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GREAT 8: KENNY OMEGA vs. THE MIZ

KENNY OMEGA vs. THE MIZ  

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  1. 1. Choose One



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One guy who illustrates a style of wrestling I hate vs. the guy who probably I love most right now in main WWE for knowing less can be more if you are smart.

 

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Two guys who seem inspire very divisive opinions. They're both great in their own ways and stepped up in big spots.

I feel bad for people who can't enjoy both of them.

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Omega was as brilliant in ring as The Miz was outside of it. I went with Omega because I value in ring work a little more.. The Miz had some great matches but not enough.

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Knowing nothing else, I'll watch any match or segment either guy is in. I'm voting for Omega, and my reasoning--as with every other round--is pretty simple: he had more matches I liked, and his best matches were better.

I think there's a broader case to be made, though, which goes basically like this: Miz was--ahem--awesome doing Miz things, and had the best possible year anyone could have during which they didn't actually elevate themselves or anyone else. He was a midcard stooge heel at the beginning of the period, and that's what he is now. Nobody he worked with is better off. Omega, on the other hand, went from being a midcard stooge heel/sometimes top junior to a guy who could main event in Japan for the next five years, if he wanted; from the guy most famous in America for wrestling a blowup doll to the guy who basically perfected the "blockbuster action movie" main event style (which you may still hate, granted). He made himself a star in Japan, and--even if only briefly--made a Japanese match the biggest story among even relatively casual American fans. 

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I hate Miz for the right reasons. I hate Omega for the wrong reasons. Advantage Miz.

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I still dream of MIZ winning this whole thing if only so that if the world does end before next March...some day Alien scientists scouring the rubble of data for reasons why this society came to an end will run across the DVDVR and run an analysis of all data related to it...and when they come to the line of code that translates to

 

2017 March Madness Winner: MIZ

 

they will be like...Ahhhhhh. This is starting to make sense...

 

In other words, this is our Ozymandias.

MizyMaryseias.

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33 minutes ago, Matt D said:

I hate Miz for the right reasons. I hate Omega for the wrong reasons. Advantage Miz.

Do you enjoy current WWE main event style? That's my first question to people who dislike Omega, there is more selling and psychology and less finisher trading in an Omega match than current WWE.. yet Omega catches 1000% more flack for his work while WWE's BS is given a pass.

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This is what I've been trying to figure out too.

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3 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Do you enjoy current WWE main event style? That's my first question to people who dislike Omega, there is more selling and psychology and less finisher trading in an Omega match than current WWE.. yet Omega catches 1000% more flack for his work while WWE's BS is given a pass.

And my answer generally is "Fuck No" This the hate for both.

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Just now, Oyaji said:

This is what I've been trying to figure out too.

I don't understand it. Thus far nobody has given an explanation why an Owens and Cena match receives a pass for being far more egregious in everything that is "wrong" with Omega.

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Or AJ Styles' matches this year. Revival matches are pretty much 20+ minute sprints running from spot to spot, though the spots are laid out very well.

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I don't think I've been giving Owens any passes.

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2 minutes ago, Oyaji said:

Or AJ Styles' matches this year. Revival matches are pretty much 20+ minute sprints running from spot to spot, though the spots are laid out very well.

I don't like you. Oh, and also, bullshit.

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They do the drawn out heat segment, which is great but tell me the last half of the Toronto DIY match isn't running from spot to spot. Dash isn't on Dawson's level either, so you can actually see him trying to figure out where he's supposed to be at times too.

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1 minute ago, Oyaji said:

They do the drawn out heat segment, which is great but tell me the last half of the Toronto DIY match isn't running from spot to spot. Dash isn't on Dawson's level either, so you can actually see him trying to figure out where he's supposed to be at times too.

So wait, you are complaining because the last half of a match (AKA, the finishing stretch) was worked in a back and forth spot to spot style? That's, like, every match ever. 

You basically changed the style of this argument. Sure, matches can get close to even near the finish. That's always been how wrestling work. The difference is the Revival have great builds to those stretches in there matches. Owens, Omega, Cena, and what not don't. The Styles/Cena series, especially the last one, was them just doing a couple things for a few minutes and then straight to finisher spam, something the Revival have never done. 

So yeah, if you wanna take out just about the entirety of the first 2 falls from the 2/3 Falls match, it was kinda a spring. Who would have thought.

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I disagree about the build up in some Owens matches (although, this is still an area he needs to get better at because even in the Sami Zayn Battleground match, his heat segment was pretty dull) and most Omega matches lacking good builds. The Revival have a simple shine, drawn-out heat with some fun cutoffs, and a back and forth climax format to their matches. That's time tested and fine. I thought they did a better job against AA than DIY in making the first two-thirds of the match interesting and the last third less of a scramble but in truth they are pretty similar. The big difference when you're comparing The Revival to Omega is that the scramble in big Omega matches usually happens in the first half of the match where both men are fresh compared to the final half when there are longer control segments in Omega matches. This could be down to comparing a singles worker to a tag team though. I really enjoyed the DIY Takeover match but I didn't think it was either transcendent or untouchable. Top 10 WWF/E tag, sure. Top 5 maybe. But I'd take some of the great tags of the early 2000s over it and the company has never been known for emphasizing tag teams anyway. As I said, my main complaint with the Toronto match was just how often guys were having to run to positions for their spots. It irked me then and its impact on the match has probably grown in my mind over time.

As for Omega, he was in a match that went over 45 minutes and not once did I think it was drawn out for the sake of it. It flew by, so I guess he and Okada may have done something right on the way to the long finishing stretch. He's able to carry lesser skilled and not-so-over talent, making them look credible even when he wins. This was true more for the likes of YOSHI-HASHI but he also got Big Mike to the made man territory with their series last year. He's moving towards a split personality this year, from what I can tell. Young Bucks Omega, where he wears a shirt with tie dye pants and does comedy spots for the first two-thirds of the match and gets serious for the final third and then there's big match Kenny in his black tights and little to no comedy. And I love Big Match Kenny. Omega doesn't have the issue where the pops for kickouts and the like peak too early and then get smaller and smaller like a lot of people who are criticized for overkill suffer from.

This is Omega vs. Miz though and the in-ring performances are not remotely in the same world. Miz went from a guy whose matches I'd skip or suffer through to watchable and sometimes even very good, but I feel like he can be even more of a piece of garbage, chickenshit heel with his psychology. They're using his awkwardness in the ring to great effect with him doing Daniel Bryan's routine poorly but it's not exactly a ringing endorsement for his skill in the ring. The Ziggler series was impressive but it also had smoke and mirrors and peaked with the No Mercy match, not the eventual blowoff. The ladder match did not live up to the expectations their previous PPV match created and IIRC wasn't their a significant screw up that led to a funky finish? I'd take the thrown together Briscoes vs. Cole/Omega match from last month's Honor Rising show over any of Miz's matches from this period. Great appearances on Talking Smack and some fantastic heel character work on SmackDown isn't enough for me to pick him over Omega when the in-ring chasm between the two is just miles wide.

Looking back at my bracket, I have no idea what I was thinking going with Omega over Miz. I'm actually surprised it's as close as it is, but it's early days still.

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People seem to fixate on a few things about Omega and become rigid in their evaluation of him. It's pretty much the same thing people do with Miz.

 

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I don't think Revival is the best to make this argument..   I'm talking the likes of Cena, Owens, even Cesaro..  who are praised for working a far more spot intensive style and who rely on trading finisher stretches and big moves that aren't built up to and forgotten in seconds.. no selling, finisher spamming, no psychology.. 

That's why Omega's work is stronger right now than most because he is not nearly as reliant on that shit, though like I said he catches far more slack for it than the WWE guys which leads me to believe that some people simply are not watching NJPW and basing their opinions on the assumptions of a few.

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Just now, Niners Fan in CT said:

I don't think Revival is the best to make this argument..   I'm talking the likes of Cena, Owens, even Cesaro..  who are praised for working a far more spot intensive style and who rely on trading finisher stretches and big moves that aren't built up to and forgotten in seconds.. no selling, finisher spamming, no psychology.. 

That's why Omega's work is stronger right now than most because he is not nearly as reliant on that shit, though like I said he catches far more slack for it than the WWE guys which leads me to believe that some people simply are not watching NJPW and basing their opinions on the assumptions of a few.

And I have no problem with that statement overall. I don't defend Cena, Owens, or even current Cesaro on that regard. Not a big fan of any of them. Overall, you have a good point. Bringing the Revival up in it though makes the entire argument look worse overall, cause it doesn't hold water with them.

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1 hour ago, piranesi said:

I still dream of MIZ winning this whole thing if only so that if the world does end before next March...some day Alien scientists scouring the rubble of data for reasons why this society came to an end will run across the DVDVR and run an analysis of all data related to it

"Martians invaded in 2037? How were their punches?"

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18 minutes ago, El Dragon said:

And I have no problem with that statement overall. I don't defend Cena, Owens, or even current Cesaro on that regard. Not a big fan of any of them. Overall, you have a good point. Bringing the Revival up in it though makes the entire argument look worse overall, cause it doesn't hold water with them.

I took a lot of heat for that Satomura/Shirai match because Meiko dropped the leg selling too much and it wasn't a "Matt D" sort of match. In general I'm consistent. That was just a nice "vacation" match for me, and like people said, it was subdued relative to other work by Io.

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I'll pivot slightly and say my issue with Omega's work isn't a spot heavy style, it's laziness. If I were to pick the ten best matches featuring either Miz or Omega, Omega would have 1 and 2 but Miz would probably have 3-8. That's work you can set your watch to. Miz all day.

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