Niners Fan in CT Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Before we get into discussions about story telling and Brock Lesnar, what is the story that Cena tells beyond comeback/overcome the odds? I'm tempted to play your card of expressing shock and disbelief that someone would say this, but I'll answer with examples instead. First off, "comeback" is not a story any more than "heat segment" is. It's a basic element of a wrestling match. No, Cena's comeback is extremely formulaic and just because Daniel Bryan or CM Punk were able to throw a wrinkle in there doesn't change the fact that most of his matches since he has become The Marine/Colorful John Cena are very similar and I don't even care that they are. He's good at what he does. It's not even close to the same thing as a hot tag or any other case where momentum has shifted. It has been discussed to death on message boards for years so we can skip past your disbelief that it is a topic of discussion. In recent times, finisher overdrive IS the entire story and Cena has been in his fair share of these as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Before we get into discussions about story telling and Brock Lesnar, what is the story that Cena tells beyond comeback/overcome the odds? I'm tempted to play your card of expressing shock and disbelief that someone would say this, but I'll answer with examples instead. First off, "comeback" is not a story any more than "heat segment" is. It's a basic element of a wrestling match. No, Cena's comeback is extremely formulaic and just because Daniel Bryan or CM Punk were able to throw a wrinkle in there doesn't change the fact that most of his matches since he has become The Marine/Colorful John Cena are very similar and I don't even care that they are. He's good at what he does. It's not even close to the same thing as a hot tag or any other case where momentum has shifted. It has been discussed to death on message boards for years so we can skip past your disbelief that it is a topic of discussion. Well shit. If it's been "discussed on message boards", then it must be true. (Strangest appeal to authority I've ever seen.) Since you apparently lack a frame of reference to have this discussion, I suppose we're done. Brock Lesnar is a talented but limited wrestler. Batista is similarly talented, (if less so, other than speaking ability,) but similarly limited. The comparison is valid, whether you accept it or not. Cena might have less physical gifts, but he is a far better wrestler than either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 On second thought it's better not to continue. I'm not going back and forth with someone who is choosing to play dumb. It's like if I asked "what was racist about Triple H's promos leading up to WM XIX?" How about this. Lesnar's strikes are more devastating than Cena's. There's an example of something he is better at. Woo. Now we can move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCM Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Lesnar is a once in a generation athlete. I recall being extremely impressed with how good he made Punk look, and how good his selling was in that match. Its just always going to be one of those what if's we have to ask. How good could he have been if he stuck around in WWE all this time. My guess is he'd be on the shortlist of best guys over the past 15 years if not the best. Cena didn't get good consistently until 07. Lesnar was really far ahead of his peers during his first run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Lesnar didn't wrestle for what six-seven years prior to Extreme Rules? First match back and it's the Match of the Year. Some say the Match of the Decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted March 14, 2015 Share Posted March 14, 2015 Christ almighty, when do the polls return? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StretchMediatedHypertrophy Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 good main-event babyfaces are more valuable than main-event heels. Only thing I'd disagree with is this comment, with caveats-slash-hedges that if you're talking about merch that's different, and also they're arguably more valuable to WWE because it's traditionally booked around the babyface rather than heel-centered. Well I'm also talking about longevity. Almost any main-event babyface can be turned into a main-event heel, if necessary, and probably cycled back. Lesnar can be funny an' all, but he still really only has one gear (he can toss around big guys so well that he makes underdogs of 400lb wrestlers) and I don't think he's anything other than a heel really. But getting heel heat from a crowd needs a strong, sympathetic babyface or the crowd will just pop for Brock. He'd have been difficult to book for weekly TV over a 5 year period. Batista's power game was not on the same level as Brock's, but his style was more suited to the WWE product - that is perhaps an indictment of WWE but there it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted March 15, 2015 Share Posted March 15, 2015 How did Buxx Belmar not get nominated?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Sweet Sixteen is now open Approximate 48 Hour voting window God - I so dont remember what matches I posted already so y'all will have to deal with repeats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 We've lost our fucking minds, this year; Jesus, Mary and Joseph... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 This is the round of voting that knocks me off the leaderboard, thank god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikoBaltimore Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Am I the only one who's a bit annoyed by the "Vote [this guy], fuck [this other guy]" posts? Not geared at any particular thread, but why there's this need to try and bully people into voting for somebody I don't know. Vote for whoever, state your case and have fun with it. It's all about opinion anyway. Sometimes it's the popular opinion, other times it's not. But it sure seems like a lot of "Your opinion's wrong!". We're encouraged to say why we vote for somebody, but can you blame those that just vote and don't say anything? Yes, I know this is how March Madness normally is, but does it really have to be? It just brings out the worst in people sometimes, and it's only the sweet 16. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Fun has nothing to do with march madness. It'S either about the bracket contest or trying to impose your will on everyone else, usually be speaking in declarative statements as snobbishly as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 Am I the only one who's a bit annoyed by the "Vote [this guy], fuck [this other guy]" posts? Not geared at any particular thread, but why there's this need to try and bully people into voting for somebody I don't know. Vote for whoever, state your case and have fun with it. It's all about opinion anyway. Sometimes it's the popular opinion, other times it's not. But it sure seems like a lot of "Your opinion's wrong!". We're encouraged to say why we vote for somebody, but can you blame those that just vote and don't say anything? Yes, I know this is how March Madness normally is, but does it really have to be? It just brings out the worst in people sometimes, and it's only the sweet 16. I think I tend more to overlook the piddly arguments like you mentioned, to a point I don't even always notice them. But I get a kick out of the sidebar discussions that occur every so often ... right now, the notion of an Ambrose/Nakamura crazy-off, the Passion of the Gulak & the anti-AJ Styles campaign is fun. And the discussions about male vs. female matches, pro or con have been entertaining. But when things just get to the point that the same argument is getting made to no resolve (the earlier Lesnar discussion that ended in his matchup thread but continued in this one), that's when I zone out. We are some marvelous human beings, wot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 Plus I think one shouldn't take things that seriously I mean I declared FUCK RANDY ORTON! early and often and no one cares. Of course it helps that Randy Orton stinks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man Known as Dan Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 You know, I hadn't checked brackets in quite a while, and I had no idea I was within 1 of first. And the 2 above me both have things in there bracket that aren't looking good too. Weird. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I now am voting toward El Dragon's bracket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I see no shame in losing to El Dragon. Someone make sure I don't do a ballot next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 16, 2015 Author Share Posted March 16, 2015 It honestly probably comes down to if Zayn or Rollins or Rusev wins I am ignoring the two people who picked Nakamura since I feel like there is enough hate in the hearts of voters here to keep that from happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 16, 2015 Share Posted March 16, 2015 I still think we can get Cavernario over Rollins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 Unless there are a zillion votes come in the next 2 hours - I will be closing the polls when I get into work (approximately 9 am EST) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 Yup - after the Round of 16 - Dragon now has a two point lead And of the completed on time brackets... Brysynner is in dead last Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 I got bumped to 15. 15. The only shame in it is that I'm a point under Goodear. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 18, 2015 Author Share Posted March 18, 2015 Polls open again If you really need me to post videos for you at this stage than you are not doing this right... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DylanWaco Posted March 18, 2015 Share Posted March 18, 2015 Does anyone else feel like all the hard votes are over? With the random bracketing most of the tough, heartbreaking decisions had to be made really early. Not sure there is any match up that could happen at this point where my choice wouldn't be virtually immediate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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