Craig H Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Yeah. WWE went out of their way to test how bulletproof Cena was. He had no character other than plucky new guy, then he became a white rapper and was given B2 as a heater. I think it was sometime around Cena busting out the throwback jersey depending on where they were wrestling that he started putting all of these little things together, and the next you know they want him to rap battle Jay-Z or Eminem (or was it Fabolous?) at WM. Even then, it looked like he would be a gatekeeper kind of dude, losing to Undertaker, losing to Brock, beating guys just under that main event level. His character and strength on the mic just kept growing exponentially though, and where you knew there was no turning back was the Royal Rumble where people really wanted him to win, but he got eliminated and looked like he hurt himself while getting eliminated. There was just this thought of, holy shit, this is the guy, please don't be hurt. Next thing he does is giving Big Show the FU at WM and his flag was planted. Of course, again, my memory is shit so I likely mixed some of that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Good point by Fowler. From what I recall Cena was initially tossed out there in pastel trunks without a finisher as "hey look at this young kid who can kinda sorta hold his own before losing to Kurt Angle".When he first came up, his gimmick (get this) was that he had a bunch of different-colored pairs of trunks. I think that had to help him later when he became rapping Cena, because everyone was like "holy shit, this guy has a personality."He was like the Rock in that he made himself into a star by sheer force of will. Probably has something to do with the fact that both used their heel gimmicks to show enough personality to get fans to like them and demand they be faces. The gimmick was supposed to be he wore the colors of a local sports team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NikoBaltimore Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Isn't the rumor that Cena was close to being released and would have been released if the white rapper thing didn't take off? That's been the long-running story and I think there's truth to that. Here's a crazy thing to think: What would happen to him if Stephanie didn't hear his rapping? What if she was anywhere else, would he still have gotten that chance to show what he can do? It's very possible without her there he might have been cut. Just one of those weird things to think about, especially when thinking how different WWE would have been in future years without John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Well, you have to bear in mind that the first thing she did after she heard him rapping was have him dress up as Vanilla Ice on Smackdown's Halloween show. It was only after that got over, and then he wasn't as over when he went back to being different coloured tights guy a week later, that he got to be a rap guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piranesi Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 So if we did a historical survey of just WWF/WWE, just Vince. How many guys who actually got huge over and can be considered successful top or near top guys actually got over "according to plan"? And how man got over despite the obstacles in their way, accidentally or because they pushed against the plan or some random event that had nothing to do with "the plan" catapulted them? Rock, Austin, Bryan, Punk, Cena would all be "accidental" or "diverging from the plan"? Hogan? and who else worked just by doing what Vince said and it worked the way Vince expected? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victator Posted February 26, 2016 Share Posted February 26, 2016 Warrior, Undertaker, Brock lots of middle and lower card guys in the 80s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Triple H eventually got over to where they wanted him to. But it took a bloody long time. Shawn Michaels too, once Vince realised that the big man era was pretty much over, he said 'this is the guy' and it worked... about from the 'Real Intercontinental Champion' angle onwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jiji Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Except he wasn't a great draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Well, yeah, in real life he wasn't, but according to the official WWE version of history, he was a great draw. And if that's what they want you to think, then it must be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Rock is an odd choice because he was hand-picked, failed miserably, and then got MASSIVELY over after they moved on and realized Austin was the guy instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I still believe The Rock and Cena were chosen. WWE had to choose someone in 2005 and they went with Batista and Cena. Yes, Cena wasn't originally a hand picked guy but he became "the man" the way they wanted him to. He didn't become the man as the white rapper. He did it as the corny white bread jokester. The Rock was picked it just took longer than they had anticipated. A few bumps in the road but he got there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Even in 2005, Batista was the guy they chose as the man. Cena just got the belt on the B-show. Then a few months later they finally admitted Cena was the top guy. Christ the pop he got when he was drafted to RAW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Massive pop, yes. But are you counting Batista as a fail? I'd consider that a success. He continued to receive huge reactions until the day he retired...the first time. Orton is another hand-picked success though he had to turn back heel, somewhat comparable to how The Rock played out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 No, I'm not calling Batista a fail, just that he wasn't THE top guy. Cena was. And they clearly saw it the other way even after finally getting around to putting Cena up top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie M. Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 People want to see a person's journey. I could be wrong but almost all of the biggest names in history had ups and downs that the fans experienced along with them. Real ones, too, not manufactured ones like they've done with Reigns. No one watched developmental when Reigns was there so he basically just showed up one day in a main event stable as the toughest guy in the group. Edit: I agree with Fowler on Batista. There's this constant narrative pushed about how HHH made Batista yet Batista treaded water after that. He wasn't some big time draw after Mania. In fact he quickly wore out his welcome and it wasn't until he found himself as a heel again that he really showed he belonged at the top of the card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I don't know about that he had some memorable stuff going on like the feud with Taker and the shit with Eddie. Batista was a pretty big deal after WM21. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Batista's biggest problem is the series on injuries he had that keep derailing him. But he was clearly behind Cena, and that clearly wasn't the plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victator Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Batista said they had almost given up on him when he was put with Reverend D-Von. That when he was put on Raw he was lucky Triple H took an interest in him. I mean its hard to say. Nobody wants to say "I was hand picked and the course set for me." Everyone wants to beat the odds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go2Sleep Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I think the only guys to go 100% according to plan since the attitude era were Lesnar and Angle. Even though Brock left at the end of his first contract, they got everything they envisioned from him during his time with the company. Depending on how Rollins shakes out, he might join this group. You could maybe make the case for Orton even though they botched his big face turn. Everyone else has had significant twists and turns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Nature Boy Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 I still don't get why they didn't just run with mega douche Orton and have him kick Triple H out of Evolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nate Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 WHY is Cena not using the Proto-Bomb anymore??!?! Easily better than the current AA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cristobal Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 He uses a version of it as the setup for the five knuckle shuffle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted February 27, 2016 Share Posted February 27, 2016 Right. Every now and then he uses it for a pinfall attempt. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joseph2112 Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 I think Batista was good and "hand picked" by the company, but I don't think he could ever be a face. He is a tremendous heel, but the WWE has always mostly been a face company. I do think the Batista's face turn was tremendous though. So subtle yet obvious. Then that first promo with the "you people" and "appreciate Triple H" shit. Yuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted February 28, 2016 Share Posted February 28, 2016 His heel turn at the end of his first run was career revitalizing. He was dead in the water, then... BOOM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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