Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 One trained monkey physical feat That Rollins spot meant a whole hell of a lot. It was his I can go tow to tow with Cena moment and it was the hightlight of the show, but feel free to keep peddling your false Rollins narrative about his offense being too flashy or something.. The truth of it is, Rollins DID tone his stuff down. He would generally only get flashy in big matches or moments of desperation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 One trained monkey physical feat That Rollins spot meant a whole hell of a lot. It was his I can go tow to tow with Cena moment and it was the hightlight of the show, but feel free to keep peddling your false Rollins narrative about his offense being to flashy or something.. And maybe he shouldn't have been going "tow to tow" with Cena in the first place? That's kind of 60% of the problem with the guy. He should have had some sort of counter that was more appropriate to his role, his frame, his style of working, not just something that was more impressive and tried to cast him in a completely inappropriate position that played against his strengths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 The authority golden boy SHOULD be going toe to toe with Cena. That they were inconsistent about whether he was an A+ player or corporate stooge is not Rollins fault. At the time around SS they were building Rollins up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I guess the "I want to fuck her" vote is also in play. Which is pretty much the saddest reason to vote for someone. You poor lonely souls. These are jokes, I really like Emma as a wrestler. She has been absolutely fantastic since her heel turn. Her character work and her in ring style has changed from her dancing face run, and is amongst the best in the company. Rollins' ring work was really good in my opinion, but his character work ranged from cringe-worthy to bad. Emma got my vote, because she may very well be the best combination of character and ring work in the entire company right now. She has been absolutely awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 3, 2016 Author Share Posted March 3, 2016 Y'all realize the expression is "toe to toe" right? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 Oof. It's early haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 Y'all realize the expression is "toe to toe" right? I put the thing in quotes so as to mock the guy in the most pedantic internet debate club asshole sort of way. You were just supposed to leave it out there. I really hate that Rollins power spot in the Cena match though. I also hate the god damn corner power bombs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 3, 2016 Author Share Posted March 3, 2016 Y'all realize the expression is "toe to toe" right? I put the thing in quotes so as to mock the guy in the most pedantic internet debate club asshole sort of way. You were just supposed to leave it out there. Yeah - I have enough nonsense to weed through today Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I'm not saying the guy should be doing power spots on the reg, but it's not like Rollins is a tiny dude. I imagine he will do more power spots later on in his career when his body starts to slow down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I just really want that Emma vs Pentagon match up. I'm going to be crushed when it's 20-4 Pentagon right out of the gate. I'm not saying the guy should be doing power spots on the reg, but it's not like Rollins is a tiny dude. I imagine he will do more power spots later on in his career when his body starts to slow down. He's got the height but he's not built for stuff like that. Cena is. I think that it's even worse as a key spot in the match. Rollins should have been outsmarting him. A great example of what I would have preferred to see is the Punk vs Cena match that Brian and I like so much where Punk came in, having done his homework, and kept countering Cena's big spots with finesse. Rollins has the speed, and I think he showed that in the three way with Cena and Brock that everyone loved from the Rumble, that's out of this time period. I would have liked to see more of than as opposed to an ego power spot. Not every top guy has to wrestle the same. Not every top guy should wrestle the same. Except for in situations against wrestlers that he really couldn't "bully," like Kane, Rollins did a pretty weak job portraying a vulnerable champion. Yes, he's the chosen one of the Authority, but half of the gimmick is supposed to be how bullshit that is compared to people who should really be in that spot like Reigns and Cena. He needs to be conniving and dangerous but ultimately, the hype is supposed to be just that, hype, and that never came across in his work. That's one reason why the Reigns experiment failed for much of this period. Rollins basically had one job and he failed to accomplish it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I feel like they called him the Architect a bunch, but he never really came across as the smart guy. To me his character was always a guy who got in over his head and relied on athleticism to compensate. Viewing it through that lens, mimicking a Cena strength spot in a big match situation fits perfectly. If Punk had done that same spot it wouldn't fit, but I've never viewed Rollins and Punk as similar types. Punk doing the 5 knuckle shuffle = Rollins rolling through the cross body. Punk is cocky, Rollins is desperate. Both of those spots make sense in context. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I just really want that Emma vs Pentagon match up. I'm going to be crushed when it's 20-4 Pentagon right out of the gate. I'm not saying the guy should be doing power spots on the reg, but it's not like Rollins is a tiny dude. I imagine he will do more power spots later on in his career when his body starts to slow down. He's got the height but he's not built for stuff like that. Cena is. I think that it's even worse as a key spot in the match. Rollins should have been outsmarting him. A great example of what I would have preferred to see is the Punk vs Cena match that Brian and I like so much where Punk came in, having done his homework, and kept countering Cena's big spots with finesse. Rollins has the speed, and I think he showed that in the three way with Cena and Brock that everyone loved from the Rumble, that's out of this time period. I would have liked to see more of than as opposed to an ego power spot. Not every top guy has to wrestle the same. Not every top guy should wrestle the same. Except for in situations against wrestlers that he really couldn't "bully," like Kane, Rollins did a pretty weak job portraying a vulnerable champion. Yes, he's the chosen one of the Authority, but half of the gimmick is supposed to be how bullshit that is compared to people who should really be in that spot like Reigns and Cena. He needs to be conniving and dangerous but the hype is supposed to be just that, hype. I don't get the "he shouldn't be doing power spots" argument. If a guy can actually do the power spots, why can't they do them? Being smaller doesn't mean weaker. I think a wrestler should be able to use whatever tool he has in his toolbox. Anyone who has played any organized sport can tell you that they've run into someone who had a level of strength that was more than meets the eye. Rollins is really strong, I don't think he should pretend he's not for the sake of character. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I feel like they called him the Architect a bunch, but he never really came across as the smart guy. To me his character was always a guy who got in over his head and relied on athleticism to compensate. Viewing it through that lens, mimicking a Cena strength spot in a big match situation fits perfectly. So you're saying they pushed him as the architect, but you didn't buy it so you're viewing him through your own lens to make sense of things that others say don't make sense in the context how they pushed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 No. I'm saying he thought he was smart, but never really was. That's the character. That's how he always wound up being in over his head. Even crazy man Ambrose constantly outsmarted him, but Rollins still got the better of him at times because he is physically gifted. I'd argue that was all there on screen. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromatagon Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I hated the architect nickname. Made me think of Mike Brady too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I just really want that Emma vs Pentagon match up. I'm going to be crushed when it's 20-4 Pentagon right out of the gate. I'm not saying the guy should be doing power spots on the reg, but it's not like Rollins is a tiny dude. I imagine he will do more power spots later on in his career when his body starts to slow down. He's got the height but he's not built for stuff like that. Cena is. I think that it's even worse as a key spot in the match. Rollins should have been outsmarting him. A great example of what I would have preferred to see is the Punk vs Cena match that Brian and I like so much where Punk came in, having done his homework, and kept countering Cena's big spots with finesse. Rollins has the speed, and I think he showed that in the three way with Cena and Brock that everyone loved from the Rumble, that's out of this time period. I would have liked to see more of than as opposed to an ego power spot. Not every top guy has to wrestle the same. Not every top guy should wrestle the same. Except for in situations against wrestlers that he really couldn't "bully," like Kane, Rollins did a pretty weak job portraying a vulnerable champion. Yes, he's the chosen one of the Authority, but half of the gimmick is supposed to be how bullshit that is compared to people who should really be in that spot like Reigns and Cena. He needs to be conniving and dangerous but the hype is supposed to be just that, hype. I don't get the "he shouldn't be doing power spots" argument. If a guy can actually do the power spots, why can't they do them? Being smaller doesn't mean weaker. I think a wrestler should be able to use whatever tool he has in his toolbox. Anyone who has played any organized sport can tell you that they've run into someone who had a level of strength that was more than meets the eye. Rollins is really strong, I don't think he should pretend he's not for the sake of character. I appreciate what you're saying, but I don't agree at all. Just because you can do something doesn't mean that you should, and character should always trump "cool stuff that a wrestler can do," because achieving specific storyline goals is far more important in wrestling than having a good match for the sake of a good match, especially in a WWE main event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I like, but don't love Seth in-ring. But Jesus Fucking Christ he brought the twenty minute opening promos to an all-time low. And he was a terrible promo before he got that spot when he did the quick two minute ones. That alone is reason enough to fit me to vote Emma, who was wildly entertaining both in ring and on the mic all year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supremebve Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I appreciate what you're saying, but I don't agree at all. Just because you can do something doesn't mean that you should, and character should always trump "cool stuff that a wrestler can do," because achieving specific storyline goals is far more important in wrestling than having a good match for the sake of a good match, especially in a WWE main event. I think the biggest problem with his character is that his character isn't a character. He's trying to fit every little heel thing into his character, and it ended up being a jumbled mess. Why can't he be the heel that is a really good wrestler, who cheats because he wants to not because he has to? If he's going to be a heel they have to kind of fine tune what kind of heel he is going to be. I root for Seth, because that dude has all the talent in the world. They just have to put him in a position where he can reach his full potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 I appreciate what you're saying, but I don't agree at all. Just because you can do something doesn't mean that you should, and character should always trump "cool stuff that a wrestler can do," because achieving specific storyline goals is far more important in wrestling than having a good match for the sake of a good match, especially in a WWE main event. I think the biggest problem with his character is that his character isn't a character. He's trying to fit every little heel thing into his character, and it ended up being a jumbled mess. Why can't he be the heel that is a really good wrestler, who cheats because he wants to not because he has to? If he's going to be a heel they have to kind of fine tune what kind of heel he is going to be. I root for Seth, because that dude has all the talent in the world. They just have to put him in a position where he can reach his full potential. A lot of this is because he has to be the Corporate Barbarian King Cerebral Assassin HHH's human avatar on earth, so he has to look strong in certain ways as he represents Hunter, but not too strong that he makes people think that he's better in any specific way than Hunter and still vulnerable for the sake of the babyfaces and show a lack of legitimacy. It's a terrible tightrope to walk, and I feel sympathy for him, even if I think his own self-confidence (which in other times and places could be a plus) makes him somewhat blind to the position he's in. That said, feeling at least some sympathy for why someone is a failure doesn't mean that the person isn't still a failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 He wasn't really a failure, though. Was he miscast? Yes, but he was still getting more heat than any active heel they have right now. That counts for something. Hell, the only one currently getting more boos than Rollins did last summer is Roman Reigns. And please don't counter with ratings talk. I don't give a shit about the ratings and putting that on Rollins is disingenuous anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 He wasn't really a failure, though. Was he miscast? Yes, but he was still getting more heat than any active heel they have right now. That counts for something. Hell, the only one currently getting more boos than Rollins did last summer is Roman Reigns. That, in and of itself, is part of why he's a failure. You can get all the heat in the world, but if it doesn't translate to babyfaces getting over, then it's a failure. On the other hand, Emma was Aces in the Bayley redemption tour and helping to shine her up for her run at the title. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrag Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 Get the fuck out with all that talk. There are a million reasons why Roman can't get over as a face. Rollins wasn't the problem. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 It's not the heel's job to help make the babyface? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 That is pure insanity to say that it's on Rollins because Reigns isn't getting over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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