:

I didn't think anyone could be more annoying than the NFL is rigged guy, but here we are.  

I kinda miss that guy, I hope he makes a new account and just eases into it again and we don't realize its the same person until a few months in and suddenly we all go ITS THAT GUY and roll our eyes.

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Just pay Lamar, it ain't my money

Also Fuck Deshaun in the ass hope that contract is an albatross on the Browns forever and ever and ever like Bobby Bonilla except Deshaun doesn't get any of it because he's in prison or something

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19 minutes ago, Lawful Metal said:

Just pay Lamar, it ain't my money

Also Fuck Deshaun in the ass hope that contract is an albatross on the Browns forever and ever and ever like Bobby Bonilla except Deshaun doesn't get any of it because he's in prison or something

I couldn't agree with all of this any more than I currently do.

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5 hours ago, Kevin Wilson said:

I kinda miss that guy, I hope he makes a new account and just eases into it again and we don't realize its the same person until a few months in and suddenly we all go ITS THAT GUY and roll our eyes.

You shut your dirty mouth lol. We don't need him to show up for a third time. He was also banned for slut shaming Britt Baker / demanding Sammy & Tay publicly apologize for hiding their relationship from him at an autograph signing / trying to fight posters under his first incarnation. The NFL is fixed was his second account gimmick but he was also saying more gross women's wrestling stuff. Don't you make that monkey paw curl damn you.

Edited by NoFistsJustFlips
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