JohnnyJ Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Wow. I really don't think Ziggler is that bad. He's just one of handful of wrestlers who have been on tv non-stop for 5+ years. He's cemented in the midcard and midcarders in WWE rarely get angles/storylines. Since the WWE style relies so heavily on signature spots, it feels like I've seen 250 Ziggler matches with minimal significance and variation. I would feel the same way about just about any midcarder on the roster. The one time they threw Ziggler a bone at Survivor Series it got over huge and worked. Compare him to Zayn where almost every single match and segment matters. Even a throwaway match against Adam Rose still feels like it part of Zayns journey back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromatagon Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Most average midcarders don't drag a future main eventer opponent down so far that their career is basically fucked beyond repair at this point 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRGoldman Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Wow. I really don't think Ziggler is that bad. He's just one of handful of wrestlers who have been on tv non-stop for 5+ years. He's cemented in the midcard and midcarders in WWE rarely get angles/storylines. Since the WWE style relies so heavily on signature spots, it feels like I've seen 250 Ziggler matches with minimal significance and variation. I would feel the same way about just about any midcarder on the roster. The one time they threw Ziggler a bone at Survivor Series it got over huge and worked. Compare him to Zayn where almost every single match and segment matters. Even a throwaway match against Adam Rose still feels like it part of Zayns journey back. The problem isn't that Ziggler hasn't had storylines or angles, it's that he has had those things, and every single one he has managed to make other people less over after their finished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuubi Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 I feel like the Ziggler hate is from the "Rusev had potential and Ziggler/WWE fucked up but we can't exactly blame WWE because we aren't annoying indy smarks so fuck Ziggler" crowd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromatagon Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 To be honest, fuck them both Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyJ Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Wow. I really don't think Ziggler is that bad. He's just one of handful of wrestlers who have been on tv non-stop for 5+ years. He's cemented in the midcard and midcarders in WWE rarely get angles/storylines. Since the WWE style relies so heavily on signature spots, it feels like I've seen 250 Ziggler matches with minimal significance and variation. I would feel the same way about just about any midcarder on the roster. The one time they threw Ziggler a bone at Survivor Series it got over huge and worked. Compare him to Zayn where almost every single match and segment matters. Even a throwaway match against Adam Rose still feels like it part of Zayns journey back. The problem isn't that Ziggler hasn't had storylines or angles, it's that he has had those things, and every single one he has managed to make other people less over after their finished. There is no one of Zigglers position taking the number of falls he does. He jobbed to Heath Slater a few weeks back. He just jobbed to the Miz on Monday. And this isn't a recent phenomenon. He's been a glorified jobber for most of his career. Ziggler might as well have loser tattooed on his forehead. You can't just take those types of losses and then move on to a feud with a Owens or a Rusev and not damage the person you're feuding with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyuubi Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 To be honest, fuck them both You would be honest. It is more from the fanbase who tries to cling to anything with hope in today's WWE only for WWE to ruin said hope by means of a superstar and said masochistic fans turn superstar into a patsy of hate and loathing. These fans praise the WWE when they produce anything with a modicum of success or quality i.e. last year's Wrestlemania as if it erased the myriad of bullshit that has been going on for nearly a decade. So they blame individuals who, yeah have had some bad matches and sunk to the lowest of lows, for pulling down stars or their favorites as if the company is not being ran by a bunch of angry lower mid carders who are envious of top stars that they never became and a senile old man who is obsessed with telling the millennials who are also his main consuming audience to fuck off. First it was Sheamus and now it is Ziggler. Personally I thank Vince's incompetence for WWE's fuck ups because it made me more susceptible to other wrestling shows and styles like Lucha Underground and NJPW and Joshi. But there is a lot of animosity in this thread towards Ziggler as if he is the one that derailed Rusev and possibly derailed Kevin Owens as if the dude has not been fucked over by the same company who seems obsessed with humbling employees...umm excuse me....I mean "private contractors." Personally, I feel for Ziggler's lack of passion because I kind of get it. He is not being promised anything. His only claim to being the highlight was Survivor Series and fucking Amy Smhucher and his apparent love triangle to nowhere with Nikki Bella and John Cena. The man has nothing in roster to value because he knows what his role is. He has seen his glass ceiling and tried to break it only for him to be yanked down and condescendingly be pat on the head and told, "Oh you silly boy your name is Dolph Ziggler." hOnestly, his best hope is to turn into a Tyler Durden-esque character have a mid-life-career crisis and just go bat shit insane. But we all know that he lacks the mic ability and talent to do so. But what do I know? I am just a stupid kid who liked watching Rey Mysterio in 2002. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Niners Fan in CT Posted March 2, 2016 Share Posted March 2, 2016 Zigger had a replacement wrestler value of under 0 meaning you could have replaced him with any average wrestler and they would have performed better. That reminds me, who did we equate WAR to in wrestling and should it now be WAZ (Worth Above Ziggler)? Sounds good to me. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLaw Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 Most average midcarders don't drag a future main eventer opponent down so far that their career is basically fucked beyond repair at this point I know you meant Rusev, but lol, I'll pretend you said Breeze. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirSmUgly Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 Honestly, I forgot that Rusev/Ziggler shit even happened until it was brought up again, but if you look at that angle, Rusev and Summer Rae were actually making chicken salad out of chicken shit and Ziggler was fucking embarrassing (and so was Lana, for that matter). Ziggler has had his moments (cash in on ADR, ladder match against Luke Harper, Survivor Series 2014), so clearly he connects with people, but I've never been a big Ziggler fan myself, and I find him unwatchable at this point. He does one thing well: bumps. I'm pretty sure a big part of the reason that he's over is because he's cosplaying HBK. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tromatagon Posted March 3, 2016 Share Posted March 3, 2016 He's cosplaying Stuart from Beavis and Butthead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPPA Posted March 3, 2016 Author Share Posted March 3, 2016 Zayn - 133 Ziggler - 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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