Brian Fowler Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 So you've literally never read a comic from the 40's through mid-80's? Never seen an episode of Batman '66? Never watched the Schumaker Batman films? Never saw the early 2000's cartoon? Never saw Batman: The Brave and the Bold? Didn't read Morrison's run? All of those have humor and fun and are of admittedly wildly varying quality. But, no, fun doesn't have to mean jokes. It's just not having this ultra grim oppressive feeling from the beginning to the end. You brought up Death in the Family. That had The Joker as an ambassador for Iran for fuck's sake. Hell, even Scott Snyder's current run uses Harper to lighten the tone. I haven't seen BvS, but by most accounts, it's nearly unrelenting darkness. Which doesn't work generally, especially for Superman. You need the light to make the dark matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Fowler, I've seen the campy iterations of Batman but they aren't what I think of when I think of Batman. What do you want me to tell you? That's not the Batman I want to see in a movie in 2016. Look at this picture from Twitter. Critics hated Batman Forever and so did the audiences. Critics hate this but the audience... so far they appear to be enjoying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 That's basically no chance in hell 120,000+ people have actually seen it though. And I'm not talking you you're wrong to like it. I'm saying your rants against people who don't are fucking insane and the claim that Batman is not a children's character defied logic reason and reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APO Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 20 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: I accept that it doesn't work for you, what about it doesn't work.. We're talking about very similar situations, The Kryptonian invasion and the chitauri invasion. Avengers were a team so you would think maybe they can keep the casualties to a minimum but hundreds of people still died in the attack. The plot to Civil War and this movie are very similar.. superheroes are dangerous, they have to be accountable, etc... But the coffee shop scene was played for laughs, was it not? I don't think it's crazy to see that. The deaths in The Avengers were mostly blown off.. Well, I'm mainly talking about the final battles in the movies. Supes is basically green-as-grass rookie up against a guy who not only a well-trained and bloodied soldier, but just as fast as and as strong as he is. Sure, it was 1-on-1, but Kal never had a chance to dictate where that fight would go. As far as the Avengers go, all of them had at least been operating for more than 2 years before they actually teamed up. Granted, that was all solo stuff and good teamwork takes a bit longer than a day to come about, but that's balanced by the fact that the Chitauri themselves were pretty much mook-level. It's two very different situations that aren't real comparable, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Austin Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 I got my tickets to see it tomorrow night. In a theater that renovated itself to have lounger chairs so I'm really excited Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 6 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said: And I'm not talking you you're wrong to like it. I'm saying your rants against people who don't are fucking insane and the claim that Batman is not a children's character defied logic reason and reality. There's more than one way to make a movie. Also, most Batman comics are not rated for all ages. They are at least teen. There's a couple books that are made for kids. Animated shows.. fine. The Nolan trilogy was not for kids. The Dark Knight Returns was not for kids. Many of the comic arcs and/or graphic novels are not for kids. Where are you getting that Batman is a kids character? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 His entire fucking history as a children's character for 76 fucking years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APO Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 25 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said: So you've literally never read a comic from the 40's through mid-80's? Never seen an episode of Batman '66? Never watched the Schumaker Batman films? Never saw the early 2000's cartoon? Never saw Batman: The Brave and the Bold? Didn't read Morrison's run? All of those have humor and fun and are of admittedly wildly varying quality. But, no, fun doesn't have to mean jokes. It's just not having this ultra grim oppressive feeling from the beginning to the end. You brought up Death in the Family. That had The Joker as an ambassador for Iran for fuck's sake. Hell, even Scott Snyder's current run uses Harper to lighten the tone. I haven't seen BvS, but by most accounts, it's nearly unrelenting darkness. Which doesn't work generally, especially for Superman. You need the light to make the dark matter. I definitely agree with this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Austin Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 sorry to hijak the conversation but someone earlier said they'd put Mask of the Phantasm up there with the best of the live action films. I'd also add Under the Red Hood for quality that stands with the best of the live action films. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Phantasm is the best theatrically released Batman film for sure. Under The Red Hood and the Miller adaptations are both really good as well for animated. Haven't gotten around to Attack on Arkham, vs. Robin or Bad Blood yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Austin Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 I'm further behind than you as I haven't seen those and the Miller films either. I have them just haven't had the....desire I guess is the word, to really watch them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff Hanger Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 In fairness, Assault on Arkham is really a Suicide Squad movie set in the Arkham game continuity. Batman's in it, but it's not *about* him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 4 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said: His entire fucking history as a children's character for 76 fucking years. Well, we got through this quicker than I thought. I knew at least you, Jingus, Burrito and Odessa would be on the same page. I have nothing else to add until I actually see the movie. At least we both like Barry Bonds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig H Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Niners constantly pointing out da numberz for this movie and others is truly amusing. Why must it be such a dick measuring contest? Why aren't people allowed to dislike these movies. I fucking loved Man of Steel and I'll probably lime this too. Above all else, your own enjoyment and what you get out of it should matter the most. What someone else says or thinks shouldn't have any affect on that. I'm honestly confounded as to why you can't let this go except that you fucking love arguing and must feel as if you've won, otherwise, why try to scoreboard Brian with fan approval numbers that aren't even legit? Let it go, bruh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
APO Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 10 minutes ago, Brian Fowler said: Phantasm is the best theatrically released Batman film for sure. Under The Red Hood and the Miller adaptations are both really good as well for animated. Haven't gotten around to Attack on Arkham, vs. Robin or Bad Blood yet. I caught Son of Batman on Netflix. It wasn't too bad, kinda just there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingus Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 9 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: Where are you getting that Batman is a kids character? Maybe it's the fact that Super Friends, Batman: The Animated Series, Superman: The Animated Series, The New Batman Adventures, Batman Beyond, Justice League, The Batman, Static Shock, Justice League Unlimited, The Batman, Young Justice, Batman: the Brave and the Bold, and Beware the Batman were all children's cartoons starring Batman as a main character over the past thirty years? Not to mention a couple dozen animated features. Plus an entire franchise of Lego movies, games, and toys devoted to him. Honestly, an entire Lego franchise. How do you get MORE "this is for kids" than that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 9 minutes ago, Craig H said: Niners constantly pointing out da numberz for this movie and others is truly amusing. Why must it be such a dick measuring contest? Why aren't people allowed to dislike these movies. I fucking loved Man of Steel and I'll probably lime this too. Above all else, your own enjoyment and what you get out of it should matter the most. What someone else says or thinks shouldn't have any affect on that. I'm honestly confounded as to why you can't let this go except that you fucking love arguing and must feel as if you've won, otherwise, why try to scoreboard Brian with fan approval numbers that aren't even legit? Let it go, bruh. Haha I wouldn't have posted that nonsense if people in here didn't post their opinions as facts or use critical reception for validation. I don't know about what I've won or lost, none of us are movie executives. It got me through work though so there's that. Time flies when you're arguing about the DCEU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 9 minutes ago, Jingus said: Maybe it's the fact that Super Friends, Batman: The Animated Series, Superman: The Animated Series, The New Batman Adventures, Batman Beyond, Justice League, The Batman, Static Shock, Justice League Unlimited, The Batman, Young Justice, Batman: the Brave and the Bold, and Beware the Batman were all children's cartoons starring Batman as a main character over the past thirty years? Not to mention a couple dozen animated features. Plus an entire franchise of Lego movies, games, and toys devoted to him. Honestly, an entire Lego franchise. How do you get MORE "this is for kids" than that? Dude.. I mentioned the animated series. Yes, all of what you said is true but it doesn't make what I said untrue. There are tons of iterations that are made for teenagers/young adults. If I had a young kid, would I have taken him to see The Dark Knight? Probably not. Would I have taken him to Batman 1989? Maybe not.. there's some scary imagery in there. That's all I'm saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Batman 89 was pg 13, but there is some weird stuff in it. The doctor scene with jack certainly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 1 minute ago, odessasteps said: Batman 89 was pg 13, but there is some weird stuff in it. The doctor scene with jack certainly. I was a little kid when I saw it and it scared the hell out of me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 Just now, Niners Fan in CT said: I was a little kid when I saw it and it scared the hell out of me. We would have all been so much better off if you had seen The Rocketeer instead. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Fowler Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 But it's not just the animated films dude. It's everything up to at least The Dark Knight Returns. Which, really, isn't even ask that kid unfriendly. After that, there were occasionally comics that tipped more adult, notably The Killing Joke, buy the mainline Batman book stayed resolutely kid friendly. The idea of Batman being written primarily for an older audience is new. Very new. The history of the character for the last 76 years is that of a "Boy's Own Adventure" children's story. And even with Nolan's trilogy and the relatively recent aging up of the books, Batman's primary target audience on a whole has included children, through those animated projects. You specially said he's not a kids character and... That's just wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxB Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 My son saw the Dark Knight when he was five. He saw Batman '89 when he was 3*. Although both of those were down to his big sisters**, not me. He's seen Deadpool on a dodgy bootleg already (I haven't seen it at all). He's 11. His Sisters think that just because they saw Predator when they were 5 and turned out OK, they can just show him anything. * He started crying when Batman stole the Joker's balloons. Because it's not nice to have your balloons stolen. A year later he was watching me play Spiderman 2 on PS2 and he'd get really upset if you failed to bring the little kid's balloons back. Once we followed the kid around the city, and his Dad just walked off and left him on his own. ** Half Sisters. Not mine. They're 8 and 10 years older than him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
odessasteps Posted March 24, 2016 Share Posted March 24, 2016 2 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said: I was a little kid when I saw it and it scared the hell out of me. We bought the video when it came out when i was a freshman and my new comics friends in my dorm and i did a total mst job on it. Dont think ive seen it since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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