AEW - DECEMBER 2023

[Elsalvajeloco]

11 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Wrestling is not an office job either. 

Damn, I could have sworn for decades people referred to individual promotions across the worlds as offices (the Dallas office, the Houston office, etc.). Shit, goddamn fairy tales.

Also, I dunno if you can use Golden State as an example FOR your argument given that it has destroyed a dynasty cause they tried to play through the nonsense. That's not the best example of everyone needs to get along.

 

[John E. Dynamite]

8 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Not every job works the same way.   Draymond Green punched Jordan Poole in the face at practice because they got into an argument.  Do you really believe Jordan Poole had any leverage in that situation where he can ask the front office to get rid of Green?  They had to patch things up for the betterment of the team for that season and move on.

How's that working out for Draymond? The Warriors? The NBA? Rudy Gobert's throat and Yusuf Nurkic's face?

[Elsalvajeloco]

Just now, John E. Dynamite said:

How's that working out for Draymond? The Warriors? The NBA? Rudy Gobert's throat and Yusuf Nurkic's face?

RUDY IS SAWFT

[Niners Fan in CT]

15 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Also, I dunno if you can use Golden State as an example FOR your argument given that it has destroyed a dynasty cause they tried to play through the nonsense. That's not the best example of everyone needs to get along.

They have other issues like Klay Thompson being wildly inconsistent.  But that was just one example.  Jordan punched Kerr in practice before the 1995-96 season and they still went on to win titles. 

Edited December 18, 2023 by Niners Fan in CT

[Elsalvajeloco]

5 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

They have other issues like Klay Thompson being wildly inconsistent.  But that was just one example.  Jordan punched Kerr in practice before the 1995-96 season and they still went on to win titles. 

CAUSE YOU'RE PLAYING WITH MICHAEL FUCKING JORDAN.

What is this nonsense?

[John from Cincinnati]

CM Punk is Michael Jordan. Many people are saying it. So true. So true. 

[Niners Fan in CT]

3 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

What is this nonsense?

Wrestling has never been like any other job and it never will be.  The Bucks didn't "have" to work with Punk, apparently they chose not to depending on what reports you believe but any wrestling promoter is still going to see if they can make it work and turn it into a TV angle.  

[Elsalvajeloco]

1 minute ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

Wrestling has never been like any other job and it never will be.  The Bucks didn't "have" to work with Punk, apparently they chose not to depending on what reports you believe but any wrestling promoter is still going to see if they can make it work and turn it into a TV angle.  

Alright there, Kevin Sullivan.

The fuck are you talking about...

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

17 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

CAUSE YOU'RE PLAYING WITH MICHAEL FUCKING JORDAN.

What is this nonsense?

YEAH WELL SCOTT SKILES SQUARED UP TO SHAQ ONCE

[Elsalvajeloco]

Jerry Reinsdorf had a real decision to make just like Tony Khan. Who do I keep?Mike Jordan from UNC or reliable sharpshooter Steve Kerr.

It was like Sophie's Choice but you know with basketball and less Meryl Streep doing a Polish accent...And less Nazis. That too.

[Niners Fan in CT]

9 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

Alright there, Kevin Sullivan.

The fuck are you talking about...

"Jerry Jarrett was always great at turning real-life issues into money-drawing pro wrestling, from bringing in Angelo Poffo and his sons, Randy Savage and Lanny, after they ran an ugly promotional war with CWA to feuding Bill Dundee and Wolfie D after Dundee pulled a knife on Wolfie backstage. If someone was running a promotion where there was, say, a publicized backstage fistfight between their biggest stars, they might want to think about how Jarrett would have handled it. I guarantee he would have packed the house."   - Phil Schneider

Three Great Memphis Wrestling Angles - The Ringer

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

Just now, Elsalvajeloco said:

Jerry Reinsdorf had a real decision to make just like Tony Khan. Who do I keep Mike Jordan from UNC or reliable sharpshooter Steve Kerr?

It was like Sophie's Choice but you know with basketball and less Meryl Streep doing a Polish accent...And less Nazis. That too.

The part of Will Perdue in the film will now be played by Meryl Streep. You're welcome.

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

It occurs to me that my brain mixed up Will Perdue and Luc Longley, but I'm not gonna edit that post, nope.

[Elsalvajeloco]

This took a SHARP left turn at the basketball talk, and I don't think we can ever return from it.

Sorry, Niners. I think you broke my brain and even A_K and dude who confused someone here with someone who stole money from his "friend" couldn't do that w/ the same type of hot garbage. You won. Your jiu jitsu is too strong. I tap out. I don't know the meaning of the word quit but I do know the meaning of uncle.

3 minutes ago, Sparkleface said:

It occurs to me that my brain mixed up Will Perdue and Luc Longley, but I'm not gonna edit that post, nope.

WHO WILL GAIN THE PARENTAL RIGHTS FOR CROATIAN SENSATION TONI KUKOC? 

[Technico Support]

26 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:any wrestling promoter is still going to see if they can make it work and turn it into a TV angle.  

 

12 minutes ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

"Jerry Jarrett was always great at turning real-life issues into money-drawing pro wrestling, from bringing in Angelo Poffo and his sons, Randy Savage and Lanny, after they ran an ugly promotional war with CWA to feuding Bill Dundee and Wolfie D after Dundee pulled a knife on Wolfie backstage. If someone was running a promotion where there was, say, a publicized backstage fistfight between their biggest stars, they might want to think about how Jarrett would have handled it. I guarantee he would have packed the house."   - Phil Schneider

Three Great Memphis Wrestling Angles - The Ringer

For the third time…maybe we should stop looking so fondly at what a gross pile of shit this business used to be.

[Stefanie Sparkleface]

6 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

WHO WILL GAIN THE PARENTAL RIGHTS FOR CROATIAN SENSATION TONI KUKOC? 

Well Phil Jackson was obviously in the running, but Scottie Pippen sure isn't.

[Elsalvajeloco]

And oh, regarding Memphis:

Read all the 1988-1992 Observers regarding the Dallas/Memphis offices (damn there goes that word again) for USWA and how each end of the promotion ran off the very few fans they had trying to do "shoot" angles based off real things. You want to talk about sad? There is a reason Killer Tim Brooks was outselling them doing shows in a bar while what was left of World Class was struggling to sell 150 tickets at the Sportatorium with the surviving Von Erich brothers on top.

[Niners Fan in CT]

5 minutes ago, Technico Support said:

For the third time…maybe we should stop looking so fondly at what a gross pile of shit this business used to be.

I said I agreed with you in part but I also agree with our very own Phil, not Brooks.  If there's a chance that they will do business, go for it. 

[Raziel]

Wait, you mean to tell me that program in PPW between Doug Gilbert and Brian Christopher didn't draw a million bucks when Gilbert started shooting on Lawler's "legal issues"???

[NoFistsJustFlips]

1 hour ago, StretchMediatedHypertrophy said:

And now we're talking about internet fans from the early 2000s as somehow representative of the casual fan.

Anddd I'm out. The goal posts keep moving. My overarching point has been the same from the beginning. There's too many titles & they (AEW, since when I use a they you seem to think it's a nebulous group and not a defined subject I'm referencing) haven't defined what one is more important than any others. I haven't wavered from that. Even adding supporting arguments from another instance in history when fans complained about too many belts. But you'll hand waive away anything that doesn't fit your side with a witty and eloquent variation of nuhh uhh.
 

1 hour ago, StretchMediatedHypertrophy said:

This is a ludicrous argument. The truth is that there is no strict hierarchy, you have a subjective opinion about it. That's it.

Ludicrous argument? WWE absolutely has a strict hierarchy. They use it in their story telling allllll the time. Reigns title is 1A. WCH is 1B. IC is 2A. US is 2B. They (WWE, since again you will point this as a nebulous they instead of the obvious subject) have used the IC Title's importance in so many stories over the years this isn't up for subjective think pieces. It's what they (WWE) have presented on screen, in canon. Hence why multiple times Honky's reign length has been used in stories (Gunther & Santino specifically) and whoever has the US Title reign length hasn't been used.

So with that I'm resting my case in this conversation. Feel free to hand waive the whole post away. You've done so well doing that up until this point lol.

[Technico Support]

18 minutes ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

And oh, regarding Memphis:

Read all the 1988-1992 Observers regarding the Dallas/Memphis offices (damn there goes that word again) for USWA and how each end of the promotion ran off the very few fans they had trying to do "shoot" angles based off real things. You want to talk about sad? There is a reason Killer Tim Brooks was outselling them doing shows in a bar while what was left of World Class was struggling to sell 150 tickets at the Sportatorium with the surviving Von Erich brothers on top.

Meanwhile, fans in 2023 are still acting like Khan sinned against Fritz Von Erich, patron saint of carny scumbags, for not turning a real-life assault and battery situation into an angle.  Guys, when you're on the side of Bubba Ray and Vince Russo (THINK OF THE HEAT BRO!), please rethink your shit.

[NoFistsJustFlips]

17 minutes ago, Technico Support said:

 

For the third time…maybe we should stop looking so fondly at what a gross pile of shit this business used to be.

This is a business based on pretending you hate someone and fake fighting them. Guess what, there's gonna be dudes you really hate mixed in there too. Your job is still to fake fight them. It's not mature and conducive to success to say I will only fake fight the people I like. Jericho got into a fist fight with Lesnar in 2014. They still worked a match after. It's not the end of the world or some pile of gross shit that they we mature enough to say we don't like each other but let's not let that interfere with what our job is supposed to be.

You can chalk it up to people romanticizing what the business used to be, but that's disingenuous. You can like the positive progression the business has made and still think The Bucks not being willing to do their job with a co-worker is them being immature. That doesn't mean you're advocating for bar fights and workers beating the shit out of fans because they're heels. Or fans stabbing the bad guys. It's not as black & white as you're making it out to be.

[Elsalvajeloco]

1 minute ago, Niners Fan in CT said:

If there's a chance that they will do business, go for it. 

Or no, you can not do that and let everyone get on with their lives especially knowing that one guy has a history of not wanting to do business and being extremely fickle. I don't have an issue with CM Punk and I was once open to the idea of Punk working with The Elite even before it blew up, but I also realize not everything is worth saving. You don't fucking try to make your divorced parents sit together at Thanksgiving cause it just feels right. Moreover, once it gets to legal ramifications, all bets are off. Just like Draymond being a goddamn loose cannon, you could have stopped this before it became an issue instead of worrying about winning championships you weren't going to win. On top of that every booker has a unique set of circumstances to deal with. Jerry Jarrett ran his office one way. Bill Watts did his one way. Ron Fuller another way. However, they were also under the impression that you can cut bait when you to. Hence, it being a territory. Your argument falls apart (in every phase but let's just go with this one) in that if you became a real problem much like Punk, they got you the fuck up out of there REGARDLESS if you made money. Add in the fact, there is no hard deadline to do something with each other in the first goddamn place. Tony didn't know Punk would be stupid enough to do something AGAIN to get himself fired. You're also missing the context of Randy Savage NEEDING CWA cause ICW wasn't a real promotion anyway, and Dundee being a mainstay who did go to Mid South (mainly to book) and maybe one other territory but Jarrett's promotion being HIS home promotion. Those two had no other choice. Also, the territory had Jerry fucking Lawler who was drawing with the villain of the week. Also, they never really made reference to Dundee being attacked cause that would have made Bill look weak. So what really did they make money off of? So none of those variables are at play here. It's not as simple as everyone get along. Everyone doesn't want to get along. 

[StretchMediatedHypertrophy]

@NoFistsJustFlips

You have made the same overarching point, but without really offering any kind of evidential base at any stage. You stated that they clearly introduced the US Title as below the IC Title, but I've literally YouTubed Stephanie McMahon introduce the Title on Smackdown and it didn't happen. I doubt, given the brand vs brand storyline at the time, Michael Cole really gave some soliloquy about how the US Title was lesser than the IC Title - but you have said som kind of explanation happened but instead of demonstrating that you've instead moved on to the Honky Tonk Man (whose reign, along with Santino's 2nd IC run & the Honkameter, maybe isn't exactly the strong argument in your favour you seem to think it is, but that's subjectivity for you I guess). Who is really moving the goalposts here?  Critiquing your arguments is not hand-waving them, pretty much the opposite infact. The truth is the longest US Title run is almost 550 days, and maybe Lex Luger will eventually get referenced. It's a higher threshold.

Look I know you're not exactly new around here, but there are levels to that, and levels above me of course, but traditionally DVDVR hasn't been a place where we take the opinions of RSPWFAQ neckbeards particularly seriously - infact if anything we have looked for reasons to believe the opposite. It was you who said 'ppl on the internet said there were too any belts during the Invasion era', and effectively linked that to what most people watching wrestling on TV think today. That was a poor rhetorical move (and one that aligns very well with my point about a certain type of wrestling fan craving a certain sense of structure), though again one without a real evidential base (like you remember some people saying particular stuff on the internet, stuff you agree with, when in reality lots of people are saying lots of different things on the internet and you're in no position to really draw any firm unbiased analytical conclusions). Truthfully, what I am seeing here is an inability to actually self-examine with regards to why you think the things you do, and how you filter information in support of that. If you can't see that, well that's a pity but I suspect others can.

Edited December 18, 2023 by StretchMediatedHypertrophy

[odessasteps]

1 hour ago, Elsalvajeloco said:

 

WHO WILL GAIN THE PARENTAL RIGHTS FOR CROATIAN SENSATION TONI KUKOC? 

Not Vlade Divac.