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Games of Thrones Unsullied thread

elizium

By elizium
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J.T.

J.T.

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, cwoy2j said:

Was Ned using Ice during his street duel with Jaime? I always thought Ice was his ceremonial sword and not what he carried around day to day.

I keep forgetting that when I take a quasi-facetious tone, it could be interpreted as deliberate transmission of misinformation.

No, IIRC Ned used a normal longsword when he fought Jaime.  Ice is / was a greatsword and was as you say used in a ceremonial manner.

TMK, he only used Ice to execute condemned prisoners and IIRC Ned killed Sansa's dire wolf, Lady, with it when Cersei demanded that Lady be put down in lieu of Arya driving Nymeria away after Nymeria bit Joffrey.

I wonder if this season will have a scene where Arya and Sansa finally talk about that particularly touchy subject?  All of the writing for the key dialogues have been astounding so far this season.

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J.T.

J.T.

Posted
Posted
15 hours ago, BobbyWhioux said:

He was mortally wounded and/or pronounced "beyond help" by Pycelle.  Qyburn did ?????????????????????? and he walks around, silent and never removing his helmet.  We don't know if he saved Gregor's life, technically saved his life, or technically didn't save his life.

if he's a zombie zombie he should be nice and hackable.  If he's a voodoo-style zombie, presumably not.  If he's some kind of golem [the other popular fan theory] who knows?

The Mountain is not a walking cadaver at least not in the Walker sense as his creation was alchemical rather than magical. 

As you say, the words "beyond help" are used to describe his condition after the poisoning, but does anyone ever officially pronounce him dead?

The Mountain's current incarnation has more in common with Frankenstein's Monster than a traditional zombie, so I suppose it is proper to refer to him as a flesh golem.  He is more unliving than undead, IMO, if that makes any sort of sense to anyone.

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J.T.

J.T.

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Posted

TBH, I was hoping that Jamie's answer to Olenna's drop the mic monologue would be "Oh, by the way.  I was lying when I said there wouldn't be any pain," and then Olenna would start clawing at her neck and spouting foam as he calmly sauntered out of the room..

Diana Rigg must've had a "leave like a boss" clause in her contract.

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J.T.

J.T.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Eivion said:

That wouldn't have felt right. Jamie isn't cruel generally speaking.

Well, it wouldn't have felt right because that would've required Jaime to have already known about the plot and have concocted the same poison used to kill Joffrey.

I thought that it was pretty ironic that Cersei's justice was took the form of poisoning the known poisoner of one of her children and the unsuspected poisoner of another.

I'll bet Jaime wishes he'd have chosen one of Cersei's more creative execution methods, once he learned about the assassination plot from Olenna.

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Eivion

Eivion

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1 hour ago, odessasteps said:

Other than that pushing a kid out of a window thing. But that was a long time ago. 

I didn't say he was a good person. As a matter of fact I think far too many forget about him trying to murder Bran and actually murdering one of his own cousins. Jamie is a pretty shitty person. He just isn't quite the monster others are willing to be.

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odessasteps

odessasteps

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45 minutes ago, Eivion said:

I didn't say he was a good person. As a matter of fact I think far too many forget about him trying to murder Bran and actually murdering one of his own cousins. Jamie is a pretty shitty person. He just isn't quite the monster others are willing to be.

I thought about describing him as lawful evil, but i dont think that would apply to someone who committed regicide and sleeps with his sister. 

He might just be the best of the bad people. That makes who the worst of the good people? Varys?

Too many shades of gray, bro. 

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OSJ

OSJ

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1 minute ago, Eivion said:

I didn't say he was a good person. As a matter of fact I think far too many forget about him trying to murder Bran and actually murdering one of his own cousins. Jamie is a pretty shitty person. He just isn't quite the monster others are willing to be.

Thank you! The narrative that Jamie is one of the good guys needs to die quickly. He's a brutally efficient killer and will stop at nothing to get his way. He is not a nice guy. No one on this show is totally free of some evilness, less it be Jon Snow. Yeah, there's lightyears between Cersei,  the Mad Queen, a total monster (and a stupid one at that, wonder where Joffrey got his two most notable traits?), and Jamie, who is simply a product of a really fucked up evil world, but I've seen a disturbing trend over the last couple of seasons to somehow cast him as this great anti-hero with heart of gold. Nothing could be further from the truth.

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OSJ

OSJ

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Posted
2 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

I thought about describing him as lawful evil, but i dont think that would apply to someone who committed regicide and sleeps with his sister. 

He might just be the best of the good people. That makes who the worst of the good people? Varys?

Too many shades of gray, bro. 

Did you mean "best of the bad people?" I'd say he or Brann has a fair claim on that. Worst of the good people? Gotta be Dany* or Varys. 

 

*She hasn't flipped out and gone batshit insane, but she IS the Mad King's daughter. Wait for it...

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Eivion

Eivion

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Glad to see I'm not alone in this, OSJ. Its been bothering me for years now how so many people have forgotten this shit. Best of the bad people crown seems like a fair title for Jamie. I think Varys takes the worst of the good people crown.

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J.T.

J.T.

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Posted
43 minutes ago, Eivion said:

He just isn't quite the monster others are willing to be.

On the contrary, I think that Jaime is quite willing to be the monster that others are willing to be, but his chauvinism and twisted sense of chivalry get in the way.

He wasin't willing to draw a sword and kill Bram for discovering him and Cersei in a compromising position because only men should die in combat, but had no problem pushing a child out of the window of a tall tower and hoping that the fall would get the job done instead.

He wasn't willing to entertain Cersei's more elaborate means of condemnation for Lady Olenna or use a sword to execute her, but had no issues with poisoning an old woman.

Sure, it was poetic justice given Olenna's role in Joffrey's assassination, but Jaime could just have suggested house arrest or imprisonment.

In retrospect, I'll bet that Jaime wished that he have used a more virulent venom and even worse, I honestly believe that he'd have wished that out of a sense of one-upsmanship rather than a desire to see justice done on his dead son's behalf.

It really baked his noodle that Olenna got the last snark in even in death.

It would not surprise me to see Cersei reading Jaimie the riot act for not going with drawing and quartering once he tells her about Olenna and he will chafe at the bit of his relative sense of "mercy."

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J.T.

J.T.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, odessasteps said:

But will he tell Cercei is also a question. I could see him keeping that for her.

If he does, it will be the writer's doing for the sake of the plot.

If Cersei finds out that Petyr Baelsih is a co-conspirator, his life won't be worth squat and suddenly Littlefinger becomes worth more to Jon as a bargaining chip than an ally.

Neither he nor Sansa like Baelish anyway, so why not turn him over to Cersei in exchange for an alliance with King's Landing?

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Throat

Throat

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The best of the worst is a great way to describe him. I think people get the idea that deep down Jaime's a nice guy because throughout the series there have been moments where he's looked regretful after doing or saying something awful. Like he wishes he could drop his swaggering prick persona and be a decent human being. But he never drops it, so he really is just a piece of shit. A piece of shit with occasional pangs of guilt. He did save Brienne, but that's seriously outweighed by all the horrible shit he's done out of love for the worst person in Westeros.

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cwoy2j

cwoy2j

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, OSJ said:

Did you mean "best of the bad people?" I'd say he or Brann has a fair claim on that. Worst of the good people? Gotta be Dany* or Varys. 

 

*She hasn't flipped out and gone batshit insane, but she IS the Mad King's daughter. Wait for it...

What's Brann done that's so bad? Did you mean to type Bronn?

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Jrag

Jrag

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Jaime saved two of the best good people (Breinne and Tyrion) and the entire population of King's Landing. That goes a long way I would say.

Pushing a kid out of the window is obviously the worst, but I'm not sure I would put much distance between Jaime and Dany on the morality scale.

Dany, like Jamie, has saved a bunch of people. She also crucifies dudes and locks people in vaults to starve.

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