October 2023 Wrestling Discussion

[clintthecrippler]

I will forever love that the old Coliseum Video intro left in Dick Kroll getting beaned in the noggin with whatever wad of paper bounced right off his head, and also somehow had Lou Thesz vs Rikidozan footage that to this day we have no idea how that ended up in the WWF video vault to begin with. 

[odessasteps]

They had a fun bit on the new BTS mailbox talking about those knock off videos in mid to late 80s like Mat Masters or other generic sounding titles that had random Memphis or Mid South matches on them.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

My local had a copy of an ECW show with Sabu and Cactus Jack on the cover that I just assume explained where Headshrinker Samu went to.

And a WCW Bash At The Beach 94 tape that made no sense to me contextually as there was no WCW coverage in Australia and assumed it was one in the same as the Jim Barnett 70s era promotion that my uncle used to watch, and somehow I'd totally missed Hulk Hogan working PPVs locally for the past few months.

Oh and WM IV was cut into two tapes, and almost every store only ever had the second half.

I remember going on holiday when I was about 8 to Brisbane and the video shop next door to the hotel having literally every wrestling tape ever and ruining our holiday because I just wanted to stay in the room and watch them all instead.

[JohnnyJ]

4 hours ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said:

I remember going on holiday when I was about 8 to Brisbane and the video shop next door to the hotel having literally every wrestling tape ever and ruining our holiday because I just wanted to stay in the room and watch them all instead.

What's fascinating is this was a time period before the world was connected. And you have these wrestling nerds scattered around that don't know each other and arent following any guide. Yet, we were all doing the same things. 

If you asked me as a kid what the highlight was of my yearly trip to Grandmas, it was getting my hands on WCW 92-93 ppvs at the Florida rental stores. This was a time when homes had one tv. I still remember sitting in a room full immediate and extended family sitting 18 inches from the tv watching cactus v. sting. In retrospect I can't tell if this was good or bad parenting.

Meanwhile, my kids are so spoiled, they don't know what a commercial is.  

 

 

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

I truly hope video stores make a comeback in some form or another. 

I want socially awkward kids to learn social skills by recommending rom-coms to help other guys get laid, or overstating the importance of Eyes Wide Shut, or knowing who to try and pull late fees on and who not to.

 

[HarryArchieGus]

16 hours ago, Hamhock said:

I can’t really put into words how fun it was to rent a Betamax of “Best of the WWF Vol. 1/2/3/etc.” and hear the opening music kick in:

 

Goddamn I love this intro. Great use of the triangle! Wrestling intros with actual action - now there's an old idea worth rehashing. So many great clips. Orton/Piper double bodyslamming Snuka seemed devastating to me as a child. Maybe it still does. And then Patera swinging the fuck out of Powers, wow! I never questioned seeing clips of SD Jones battling Mike Sharpe in the intro to the 'Best of the WWF'. It still makes me further believe that Gorilla Monsoon was right - Mike Sharpe 'no slouch', SD Jones 'no slouch'! Er at least, maybe that was the case, in that fascinating era that preceded my wrestling discovery.

Caught this random episode of NWA WCW from 1990.
https://youtu.be/mkTjHQr4haU?si=nifq8kVTG6OpSpmp&t=361
I love this Doom-Flair/Anderson package. It's a simple thing, but I love how the first confrontation is just words. The second gets broken up before it can begin. And then... we get the full on attack. Seems like subtle storytelling compared to modern day booking. Now I'm curious to find out how this interesting feud played out. Also, with the endless amount of TV wrestling happening every week, I'd love to see a return of these Magazine Update/Special Report segments. 
 

[Cobra Commander]

World Class starting episodes by announcing the main event (showing clips of competitors on screen) and showing the entire card on screen is an interesting touch that I don't think i've seen in that exact fashion. Obviously shows will mention the scheduled matches to open up and there's AEW Card posts online.. but it's one way to tell people "hey, stay tuned, there's some wrestlers you like this week"

also were they holding Sportatorium cards every week and showing an hours-worth of the action on TV while keeping the rest exclusive to the fans who show up?

[odessasteps]

IIRC, They taped TV fortnightly Friday night at the Sportatorium. And then taped Mondays in Ft Worth for the “local” TV show. 

[Infinit]

7 hours ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Goddamn I love this intro. Great use of the triangle! Wrestling intros with actual action - now there's an old idea worth rehashing. So many great clips. Orton/Piper double bodyslamming Snuka seemed devastating to me as a child. Maybe it still does. And then Patera swinging the fuck out of Powers, wow! I never questioned seeing clips of SD Jones battling Mike Sharpe in the intro to the 'Best of the WWF'. It still makes me further believe that Gorilla Monsoon was right - Mike Sharpe 'no slouch', SD Jones 'no slouch'! Er at least, maybe that was the case, in that fascinating era that preceded my wrestling discovery.

Caught this random episode of NWA WCW from 1990.
https://youtu.be/mkTjHQr4haU?si=nifq8kVTG6OpSpmp&t=361
I love this Doom-Flair/Anderson package. It's a simple thing, but I love how the first confrontation is just words. The second gets broken up before it can begin. And then... we get the full on attack. Seems like subtle storytelling compared to modern day booking. Now I'm curious to find out how this interesting feud played out. Also, with the endless amount of TV wrestling happening every week, I'd love to see a return of these Magazine Update/Special Report segments. 
 

Have you seen Arn & Barry vs Doom from Starrcade? Such a great brawl

Also you NEED to find the video of Teddy Long checking out Flair's limo and yacht. Tremendous stuff.

Edited October 8, 2023 by Infinit

[Cobra Commander]

while listening to "Mental Health" by Quiet Riot, I came up with the stupidest most self-destructive finishing move that has probably already been done by indy wrestlers already

The inverted diving headbutt. Where you fall off the top rope backwards and the back of your head hits the guy on the mat. (edit: the unofficial nickname for the move is "How to give yourself a concussion")

Edited October 8, 2023 by Cobra Commander

[HumanChessgame]

21 hours ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said:

My local had a copy of an ECW show with Sabu and Cactus Jack on the cover that I just assume explained where Headshrinker Samu went to.

And a WCW Bash At The Beach 94 tape that made no sense to me contextually as there was no WCW coverage in Australia and assumed it was one in the same as the Jim Barnett 70s era promotion that my uncle used to watch, and somehow I'd totally missed Hulk Hogan working PPVs locally for the past few months.

Oh and WM IV was cut into two tapes, and almost every store only ever had the second half.

I remember going on holiday when I was about 8 to Brisbane and the video shop next door to the hotel having literally every wrestling tape ever and ruining our holiday because I just wanted to stay in the room and watch them all instead.

Did you get the Apter magazines over there?

[Curt McGirt]

11 hours ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Great use of the triangle!

I thought the xylophone work at the start was inspired as well. 

The only non-PPV tape I ever rented was the More WWF's Most Unusual Matches one with the identical Hogan/Race Texas death matches and the battle royale where Lanny Poffo came out wearing a suit of armor. I think the best thing on it was how much Hercules Hernandez bled in a chain match. 

[Casey]

2 hours ago, Cobra Commander said:

The inverted diving headbutt. Where you fall off the top rope backwards and the back of your head hits the guy on the mat. (edit: the unofficial nickname for the move is "How to give yourself a concussion")

Darby Allin liked that.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

Double post

Edited October 8, 2023 by GuerrillaMonsoon

[Cleavy]

3 hours ago, HumanChessgame said:

Did you get the Apter magazines over there?

yes, we did get Apter mags in Australia.

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

Yeah, I think pre 1998, we got the one off Apter picture mags with some decent frequency (like $6 or $7) with really crappy pics of WWF guys from when they were in another promotion.

The official WWF mags or the PWI usually turned up every second month, and were just shy of $20 a pop. Given the newsagencies that had them always seemed to be well stocked pornographers it was probably in the same batch.

In hindsight, those newsagencies were really good to not enquire too much about what I was turning their store into a library with.

[Cleavy]

1 hour ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said:

Yeah, I think pre 1998, we got the one off Apter picture mags with some decent frequency (like $6 or $7) with really crappy pics of WWF guys from when they were in another promotion.

The official WWF mags or the PWI usually turned up every second month, and were just shy of $20 a pop. Given the newsagencies that had them always seemed to be well stocked pornographers it was probably in the same batch.

In hindsight, those newsagencies were really good to not enquire too much about what I was turning their store into a library with.

yes, usually with the sport section, which occasionally with the larger newsagencies was next to the penthouse/playboy mags.  the first WWF magazine I ever bought was the one with Honky Tonk Man on the cover, which was ahead of the WWF programming that was airing on tv.  But we had access to PWI/Inside Wrestling/The Wrestler/Wrestle America etc, and WCW magazine.  (and Power Slam)

[Casey]

I wish I could remember the name of the magazine, but I know it was a British one. Slam or something like that? This was probably 1999-2001, since WCW was still around. I got it in a book store inside of the Nashville airport when I was a kid. I only ever had that one issue, but it was decidedly better than Pro Wrestling Illustrated.

As far as official magazines go, ECW had the best for my money. But I just fell in love with all things ECW come 1999 when I discovered them, so I’m a bit bias. In reality the magazine probably wasn’t that much different from the WCW or WWF mags.

EDIT: oh hey look at that, @Cleavy just mentioned that mag I was talking about. Power Slam, yeah!

Edited October 8, 2023 by Casey

[The Natural]

Over in the UK, WWE Magazine was always available as a kid. Less so WCW Magazine. Remember PWI was there. Power Slam was my favourite. Now the only ones are PWI, Inside the Ropes and WrestleTalk.

[The Natural]

We're in the last quarter of 2023. Anybody up for awards? Feel free to use my categories or add your own.

• Wrestler of the Year: Bryan Danielson.
• WWE Wrestler of the Year: Gunther.
• Best Title Reign. Gunther as WWE Intercontinental Champion.
• Match of the Year: Bryan Danielson vs. Zack Sabre Jr, AEW WrestleDream.
• Card of the Year: AEW All Out.
• Promotion of the Year: AEW.
• Tag Team of the Year: FTR.
• Face of the Year: Cody Rhodes. I think most here would go with Orange Cassidy.
• Heel of the Year: Christian Cage.
• Best on Promos: Christian Cage.
• Biggest shock result of the year: Roman Reigns retaining the Undisputed WWE Championship vs. Cody Rhodes at WrestleMania XXXIX.
• Best Commentator: Nigel McGuinness.

Drawing a blank on worst wrestler, worst match of the year and worst show.

Edited October 8, 2023 by The Natural

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

Couldn't answer most of those as my WWE was the lowest I've watched in years, my going to local shows has not improved, and I've been watching a lot of older stuff instead of newer promotions, Japan or Mexico as I'd hoped.

My top 10 matches for the year to date:

1) Drew vs Gunther vs Sheamus - WWE 02/04/23

2) Adam Page vs Jon Moxley - AEW 05/03/23

3) Bryan Danielson vs Ricky Starks AEW 03/09/23

4) Tetsuya Naito vs Will Ospreay NJPW 12/08/2023

5) Buddy Matthews vs Orange Cassidy AEW 12/04/23

6) Kenny Omega vs Will Ospreay NJPW 04/01/23

7) Jon Moxley vs Orange Cassidy AEW 03/09/23

Bryan Danielson/Jon Moxley vs Dante and Darius Martin AEW 06/01/23

9 ) Kenny Omega vs Will Ospreay AEW 25/06/23

10) Konosuke Takeshita vs Bryan Danielson AEW 11/01/23

There you go, Paul. 4 Danielson matches, surely you can top that?

Edited October 10, 2023 by GuerrillaMonsoon

[The Natural]

28 minutes ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said:

Couldn't answer most of those as my WWE was the lowest I've watched in years, my going to local shows has not improved, and I've been watching a lot of older stuff instead of newer promotions, Japan or Mexico as I'd hoped.

My top 10 matches for the year to date:

1) Drew vs Gunther vs Sheamus - WWE 02/04/23

2) Adam Page vs Jon Moxley - AEW 05/03/23

3) Bryan Danielson vs Ricky Starks AEW 03/09/23

4) Buddy Matthews vs Orange Cassidy AEW 12/04/23

5) Kenny Omega vs Will Ospreay NJPW 04/01/23

6) Jon Moxley vs Orange Cassidy AEW 03/09/23

7) Bryan Danielson/Jon Moxley vs Dante and Darius Martin AEW 06/01/23

8 ) Kenny Omega vs Will Ospreay AEW 25/06/23

9) Konosuke Takeshita vs Bryan Danielson AEW 11/01/23

10) Anarchy In The Arena - AEW 28/05/23

There you go, Paul. 4 Danielson matches, surely you can top that?

Thank you. Here's mine:

1. Bryan Danielson vs. Zack Sabre Jr. AEW WrestleDream, 1st October 2023.

2. Ilja Dragunov vs. Dijak. WWE NXT Battleground, 28th May 2023.

3. MJF vs. Bryan Danielson. AEW Revolution, 5th March 2023.

4. Bryan Danielson vs. Ricky Starks. AEW All Out, 3rd September 2023.

5. Gunther vs. Sheamus vs. Drew McIntyre. WWE WrestleMania XXXIX, 2nd April 2023.

6. Dax Harwood/Cash Wheeler vs. Jay White/Juice Robinson. AEW Collison, 15th July 2023.

7. Kenny Omega vs. Will Ospreay. NJPW Wrestle Kingdom 17, 4th January 2023.

8. Adam Page vs. Jon Moxley. AEW Revolution 2023, 5th March 2023.

9. Kevin Owens/Sami Zayn vs. The Usos. WWE WrestleMania XXXIX, 1st April 2023.

10. Bryan Danielson vs. Kazuchika Okada. AEW x NJPW Forbidden Door, 25th June 2023.

Interesting seeing our similarities and where we differ.

Edited October 8, 2023 by The Natural

[GuerrillaMonsoon]

Had the Mania tag probably at #11, and the Zack Sabre Jr match probably in my top 20. Will give the Dragunov match a watch.

[The Natural]

6 minutes ago, GuerrillaMonsoon said:

Had the Mania tag probably at #11, and the Zack Sabre Jr match probably in my top 20. Will give the Dragunov match a watch.

Thanks, man. I wasn't expecting Ilja Dragunov vs. Dijak at NXT Battleground, 28th May 2023 to be at the level it turned out. Watch Ilja Dragunov vs. Carmello Hayes from NXT The Great American Bash, 30th July 2023 and NXT No Mercy, 30th September 2023. Two MOTYC. Think I prefer TGAB to the rematch.

Edited October 8, 2023 by The Natural

[The Natural]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kclaL6ZzB2E

Five years ago, Shawn Michaels announces he's coming out of retirement. What we got was one of the worst matches of all time, DX vs. Brothers of Destruction at Crown Jewel 2018. With how bad it turned out, I'm surprised Shawn Michaels hasn't had another match to go out on as it can't be as bad as his last.