DC Comics omnibus thread

[Eivion]

It damn well better be.

[odessasteps]

have they brought his daughter back yet

[Bustronaut]

yes

[The Unholy Dragon]

I don't get that feeling at all from this reboot.  I'm all for DC being open to new ideas and greenlighting books for characters who wouldn't get a book were this Marvel or DC in a different time, but greenlighting books for characters like Prez AND putting relative unknowns on them seems to be a terrible idea.  I'd probably be more interested in Prez, Omega Men, Midnighter, etc. if I knew more about the writers and artists (at least Prez is just a min-series).  Most of the talent lineup are names I haven't heard, or barely know of.

 

I'm all for new talent and culling people from the indys is a fine idea, but I admittedly don't read a lot of indys any more and I'm guessing most of these new names won't have the mainstream success of someone like Jeff Lemire.  That was more or less a stroke of luck which I bet can't be duplicated once DC starts trying to duplicate it.  I know there are still a lot of writers around that I'd enjoy - because most of them either work for Marvel now or have worked at DC recently - but, as it stands, there's a lot of question marks for me in those solicits and I'm not sure how much money I'm willing to spend to see if I like a writer or not.  Really, I'm wondering what happened to all the "names" DC has used in the past couple years. 

 

This is a weirdly insular view all said. You don't think indie stars are likely to make it big, but you don't read indies. 

Really, it's a combo of things here. DC's approach of "MAKE EVERYTHING APPEAL TO OUR HARDCORES" blew up in their faces due to a combination of not getting what their hardcore audience wanted and the fact that most people can't afford to buy an entire line so it'd be a game of diminishing returns. Meanwhile Marvel has diversified its lineup, turning a lot of indie creators into megastars and having risky books pay off huge. Such as the new Ms. Marvel which is apparently one of their top sellers when all platforms are considered. That's a book about a legacy character for a legacy that historically doesn't sell well, with a Muslim girl as the lead, written by a creator whose biggest work to that point was Air (which was amazing but sold terribly). But it was marketed well, hooked a different audience than the cores, and has not only become a sales hit but acted as a gateway drug to comics/Marvel for new readers. DC wanted some of that and are duplicating the approach.

There's also the fact that Image has finally become a viable alternative for people that aren't Robert Kirkman. Creator Owned is selling, building stars up before they get Marvel/DC work. But it also means that a lot of the big name creators are taking extended breaks from superhero stuff to focus on doing creator owned work because it can be as profitable in the short term, and due to an ownership stake, MORE profitable in the long term while often being more creatively satisfying. Hence a lot of the bigger names of the past 10-20 years more or less 'retiring' from superhero comics.

It's not that different from wrestling logic. If you don't start building up the new stars, you have nothing when the old guard leaves you.

 

Oh and the first two issues of Secret Six were pretty cool, pissed that I have to wait until June for #3. 

 

It's been solid. Gail is often hit or miss with her openings. I find her books tend to sneak up on me after 4-8 issues.

 

Also, fuck Ken Lashley. Putting aside that he's kinda Bill DeMott-esque in his studio, dude is not SO GOOD that I'm willing to wait like six months an issue for his shit.

 

 

I'm very disappointed at all the backlash & subsequent cancelling of Rafael Albuquerque's Joker variant Batgirl cover. I'm a HUGE fan of his work & I really do not think he had any malice in his heart when he designed this cover. What is wrong with people?

 

http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/dc-comics-cancels-batgirl-joker-variant-at-artists-request

 

It doesn't fit the book. You wouldn't put the cover of a Harlequin on Hunger Games. Comics needs to start actually targeting their marketing instead of running on inertia or else they'll lose the new audiences they're cultivating.

 

And clearly Rafael Abuquerque gets this which is why he asked them to pull it.

Honestly, I think it's a great cover. It's got really strong horror elements and the fact that we know Batgirl isn't a civilian makes her terror that much more intimidating. It's a good piece of work and if this were, for example, a cover during Death of the Family? I wouldn't see the problem. It would have fit the tone of the book at that time as well as the content of the issue. The problem is that the book is being targeted at teen girls and queer audiences, groups that often experience heavy amounts of violence, threats of violence, and sexual assault. So yeah, it was offensive to the actual target audience of the book. Which is why they pulled it. And rightfully so.

[The Unholy Dragon]

Well, there it is.

(Batman Eternal spoilers)

Cluemaster WAS the big mastermind, albeit with the assistance of Earth-0 Owlman/Talon.

A little disappointed they seem to have killed Cluemaster. This was very much a breakout book and could have led to more down the line. Alas.

Finale next week should be bananas.

[Eivion]

Well, there it is.

(Batman Eternal spoilers)

Cluemaster WAS the big mastermind, albeit with the assistance of Earth-0 Owlman/Talon.

A little disappointed they seem to have killed Cluemaster. This was very much a breakout book and could have led to more down the line. Alas.

Finale next week should be bananas.

I'm disappointed they killed him but more for whatever could have been further built with Stephanie down the line. He really doesn't work as a big name villain considering he is far too similar to Riddler. I did like the motivation behind him and his crew, but honestly I would have been pretty disappointed if he had straight up been the Big Bad, especially considering that a good deal of this got way too personal for a guy who didn't actually know Batman's identity until this issue. If I'm being honest it really feels like he was thrown in at as last minute as a red herring because so many people already figured out this would March would be the Big Bad.

[The Unholy Dragon]

Well, there it is.

(Batman Eternal spoilers)

Cluemaster WAS the big mastermind, albeit with the assistance of Earth-0 Owlman/Talon.

A little disappointed they seem to have killed Cluemaster. This was very much a breakout book and could have led to more down the line. Alas.

Finale next week should be bananas.

I'm disappointed they killed him but more for whatever could have been further built with Stephanie down the line. He really doesn't work as a big name villain considering he is far too similar to Riddler. I did like the motivation behind him and his crew, but honestly I would have been pretty disappointed if he had straight up been the Big Bad, especially considering that a good deal of this got way too personal for a guy who didn't actually know Batman's identity until this issue. If I'm being honest it really feels like he was thrown in at as last minute as a red herring because so many people already figured out this would March would be the Big Bad.

See but I love that the notion was to fake a big organized play, get everybody going nuts while Batman struggles to see a pattern that doesn't exist. It's such a different approach and it worked for me to justify Cluemaster being the architect of the whole deal since really there wasn't much to build.

[SolidGoldBomb]

Convergence #0

[Eivion]

Thought Batman Eternal had a nice ending with some decent set-ups for a few people post Convergence. Only ting I didn't like was the complete breaking of Selina and Bruce's relationship, but that is probably more the shipper in me.

[APO]

Convergence #0

So, how bad was it?

[SolidGoldBomb]

 

Convergence #0

So, how bad was it?

 

Seemed like a mess to me, and nothing really made sense.  I'm sure it will be more fun when we get to the mindless fight scenes, but the setup left a lot to be desired.

[twiztor]

so i'm just under halfway through Batman Eternal (wanted to read it as one big chunk as opposed to weekly) and i fricking love this series. there's so many moving parts, so many subplots and characters, and i really, really enjoy it.  i'm doing my best to avoid spoilers, and that has paid dividends so far. 

when i finish this up in a week or so, i'll probably jump into Endgame before moving on to Convergence.

 

and then swing back to my regularly scheduled 2003 Bat-books reading.

[Eivion]

I think the last issue or two of Endgame has been delayed so you might want to go ahead and check out Convergence if you're interested in it.

 

 

 

 

Convergence #0

So, how bad was it?

 

Seemed like a mess to me, and nothing really made sense.  I'm sure it will be more fun when we get top the mindless fight scenes, but the setup left a lot to be desired.

 

It felt like you jumped into the middle of a storyline despite being a setup. I thought it was actually interesting, just confusing for a while.

[odessasteps]

The DC thread seems a good place for this

@LenWein: Back from WonderCon. Less than two months after surviving quintuple-bypass surgery. Unbelievable.Saw many friends. Had a great time. Thanks.

[SolidGoldBomb]

I think the last issue or two of Endgame has been delayed so you might want to go ahead and check out Convergence if you're interested in it.

 

 

 

 

Convergence #0

So, how bad was it?

 

Seemed like a mess to me, and nothing really made sense.  I'm sure it will be more fun when we get top the mindless fight scenes, but the setup left a lot to be desired.

 

It felt like you jumped into the middle of a storyline despite being a setup. I thought it was actually interesting, just confusing for a while.

Yeah I felt that way too, it was like starting in the middle of Superman's dream or something.  And they referenced the Doomed storyline a few times, so without reading that I felt lost.  I'll probably still check the event out though.

[Eivion]

I was in the same boat. I haven't read the Doomed storyline either. I don't have too much interest in Convergence though the potential for something solid seems to be there. I only read the zero issue because my brother picked it up. If he continues to do so I will read it, but otherwise I'm just checking out the Question two-parter by Rucka.

[twiztor]

I think the last issue or two of Endgame has been delayed so you might want to go ahead and check out Convergence if you're interested in it.

 

i thought the last issue was pushed back to 4/29. that's totally waitable. if there's more after that one, then you may be right.

 

addendum:

i just read the Arkham Manor series. when it was first announced i thought it sounded like a stupid premise and there's no way it would work. then i found out that it tied into Batman Eternal (which i love) so i decided to give it a shot.

then i read it. found out it doesn't really tie into Eternal at all (besides the setup). Plus, the writing is bad and the characterizations are all over the place. so, so bad. 

[The Unholy Dragon]

I think the last issue or two of Endgame has been delayed so you might want to go ahead and check out Convergence if you're interested in it.

i thought the last issue was pushed back to 4/29. that's totally waitable. if there's more after that one, then you may be right.

addendum:

i just read the Arkham Manor series. when it was first announced i thought it sounded like a stupid premise and there's no way it would work. then i found out that it tied into Batman Eternal (which i love) so i decided to give it a shot.

then i read it. found out it doesn't really tie into Eternal at all (besides the setup). Plus, the writing is bad and the characterizations are all over the place. so, so bad.

I enjoyed Arkham Manor. That take on Mr. Freeze especially. Wasn't great but I enjoyed it the whole way through.

[Cliff Hanger]

Convergence needed a little bit more editorial oversight or a quick explanation that not everyone in the Pre-Flashpoint Gotham dome is from the exact same moment, because the status quo of the Flashes is pretty incompatible with everyone else.

[The Unholy Dragon]

So I'm all for loose continuity, but almost five months later I still can't figure out when the hell Robin Rises is supposed to have happened relative to everything else in the Bat-books/JLA/Earth 2 shenanigans.

[Matt D]

Binged Eternal. First DC I've read since definitely the Zero Month and really, a few months into the new 52.

 

Thoughts

-First and foremost, it was hugely ambitious. There's a sort of Batman story, the gauntlet story, where he goes through almost every major character in his mythos. Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, etc. And this was way longer than any of them and probably a good deal better too. That said, there were a lot of moving pieces and they didn't always fit together perfectly. I think some elements (Steph's mom, for instance) didn't get enough play and others (Catwoman during act 2) dropped off for too long when they should have been seen, even in one panel reaction shots or something. Another example is Gordon. Once they got the evidence to clear Gordon, it was a little offputting that they didn't find a way to use it, even after Bard refused to.

-They introduced 3 major new additions to the Batfamily and they were all female. On paper, that's great. In practice, it crashed into each other a little too much. I don't get how Spoiler was so good at what she did, for instance (even if what she did was just stay alive with a few lucky breaks). 

-Catwoman sort of following in the Black Cat's footsteps (though in a way that was far better done) was weird too. Just bad timing there. 

-There were some bits that were cleared up elsewhere? Like Poison Ivy never got caught with her upgrades.

-Joker's Daughter's really useless isn't she? I don't get the appeal at all. Harley's full of charm so it's impossible not to compare.

-Ok, so the biggest strength (past the pacing and structuring) was also the biggest weakness, the reveal of Cluemaster. This was the one element I was spoiled on coming in so I was looking for clues, and despite all the RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE! babblings, they just weren't there. And I like that to some degree, since the whole "the plan wasn't a plan so he couldn't figure it out." bit was great, but they really sent mixed messages, like with the Riddler stuff. Riddler's big clue that if they cracked his message then they should have figured it all out or whatever, when it was a situation where cleverness actually worked against Batman. In some ways, they buried him a bit to make Spoiler look good at the end, and I'm all for that but it's also sort of weird for a story of this size and scope. Also sort of funny since it parallels the last time I can remember where batman's infallability worked against him, back during the story where Spoiler (as Robin) accidentally started a gang war due to Batman's secret plans.

-They sure destroyed a lot of stuff. And that's okay but I am more impressed with a great comics story that can maintain more of the status quo than one that literally blows so much of it up. I would have liked to see a bit more of the "all of Gotham is batman!" thing, especially considering the mid-story bits where people were talking about moving away due to all the problems, but again that was there to set up Spoiler's moment more than as a message in and of itself. 

[The Unholy Dragon]

Binged Eternal. First DC I've read since definitely the Zero Month and really, a few months into the new 52.

Thoughts

-First and foremost, it was hugely ambitious. There's a sort of Batman story, the gauntlet story, where he goes through almost every major character in his mythos. Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, etc. And this was way longer than any of them and probably a good deal better too. That said, there were a lot of moving pieces and they didn't always fit together perfectly. I think some elements (Steph's mom, for instance) didn't get enough play and others (Catwoman during act 2) dropped off for too long when they should have been seen, even in one panel reaction shots or something. Another example is Gordon. Once they got the evidence to clear Gordon, it was a little offputting that they didn't find a way to use it, even after Bard refused to.

-They introduced 3 major new additions to the Batfamily and they were all female. On paper, that's great. In practice, it crashed into each other a little too much. I don't get how Spoiler was so good at what she did, for instance (even if what she did was just stay alive with a few lucky breaks).

-Catwoman sort of following in the Black Cat's footsteps (though in a way that was far better done) was weird too. Just bad timing there.

-There were some bits that were cleared up elsewhere? Like Poison Ivy never got caught with her upgrades.

-Joker's Daughter's really useless isn't she? I don't get the appeal at all. Harley's full of charm so it's impossible not to compare.

-Ok, so the biggest strength (past the pacing and structuring) was also the biggest weakness, the reveal of Cluemaster. This was the one element I was spoiled on coming in so I was looking for clues, and despite all the RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE! babblings, they just weren't there. And I like that to some degree, since the whole "the plan wasn't a plan so he couldn't figure it out." bit was great, but they really sent mixed messages, like with the Riddler stuff. Riddler's big clue that if they cracked his message then they should have figured it all out or whatever, when it was a situation where cleverness actually worked against Batman. In some ways, they buried him a bit to make Spoiler look good at the end, and I'm all for that but it's also sort of weird for a story of this size and scope. Also sort of funny since it parallels the last time I can remember where batman's infallability worked against him, back during the story where Spoiler (as Robin) accidentally started a gang war due to Batman's secret plans.

-They sure destroyed a lot of stuff. And that's okay but I am more impressed with a great comics story that can maintain more of the status quo than one that literally blows so much of it up. I would have liked to see a bit more of the "all of Gotham is batman!" thing, especially considering the mid-story bits where people were talking about moving away due to all the problems, but again that was there to set up Spoiler's moment more than as a message in and of itself.

I think Riddler genuinely thought it was Ra's. Given that he thinks in a similar manner to Batman it would stand to reason he'd be equally fooled.

There's definitely some logic gaps. Steph learned nothing of value really so it was weird for her dad to be trying to kill her over it. Even in Bruce's weakened state, him being taken down by Cluemaster was a bit much. Also killing Cluemaster was pointless, as was having the Court throw Thomas Jr. (Who presumably helped Hush in the Batcave? Don't know if that was ever confirmed) in the box. If anything the ending kinda puts some of the more interesting toys it created away. And a lot of the fine details were left ambiguous which is fine but kinda frustrating in this type of story.

Very much a 'good with great moments' deal more than a great story. But that's true of most Batman epics so it's okay.

[Eivion]

 

Binged Eternal. First DC I've read since definitely the Zero Month and really, a few months into the new 52.

Thoughts

-First and foremost, it was hugely ambitious. There's a sort of Batman story, the gauntlet story, where he goes through almost every major character in his mythos. Knightfall, Long Halloween, Hush, etc. And this was way longer than any of them and probably a good deal better too. That said, there were a lot of moving pieces and they didn't always fit together perfectly. I think some elements (Steph's mom, for instance) didn't get enough play and others (Catwoman during act 2) dropped off for too long when they should have been seen, even in one panel reaction shots or something. Another example is Gordon. Once they got the evidence to clear Gordon, it was a little offputting that they didn't find a way to use it, even after Bard refused to.

-They introduced 3 major new additions to the Batfamily and they were all female. On paper, that's great. In practice, it crashed into each other a little too much. I don't get how Spoiler was so good at what she did, for instance (even if what she did was just stay alive with a few lucky breaks).

-Catwoman sort of following in the Black Cat's footsteps (though in a way that was far better done) was weird too. Just bad timing there.

-There were some bits that were cleared up elsewhere? Like Poison Ivy never got caught with her upgrades.

-Joker's Daughter's really useless isn't she? I don't get the appeal at all. Harley's full of charm so it's impossible not to compare.

-Ok, so the biggest strength (past the pacing and structuring) was also the biggest weakness, the reveal of Cluemaster. This was the one element I was spoiled on coming in so I was looking for clues, and despite all the RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOUR FACE! babblings, they just weren't there. And I like that to some degree, since the whole "the plan wasn't a plan so he couldn't figure it out." bit was great, but they really sent mixed messages, like with the Riddler stuff. Riddler's big clue that if they cracked his message then they should have figured it all out or whatever, when it was a situation where cleverness actually worked against Batman. In some ways, they buried him a bit to make Spoiler look good at the end, and I'm all for that but it's also sort of weird for a story of this size and scope. Also sort of funny since it parallels the last time I can remember where batman's infallability worked against him, back during the story where Spoiler (as Robin) accidentally started a gang war due to Batman's secret plans.

-They sure destroyed a lot of stuff. And that's okay but I am more impressed with a great comics story that can maintain more of the status quo than one that literally blows so much of it up. I would have liked to see a bit more of the "all of Gotham is batman!" thing, especially considering the mid-story bits where people were talking about moving away due to all the problems, but again that was there to set up Spoiler's moment more than as a message in and of itself.

I think Riddler genuinely thought it was Ra's. Given that he thinks in a similar manner to Batman it would stand to reason he'd be equally fooled.

There's definitely some logic gaps. Steph learned nothing of value really so it was weird for her dad to be trying to kill her over it. Even in Bruce's weakened state, him being taken down by Cluemaster was a bit much. Also killing Cluemaster was pointless, as was having the Court throw Thomas Jr. (Who presumably helped Hush in the Batcave? Don't know if that was ever confirmed) in the box. If anything the ending kinda puts some of the more interesting toys it created away. And a lot of the fine details were left ambiguous which is fine but kinda frustrating in this type of story.

Very much a 'good with great moments' deal more than a great story. But that's true of most Batman epics so it's okay.

 

I have to disagree about the Riddler thinking it was Ra's. He seemed legit disappointed that Batman couldn't figure out. I kind of figured it was because it was so simple and the culprit was beneath them in Riddler's eyes.

 

Also Steph learning that her father was involved to any extent was a danger to him as the entire point was for the Cluemaster and his crew to remain invisible until the big climax.

 

I didn't like Cluemaster dying, but I had no problem with Lincoln going into the box. It gives back some power to the Court, and there isn't much to do with him now.

[Matt D]

Did I mention that we really needed to see more of the set up for Arkham being haunted? Because we did. That felt like a logic gap because it was introducing a relatively "non-Batman" element into the mix so they had to spend even more time setting that up better, in my mind.

[Brysynner]

So I'm getting back into comics and have read through most of the Sinestro series....it's pretty decent. It has me engaged and waiting to see how Sinestro fucks everything up with the remaining members of his home planet....again