Gordi the former AEW fan
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Posts posted by Gordi the former AEW fan
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It sure has been one hell of a year for great matches! I think my top 3 are Kenny vs Ospreay 1 @ WK, Bryan vs ZSJ @ WD, Bryan vs Okada @ FD; and Kento vs Nakajimmy 1 is probably up there too (it was NASTY) but there's a massive logjam after my obvious (to me) top 3. Male Wrestlers of the Year are probably Eddie Kingston, Bryan, Ospreay, Orange, and Speedball. Best match I saw live was probably Ospreay vs Shota. Best time I had was karaoke at Bodybar and hanging out with friends at Ranmaru Fest and the Osaka Castle Park O-Pro free show, and partying with Cooger and our many drinking buddies. I have a great bunch of wrestling pals I chat online with during Dynamite and big AEW or NJPW shows and they know how much I appreciate them. I also wanted to express my appreciation for everyone who has contributed to the discussion, on this thread in particular. Andy from Kansas and Matt from Segunda gave me a genuine bit of insight into my own character on this thread recently. Pro Wrestling is almost entirely a communal thing for me. Going to pandemic shows here in Japan was deeply unsatisfying for me, for example. Not just because it was weird to be quiet while Abdullah Kobayashi got thrown from a ladder onto thumbtacks, but mainly because we couldn't chat and share drinks and snacks... Even watching alone on my tablet I prefer to chat with my pals and have a drink and a snack and to know what they are eating and drinking... That's how this "former" AEW fan rolls! Anyway, I genuinely and sincerely appreciate everyone who wants to talk wrestling with me. I don't appreciate the dickheads who just constantly complain about the same things to the exclusion of all else and in denial of all evidence to the contrary and I kind of wish folks here would stop engaging with those pricks like there's any point in trying to argue rationally with flat-out trolls. But the appreciation outweighs that by a HUGE margin. It's probably a mistake to name names because I am sure to forget someone OBVIOUS (and also likely to include someone who hasn't actually engaged in discussion with me recently). I apologise if you have argued with me, agreed with me, supported me, challenged me, laughed at my dad jokes, made me laugh, or whatever, and your name slipped my mind. But, more or less off the top of my head I want to thank Matt, Andy/John, Paul, Octo, Baltimore, Zen, Log, Infinit, twiz, Whatever Colletti's name used to be, Sharty, Dyno, Samm, Hamm, Bacon, Casey, Drew, Marcel, Stephanie, Tech, HAG, Zakk, Dream, Drew, Axe, Eivion, John, Porky, Smelly, Sturm, Craig, Dolph, Loco, Nice, etc etc etc (edit: Gorman, Kevin, Turtle, Lost, hobo, t... I almost forgot CURT, who INSPIRED THIS THREAD! I might keep adding names as they occur to me, or I might just leave it at this. You get the idea, probably) ...for the discussion. It adds a little to the overall quality of my life. It made this year better than it would have been without you all. That's a hell of a list of people to discuss wrestling with. Cheers! *pours one out for DEAN*
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Surely using a hockey stick to win the FTW championship should have resulted in a Hooking penalty.
They should bring in either Hurricane Helms or Tyler Breeze to team with Cody's big brother:
Dustin the Wind
(Seriously, though, I will never complain about an unexpected Dustin match).
Hey Abadon! What kind of witch is Julia Hart?
A sand witch! *bites her"
Post-match: Well, Abadon, you lost to Julia Hart. You bitter?
Yep! Once on each arm and then on the forehead.
Seriously, though: LOVED the "This is spooky!" chant.
I kind of wonder if CJ Perry will be able to go back to the "I am pretending not to like my husband so I can cost you this match with zero actual stakes" well again.
That was a perfectly booked tournament and the final was really great.
Word is Tony K felt it was a huge success and wants to do more stuff like that in AEW
BUT word is also that he feels the same way about the Devil storyline.
Joe as AEW champ could be pretty great
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59 minutes ago, Octopus said:
Call me vain but I love my spleen!
You're so vain, you probably think this post is about you. Don't you? DON'T YOU??
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When Jericho came out to start the show with a blahblahblah segment, I was a bit "uh-oh" but it turned out to be a nice heartwarming reunion for les sex gawds.
Hat tip to, I think, Ex for "smitten" and "chagrin"
I always enjoy a Pure Rules match, and Sydal was an interesting choice for Yuta's warm-up match before fighting Hook tomorrow.
Chaos vs Top Flight action was exactly what I hope for in a Rampage main event. There's lots of things that I hope for, I guess, and a fast and fun little bit random trios match is absolutely among them.
I don't think this show got me MORE excited for tomorrow's PPV, but I am excited enough already.
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7 hours ago, Craig H said:
Oh no…
https://www.theplayerstribune.com/posts/maxwell-jacob-friedman-aew-wrestling
I’m probably wrong, maybe, hopefully, but reading this made me think one thing: TK is the Devil and he’s going to try and make Long Island the new Montreal with the storyline reason being that he couldn’t let MJF take the title into 2024 and potentially leave AEW while still being champion. No need to be forced into a bidding war of 2024 if MJF isn’t champion.
THAT'S your take-away!!?!? Why? Friedman doesn't even MENTION "the bidding war of 2024" in that article.
(Edit: you still get a thank you trophy for posting the article, though).
It's a superb article. I am astonished after reading it that I either 100% agreed with or completely understood why he was making EVERY SINGLE POINT that he made. It legit seems to be coming straight from the heart. I like MJF quite a bit more, having read thst. It's a long article, but it is an EXCELLENT read and Friedman makes a TON of excellent points.
The one that REALLY got me thinking was the bit near the end about "MJF fatigue."
Can't speak for anyone else but for me it's certainly not about "the Jewish stuff." (Big hint: take a good look at my face. The nose in particular). I was adopted as an infant by Sotttish-Canadian Presbyterians, so I wasn't raised Jewish. But I met my biological mother when I was in my 30s (she and her family had spent years searching for me) and was warmly welcomed into her big, warm-hearted, eccentric Calgary Jewish family. Still close with them. Only my mother is left from the family that raised me. (And some uncles and cousins in Scotland). And my (adoptive) mom has dementia pretty bad now. So the Calgary Jews are a big part of the family I have left back in Canada. And, yeah, they had ties to the Hart family back in the day. Too bad they didn't find me when I was still a prize fighter! I might have been given an opportunity to become well known. Or, maybe I'm lucky in the sense I am alive and not an addict and my body functions really well for a 58 year old with a very high BMI.
Anyway, I DO have a bit of MJF fatigue. But it isn't the Jew stuff. And that article took a hell of a lot of the edge off that fatigue...
i think it's two things:
1) MJF is GREAT on the mic when he's being vulnerable. Like, say, that promo where he told Punk how it broke his heart when Punk retired. He's maybe the third best guy in AEW at speaking "from the heart" either honestly or in character. (Bryan and Eddie are better, but it's pretty close).
And he is clever and witty enough to sometimes make me laugh right out loud or, even better, make me think, "damn, that's a good one" because I am too impressed by the cleverness to laugh.
However, in my opinion, he's the absolute dirt worst when he tries to be edgy. Particularly when he talks about, let's say, getting BJs while driving.
2) I tend to get REALLY tired REALLY quickly when dudes are in a position to book themselves, and they choose to book themselves like peak Stone Cold. Hence, my intractable dislike of Jeff Jarrett, who pulled that shit when his daddy had the book. Riding an ambulance back to the arena to heroically overcome impossible odds is not a way to impress this old half-a-Jew. (My biological father was an extra-goyish English poet and a straight up egomaniac. I only met him once. It was once too often). Booking yourself like Stone Cold is, I'm afraid, a way to make me feel a little bit sad and disappointed.
So, for what it's worth, that's MY take-away from the genuinely excellent article.
And I am super-stoked to see how the PPV Main Event plays out now. And also I think it's very likely to be a great fight, too.
Between this and Eddie Kingston Has No Business Being Here (or whatever it was called) The Athletic is THE go-to for top shelf AEW articles. Dang.
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40 minutes ago, username said:
So... Tony sweeps in and steals the "most delusional wrestling claim of the year" award right before the deadline.
I'm pretty sure this rant still takes the "most delusional" cake:
(Edit: Just realised, while enjoying that video, that it was after All Out 2022. Yikes. Doesn't feel like it was that long ago).
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9 hours ago, Matt D said:
Here is a match.
It's maybe the best single match we saw out of the Panama footage and another chance to see their hero Sandokan and maybe your first look at LA Park well well before he was LA Park. (We covered it here: https://segundacaida.blogspot.com/2023/06/espectaculos-promociones-panama-best.html) Also Idolo, as a rudo, who was another iconic figure in Panama. I say that because if you want a bonus, it'd be this...
which we covered here: https://segundacaida.blogspot.com/2023/08/espectaculos-promociones-panama-idolo.html
This is really just a rudo miscommunication special with a turn at the end, but it's Idolo going tecnico after a lengthy rudo run and I swear to you, it's crazy to watch. It feels like we're watching something that doesn't belong to us, something that we're sneaking a look at. There's something kind of voyeuristic to it, like we're peeking into a neighbor's window to see some moment entirely heartfelt to them. We understand it because we understand wrestling and we can tell how special it is because we see what it means to them, but it's still a little strange, but sort of in the best way, a way that I imagine you'll appreciate.
So you can watch one or both. Up to you.
DO NOT READ THIS YET!(OK, you can read it now) I (had) to post this in stages. Type it up on Chrome, so I can have paragraph breaks. Post videos on Firefox. It's gonna take a moment to finish anyway. First I'll type up my general thoughts on Sandokan. Then the matches I picked for you. Then FINALLY specific thoughts on the two matches.
ALWAYS a real pleasure to be matched up with you MattD, and a challenge. A late Christmas gift, if you will. My goal this time is to find something nifty you have never seen. I have been tucking stuff away. In particular, matches featuring wrestlers you like in unusual place and/or vs unexpected opponents. Plus one more weirdly-Japanese-sexualized match that can ONLY be appreciated by keeping a VERY open mind (in the tradition of Kana/Fujiwara potatoing each other or Alexander Otsuka's sex addict comedy gimmick Otokosakari). The particular Stardom match I will provide as a last-ditch option if you've seen everything else I found, seems to be entirely structured around boobs-based psychology. It's an extremely weird match which has the form of an offensive attitude era ladies match but not, in my opinion, the substance of one.
I found an Onita & Murdoch vs Kurisu & Leduc match and thought "That will be PERFECT for Matt! Then I saw that it was you who posted it.
General thoughts on Sandokan
My first exposure was a match DEAN wrote up on a previous Santo, that ended in an absolute riot. I think Curt posted a bloody singles match (maybe vs LA PARK?) in the bloody matches thread. Then you gave me a match with Sandokan and friend vs Giant Tataki where the good guys absolutely cheated to win and the crowd went crazy with joy when they did so.
And there was also that Argentinean (?) match where the shepherd gave his sheep to the mummy and they hugged. Which was the greatest thing ever. Which was also the first time I really felt that "looking through your neighbour's window" feeling.
My thoughts on Sandokan at the time: I haven't seen a ton of Panamanian wrestling (maybe ONE other match also connected to Secret Santo and/or Matt or Segunda) but it LITERALLY seems like someone explained it to Sandokan and he kind of got it and explained it fairly well to some other Panamanian dudes and they kind of tried to work it out as they went along. This as opposed to what happened in Japan where dudes like Blassie were present and involved and therefore the pacing and storytelling in Rikidozan matches are miles better than in Sandokan matches.
So, that. Plus, the somewhat disturbing similarities to what I have seen of Sandokan so far to that era of Hulkamania where Hogan essentially WAS America and so anyone going against Hogan was by definition in the wrong, regardless of their motivation, and anything Hogan did to an enemy was automatically justified and cheered even if he was straight-up cheating to win.
So I am stoked to see more Sandokan! And surprised to read that he got to the point of being legitimately good!
Sandokan vs LA Park trios match:
Good Lord! The pacing, timing, and structure here are so much better than the Panamanian matches I have seen before! It's night and day.
It occurs to me how lucky the Panamanian fans of this era were as contrasted with, let's say, Argentinean fans who were stuck with Kardagian, or maybe central European fans of the Otto Wanz era (or, according to Jericho's book, the late-era Rene Lesartasse), or in particular British fans when Big Daddy ruled the roost. In the sense that Sandokan was fit and athletic, but moreso in the sense that he was willing and able to learn and grow, and also willing to bump and sell and put other wrestlers over at his own expense. I was NOT expecting him to eat two falls here. And one relatively cleanly, even!
I have to assume it was the visiting Mexican heels who taught him the art of psychology at such a high level. Possibly the future LA Park, in particular. Park vs Sandokan is by far the best thing in all three falls as far as wrestling, "per se" goes. And unfortunately a lot of Sandokan vs Park takes place on the floor while the camera is focused on the lesser wrestlers fighting in the ring. In particular: Sandokan's partner in the blue gear seems pretty limited athletically,while Idolo really seems to lack intensity and fire, here. The other two wrestlers in the match are pretty good, though.
Between the second and third falls, there is a long dramatic sequence where Sandokan takes a harrowing beat-down, and... I honestly wonder if maybe Hangman and Swerve might have watched and been inspired by this match? It's certainly cool to see how awesomely creative Park was this early in his career. Hats off to Sandokan for recognising that and putting the young man over so strongly here.
There's a cool bit in the third fall when the camera shifts to show Sandokan and Future Park brawling on the floor and you can clearly see that the arena is also used for basketball.
There's a legitimately funny bit where the ref starts to count three on Sandokan while he is lying bloody on the mat with nobody covering him and Park flies in knees first to make the cover.
An insane riot (once again) erupts after this one! I was there live when Mox and O-Khan brawled into the crowd at Edion Arena and it was wildly exciting... But there was nothing like the sense of danger that we get here. The crowd seems perpetually on the verge of erupting into chaos and anarchy here, and it is not the least bit surprising when that's how the video finishes. Keep an eye on the (I'm assuming security staff) in the yellow t-shirt. Yikes!
also I am going to pretend his name is Sand O-Khan and he's Great O-Khan's father.
This was really excellent and I enjoyed it so much. There is a real evolution going on here. What a treat to be able to bear witnesses to it!
Idolo turns face!
Oh, this was tremendous fun! I think that this structure, this particular story being told, at this level, is damned near unique.
As Matt says, it's basically just heel miscommunication leading to a face turn. But it's a near-perfect version of that.
They run through so many "malfunction at the junction" spots and Exterminador 1 goes from being apologetic to begging off to trying to make up for it, while Idolo goes from being forgiving to being totally fed up. Eventually Idolo will no longer take the bait when his partner sets a good guy up for a double team. Nor will he cheat to even the odds when the good guys regain the advantage.
So then SOME OTHER GUY in a zip hoodie comes in to help Exterminador cheat and that leads to Idolo finally turning on his partner to re-embrace the Light Side of the Panamanian Force. So then the tag match just kind of ends with the good guys victorious, and we transition into a long back and forth brawl between Idolo and his former partner in crime. And that REALLY riles up the crowd. The crowd gets entirely out of control again but more in a "rushing the field after a victory to tear down the goal posts" way than in a "riot" way. And the absolute climax is Idolo and Sandokan embracing in the ring while the fans go into joyous rapture.
THIS is pro wrestling at its very finest. Damn!
TO BE CONTINUEDMatches I hope Matt hasn't seen yet:
JARRETT in WWC
ANDRE!
MY MIND IS BOGGLED THAT THIS MATCH EVEN EXISTS! And I don't remember it being covered in your 80s AJPW/NJPW thread.
As a last resort: BEWBS!
ALTERNATIVELY: One I imagine you must have seen, but I would like your opinion on it:
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2 hours ago, Octopus said:
With @Kang by my side, AEW has nowhere to go but up.
"All will kneel trembling before me, and obey my brutal command. End communication."
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1 hour ago, Curt McGirt said:
Just... why? That's such a random and obscure reference to make. It's like calling him "a quarter of a Big Daddy" or something.
It's because Garcia kept struggling to hit the Backdrop Driver on King. It's one of Morishima's finishing moves. They were talking about if a guy half Morishima's size could hit that move on a guy the size of King. Size/strength vs leverage. That kind of thing. I thought it was excellent commentary. Added to the match, for me. Made it even more impressive when Garcia finally hit it.
Also "Vanilla Gorilla" is pretty common football/gym slang for a beefy/powerful white guy with no back-down in his character. That made perfect sense to me as a nickname for Brian Cage
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33 minutes ago, The Natural said:
I need to catch up on this tournament. I'm behind. Which matches do you recommend? Cheers.
33 minutes ago, The Natural said:I still prefer the time limit to be 30 minutes and not 20.
Literally EVERY SINGLE MATCH in the tournament is well worth watching. Not a single dud among them. Jay Lethal was the dude I was personally least stoked to watch, but he worked his ass off and everyone he fought looked great against him. My least favourite match was Switchblade vs Swerve (a bit go-go-go, move-move-move for my tastes) and it was still REALLY good.
If that's too much... Every Blue League match, maybe?
That's too much? Probably goes without saying but EVERY Dragon and EVERY Mad King match is must-see.
No fooling, my friend. You can't make a bad choice and ZERO matches were straight-up skippable.
Andrade vs Bryan was brutal. It's possible you might not enjoy it because you'll be too worried about Bryan.
Have to respectfully disagree with you on the time limits. It gave the matches greater urgency and prevented any sense of G1-type burnout. I wouldn't change a single thing about the C2 so far.
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The tournament has been pretty much perfectly booked leading into an absolutely perfect blue league semi-finals and an excellent gold league semis. I see the hand-wringing about it being a triple threat, but maybe let's let it play out before complaining about how terrible it is? There has to be at least a slim possibility that Mox, Swerve, and Switchblade can make it work, my dudes.
The number one thing I wanted going in was a big Dragon vs Mad King match with high stakes. We got that, and the road to getting there with both guys having to claw back from underneath after Eddie suffered a (straight up, no question, obvious) UPSET loss to Brody King and Andrade went hard after Bryan's injured eye was f'n IDEAL booking. Really dramatic.
The ideal finish would be Kingston fighting through Bryan and then Mox to become the first AEW Triple Crown champion, of course, but out of the six possible final matches, EVERY one of them would be good and exciting.
Nigel was f'n OBNOXIOUS today. I guess I'm not the only one feeling that way.
Speaking of obnoxious, Lawful Metal how did so many people get involved in that "Twooo!" thing? Genuinely impressive, even if I personally didn't like it.
Some nice details on the show today:
- An incredible counter to the Giant Swing followed up by an incredible counter INTO the Giant Swing.
- EVERYBODY... is getting a little bit tired of The Acclaimed and Daddy Ass.
- Lee vs Cage was more a series of legitimately impressive strength spots than BMMSM but it was still really enjoyable.
- LOVED the huge struggle to hit the Backdrop Driver. Excellent stuff from Garcia and King. Also loved Menard playing Kobashi 6/9/95 to Garcia's Misawa in the post-match.
- The long Zombie In Peril segment leading to a Thunderous hot tag was excellent stuff as well.
- Andrade and Kingston both did some top-shelf selling and it made the match extra dramatic.
It's the 24th here. That show was a NICE Christmas present.
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Obviously, the show got off to kind of a Rocky start.
I guess I could also make joke about the match being pure Chaos?
Anyway, an unsurprisingly super fun and really good match. It was nice that (as far as I could tell) the announce team kept the "Orange is playing mind games" trope in their pockets and just let the mystery be. It works better for me that way.
And it occurs to me that Orange actually hasn't changed his character. What's changed is mostly the way that character is presented.
It further occurs to me that most of my kvetching about current AEW is about presentation more than anything else. The cake is still great. Consistently as good as or better than any cake available anywhere in the world. But grandpa here is grumbling because he prefers how they used to do the icing, back in the good olde days of 2019-2020.
Hardyz vs Kingdom did nothing for me. Absolutely couldn't get into it. Guess that's proof that a nice face in peril -> hot tag sequence is not, in and of itself, sufficient to make a tag match exciting. At least for this grandpa.
I bet Sir Mix-a-Lot REALLY enjoyed Skye vs Queen.
Also unsurprising: Another SPECTACULAR Vikingo Rampage main event! I think El Hijo del Mantaur has definitely surpassed his father.
For sure, someone on these boards enjoyed the tag match more than the main event. That is a good thing. No point in discussion if we all just agree.
AEW Fight Forever added tights and trunks WITH SIDE STRIPES and bicycle shorts and a bikini top WITH CONTRASTING TRIM to the CAW suite. FOR FREE! It's a tiny baby step in the right direction. I was able to slightly improve my Ibushi, Claudio, Eddie Guerrero, Okada, Naito, AND Misawa CAWS!
I guess that means I'm once again an AEW fan, but I can't change my name again for six months
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Man, I will really miss this tournament once it's finished. In terms of in-ring action it's hard to come up with an example of another tournament where *every* match is so good. And every match with Bryan or Kingston has, in my opinion, been GREAT. And I don't feel burned out by the C2 so far, at all. The G1 ALWAYS burns me out when I try to watch every match. The smaller field and shorter match times definitely help out with that here. Can hardly wait for Collision. It looks like it's going to be an amazing conclusion to the first part of this very enjoyable journey.
Weirdly, I feel like tonight's main event was my least favourite match of the tournament so far. Just felt a little bit "go, go, go, move, move, move, kickout, kickout, kickout" crossfit style to me, even with Mox selling the hell out of that knee. "Least Favourite" doesn't mean I didn't like it, though. Sir Paul is probably my least favourite Beatle but I love his music and he's obviously an all time great.
I am still hoping for Bryan or Kingston vs Mox in the finals. Let Swerve go after Friedman's belt instead.
I think they handled Kenny being out really well. I am glad they didn't turn it into some BS angle. Stay tasteful, AEW!
I think that the C2 Triple Crown belt being plain black velvet is a BOLD design choice!
SO HAPPY Riho won.
Glad they esplained the tiebreakers today.
Rush/Swerve sounds like dangerous driving!
Nice to hear JR sounding relatively healthy and happy. He seemed rejuvenated.
Wardlow's stuffy nose, Joey Samoey, and the Mox sign all got legit lols outa me. The MJF is the Devil signs came close.
Hard to believe Christmas is almost here.
Brian Cage vs Keith Lee could be tremendous. Big Meaty Men Leaping Around!
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ON THE OTHER HAND:
If you are going to pander to wrestling fan nostalgia, maybe bring in the ghost of Classy Fred Blassie! He would appeal to WWF Universe denizens, fans of the territory days, and pencil neck geeks like me who only like Japanese wrestling. Add the ghost of Blassie to the A Farewell To Sting storyline! It could go a little something... like... THIS:
Announcer: After a series of staggering defeats, Sting, Darby, and Flair assembled in the backstage area in March 2024 for a meeting with famed manager Classy Fred Blassie. And, luckily for us, the cameras were rolling.
Blassie: Alright, you pencil neck geeks, I think we’re ready to lay this first match out. By the way, my name is Fred Blassie. Yes, the Fred Blassie. And I gotta tell you: fellas.. you have got what appears to be a dynamite ring chemistry.
Sting: Coming from you, Fred, that means a lot.
Darby: Yeah. I mean, you’re Fred Blassie!
Ric Flair: It’s… wooo!
Darby: I can’t believe Fred Blassie digs our workrate!
Blassie: Easy, guys.. I put my pants on just like the rest of you – one leg at a time. Except, my pants are bright red and covered in rhinestones. [ the group laughs ] Alright, here we go. “Revolution 2024 Main Event” – take one. [ exits into the Gorilla Position ]
[ the group begins the match. Flair struts around, Sting howls, and Darby lays Sting out with a Coffin Drop ]
Sting: [ angry ] Okay! Wait! Wait! [ everyone stops ] Fred, could you come in here for a minute, please?
Blassie: [ stepping out of the Gorilla Position ] That was gonna be a great match. Guys, what’s the deal?
Sting: Are you sure that was going okay?
Blassie: I’ll be honest.. you pencil necked geek, it was going great. But.. I could’ve used a little more Coffin Drop. So.. let’s take it again.. and, Darb…
Darby: Yeah?
Blassie: Really explore the ring this time. I mean, really.. explore the space. I like what I’m seeing.
[ the match starts again, with Darby Coffin Dropping Sting even more fiercely than before. In Gorilla, Blassie is smiling. ]
Sting: Okay, wait! Stop! I’m sorry. Fred, could you come back in here, please?
Blassie: [ stepping out of Gorilla Position ] You pencil neck geek, grit-eatin’ freak, scum sucking pea head with a hulking physique.. That last one was even better than the first!
Sting: Well, it’s just that I find Darby's Coffin Dropping distracting! If I’m the only one, I’ll shut up.
Ric Flair: It was kind of.. wooo!
Darby: You know, I could pull back a little. If you’d like.
Blassie: Not too much, though! Fellas, I’m telling you – you’re gonna want that Coffin Drop in the match!
Darby: You know what? It’s fine. Let’s just do this thing.
[ they start the match up again. Darby immediately tries to Coffin Drop Sting again. ]
Sting: [ fighting Darby ] Come on, people!
Blassie: [ walking out of the Gorilla Position again ] That.. that doesn’t work for me. I gotta have more Coffin Drop!
Flair: [ grabs Darby's shirt ] Don’t blow this for us, Darby!
Sting: Yeah, quit being so selfish, Darby!
Darby: Can I just say one thing?
Blassie: Say it, baby. Say it.
Darby: I’m standing here, staring at Classy Fred Blassie!
Blassie: The Hollywood fashion plate, baby!
Darby: And if Fred Blassie wants more Coffin Drop, we should probably give him more Coffin Drop!
Blassie: Say it, baby!
Darby: And, Stinger, you are right – I am being selfish. But the last time I checked, we don’t have a whole lot of matches that don’t end with me looking up at the lights.
Blassie: I gotta have more Coffin Drop, baby!
Darby: ..and I’ll be doing myself a disservice — and every member of this faction, if I don’t Coffin Drop the hell out of you.
Blassie: Guess what? I got a fever! And the only prescription.. is more Coffin Drop!
Batista: Thanks, Fred. But I think, maybe if I just leave.. and, maybe I’ll come back later, and you guys can lay out the match.. [ starts to leave the arena ]
Blassie: They say, ‘these geeks come a dime a dozen.’ I’m lookin’ for the guy who’s supplyin’ the dimes.
Sting: Darby, wait! Why don’t you lay out that match right now. With us. Together.
[ everyone agrees ]
Darby: Do you mean that, Stinger?
Ric Flair: He speaks for all of us.
[ pregnant pause ]
Ric Flair: Wooo!
Darby: Thank you.
Blassie: Babies.. before we’re done here.. you’ll all have had your chance to wear the Big Ole’ Gold Belt.
Flair: [ suspicious ] What does that mean?
Blassie: Never question Fred Blassie!
[ apparently elated, Sting lifts Darby onto the top turnbuckle. Blassie and Flair take a couple of steps towards the Gorilla Position, stop, turns slowly, and give Darby the “Four Horsemen” signal. Close-up on Darby as he absolutely nails Sting with the Coffin Drop. ]
Freeze-frame with graphic: “In Memoriam: Sting's in-ring career: November 25, 1985 - March 3, 2024” ]
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NOSTALGIA
I don't think my nostalgia w/r/t pro wrestling is *typical* wrestling nostalgia. Partly because of my age, partly because of my personal experience(s) of pro wrestling. And I think it goes a long way to explaining why my taste(s) in wrestling are also often somewhat atypical.
Of course, EVERYONE's experience/nostalgia/opinions are different and personal.
But some of my experiences are rather unique, even by those standards, I believe.
For example, I was a member of the Vancouver All Star Wrestling roster and a character on their TV show in the mid-1980s. I was "inside" pro wrestling during the era where kayfabe reigned, and I experienced The Death of the Territory System first hand.
For example, I lived in post-communist middle Europe from the mid 90s through the turn of the century, and as such missed out on the Monday Night Wars and ECW etc etc.
When I came back to Canada, I got RIGHT into tape trading, at first to catch up on what I'd missed. And I ended up writing for Inside Pulse alongside guys like Hyatte and Scott Keith and got to experience the tail end of the "internet insiders" boom first hand as well.
Then, I moved to Japan and was part of the Osaka Pro family from 2009 through 2012, and still maintain ties with many of my friends from those days.
And it all ties together when some of the survivors from Vancouver All Star make their annual trip to Vancouver to work and party with Asian Cooger!
Kayfabe
It might be reasonable to expect that a guy who wrestled during the 80s would be right there with Cornette and JR when it comes to the sanctity of kayfabe and the necessity of "protecting the business" but in fact it's quite the opposite with me.
"The boys" in the green room at BCTV were SO SERIOUS about it. I was playing a bad guy character, so I wasn't allowed to arrive at the arena with, or give a ride home to, any of the good guys. I was expected to treat the fans at the arena and studio poorly, not only during the show but also before and after... Curse them out. Threaten them, even. So they'd boo us, later.
What bullshit! The fans were SO NICE to me, asking for autographs, showing me their photo albums, letting me ride their skateboards, or whatever. I was always getting in trouble in the heel dressing rooms for smiling at the kids and grandmas who wanted to say hello to me.
I was a shitty heel, in other words.
That was in itself a kind of quaint nostalgia, I now believe. The veterans in the locker room had been brought up in wrestling by guys who were themselves brought up in a time where keeping kayfabe probably was important to the business, a time before the cat was well and truly out of the bag.
By the time I got there, though, even the (often literally toothless) rural fan base that came out to the arena shows in Cloverdale were almost all cognizant that "Thumper" was a bad guy character that they enjoyed booing during the matches whereas "Gordi" was a relatively easy-going and friendly person, with a nice girlfriend, who played that character on TV.
We used to be able to sneak into the backstage entrance area at the Pacific Coliseum when the WWF was in town and get pictures with the wrestlers. The heels were always the friendliest. Then one day someone put a stop to it. I bet it was an old guy with a stick up his ass about kayfabe.
What bullshit!
Anyway, that goes a certain distance in explaining why I was happier when Orange Cassidy was just a weird guy who wrestled lazily and not some clever strategist playing subtle mind games. The cat is WELL AND TRULY out of the bag now, and has been for a very long time. Why not have some fun with it?
That was massively reinforced by my time as a regular member of the ringside crowd at Osaka Pro shows and a participant in their many drinking parties and social events during my first few years here in Japan. The heel/face and wrestler/fan divides fell away and we could all be one big happy drunken laughing family. It was a kind of paradise.
And the comedy! Based on tweaking the sacred tropes of pro wrestling in a loving way. I am still amazed that so many people could understand and enjoy that!
Which goes a fair way in explaining why I loved the "Ring of Friendship" "All Friends Wrestling" era of AEW and LOVED that they had succeeded in taking that beautiful sense of community to a place where TEN THOUSAND PEOPLE could feel a part of it all at once and why I mourn that they pissed that away trying to appease JR, and Cornette fans; that they pissed it away in a failed attempt to bring in the mythical huge casual fan base.
MEMBER BERRIES
Speaking of pandering...
Good Lord! That Sting/Flair promo in Carolina where they LITERALLY came out and were, like, "Member Bam Bam Bigelow? Member him?" And the crowd were, like, " YEAH! WE MEMBER! WE MEMBER!"
Fucking hell. I was flabbergasted. Then in the same show (I believe. Certainly it was the same week) MJF LITERALLY said "Good memberberries" or "nice memberberries" to Hangman in their backstage bit. I
I know they are not trying to troll me, Gordlow, specifically. They aren't aware that I exist. But I hope I can be forgiven for kind of feeling like maybe they were.
I get why those specific memberberries would work on a Charlotte Coliseum crowd. I don't begrudge them that simple pleasure. But oh boy did that segment stoke the fires of my concern that AEW is putting away "doing original and challenging stuff" in favour of "Let's stoke the memberberries fires!"
And, because I was out of town for the MNW/ECW era and because I was generally more into trading tapes than watching TV in the subsequent era and in particular because the main two dudes I was into watching on that era of TV both met tragic and awful ends i DON'T HAVE HAPPY NOSTALGIA for those days.
So I am not excited for Edge vs Christian, again.
And to be honest bringing Flair in has me, personally, less hyped for Sting's Last Match.
Not so much complaining here as just trying to understand/explain my own feelings.
It's not that I am anti-nostalgia. I got right into Muta/Mutoh's retirement tour, for example. Marked out hard, more than once. I went out of my way to be there for Manabu Nakanishi's last match in Osaka and got emotional during it.
But, I guess when the lazy as fuck cheap heat nostalgia pops are aimed somewhere where my nostalgia is lacking... The laziness just feels too painfully obvious.
My Problem With Nigel
It's not like I hate heel commentators. Hell, I WAS a heel commentator in the 1980s!
It's not that Nigel is BAD at being a heel commentator. He certainly plays the role well enough. He is getting better at knowing when not to speak.
It's that, in 2023, a heel commentator is blatant memberberries type bullshit cheap nostalgia. It's disingenuous. It's, "Hey! Member Bobby Heenan? Member Jesse The Body? You liked them, right?"
Even more than Statlander being a literal alien or Orange's lazy kicks, even more than Evil Uno playing a game of Uno on Being the Elite, the thing that I feel invited the new fan (like myself) into the AEW community in the glorious first couple of years was the relaxed friendly laid back natural honest chatting going on at the commentary desk. Particularly on Dark or during picture in picture on the international feed. Just likeable guys like Mark Henry and Big Show and Taz and Ex and Tony making each other laugh and being themselves and not playing some bullshit character. Meaning what they said and saying what they meant and joking around loosely. SUCH a refreshing change from the horrific corporate speak on WWE's show.
I feel like Nigel's disingenuous heel announcer character is a huge step away from that refreshing honesty and freedom and toward a kind of empty pandering to how things used to be.
Personally, I'd rather Nigel just be himself instead of playing an over the top heel character.
Anyway
The days of AEW being a warm-hearted community-based genuine alternative to corporate wrestling are over. We are well into the late capitalist "WE MUST GROW!" stage and memberberrying seems to be a big part of the Challenge Brand strategy .
Ironically, it leaves me feeling nostalgic for the halcyon days of 2019
And there is still SO MUCH great wrestling week in and week out anyway, so I am really mostly sad that they want to present it in a more polished and professional way rather than in a more warm and rumpled way. In a "maybe this will make people like us" way (which it won't) rather than a "just be true to your weird self" way.
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5 hours ago, StretchMediatedHypertrophy said:
Possibly though I think he was on 411 until 2007. Yeah I heard he died only yesterday. It is sad, he was only 50, but I sort of hope his last words were 'This was Hyatte'.
It's funny to remember the wild west that was teh internets back then.
Man, nobody remembers Inside Pulse.
I was a wrestling (and MMA) writer on Inside Pulse in the early/mid 2000s, along with Chris Hyatte, Flea, Scott Keith, David Ditch, and a bunch of other enthusiastic writers. A lot of us (maybe all of us?) did indeed migrate over from the 411 boards/New Millenium Blues crew. Meanwhile all-around excellent guys Larry Csonka (RIP) and Dark Pegasus JD Dunn held things down at 411 after our great NOAH-esque exodus.
What great memories I have of those days! Most of us here are old enough to remember it. Before (almost) everything was on YouTube. Before YouTube existed! You had to make connections and trade tapes if you wanted to watch Japanese or Mexican or Indie wrestling. Then, guys like Verne, Tabe, Goldenboy, Schneider, Keith etc etc were putting comps together and/or making older stuff available. Eventually, you could join crazymax..., Then, eventually, wait for IVP videos to have a sale or whatever... around then people (myself included) started uploading matches on YT...
And with each step it became a little bit less of an exclusive club, which is good, but people also took it more and more for granted, which is too bad.
The 411/IP split came at such an interesting/fun time. The Verne/Tabe etc etc point on that timeline. Probably the peak period for WWE snark from the Flea/Hyatte/Dunn/Keith crew, when several of them featured on EWR, when you still had to *subscribe* to a dirt sheet to have access to insider information, when Ditch and Keith and myself were kind of still exposing Japanese wrestling to a readership that at that time had to make an actual effort to be able to watch the matches we were writing about. It wouldn't last much longer.
I really enjoyed that sense of it being "something special." I think that's why I can't get along with people who are too snarky and negative about wrestling. Not that "it's still real to me" but that it still feels special to me. Projects like Secret Santo really drive home how LUCKY we are with such an insane variety of wrestling available any time anywhere these days. Legit bums me out that some folks primarily choose to complain about all that wrestling rather than enjoying it.
At one point Inside Pulse was getting 750,000 distinct views per month! But the discussion boards were never as lively as 411s. Eventually I had to make my way over here (and to Smark's Choice and SSS) to find people who were interested in discussing Japanese wrestling. I think someone referring to a Toryumon or Michinoku match clip I'd posted as "those little Chinese guys" was a breaking point for me in terms of trying to get any such discussion going over there
Anyway, thanks for mentioning Hyatte. It's been a while since I reminisced about those days.
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6 hours ago, porksweats said:
All 3 of these sound great! In exchange, I want to make sure I thoroughly meet the Big Meat Hoss Fight standards, so here's 3 that could fit the bill
First, Rhino in NOAH back in 2019!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzZp1Cz9Yw0
Second option - One of my favorite Roadblock matches
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKmOHK8NFZM
Third Option - A Trios with some Giants on each side!
Just like with the weird/interesting/violent trio of matches that Casey gave me last week, I wasn't intending to watch all three of these right away. But, like a kid in a candy store (or Gordlow at a Chinese buffet) I just couldn't help myself. Three really fun confections here. Pure pleasure without too much nutrition or fibre. DEFINITELY three matches I would NEVER have chosen for myself.
Shibata, Inoue, & Giant Singh vs Wagner Jr, Shocker, & Giant Silva
This match is *literally* unwatchable! I don't mean that the wrestling is the drizzling shits (though, presumably, some of it is) but that the video quality *completely* craps out every few seconds during the match. I will add screen shots later to illustrate this. I have to use one browser to type, if I want paragraph breaks, and another to insert pictures or videos or tag people.
So, somtimes you get this visual, with sound:
And sometimes this, with no sound at all:
And it's literally every few seconds once the match gets going, which really makes it hard to even guess what's going on.
The introductions and ring entrances, however, are quite watchable and very entertaining in their own right.
El Puma Inoue comes out first and... It's Wataru Inoue! I had totally forgotten about him. His legs look great here. Really muscular. I assume he was really enjoying the more liberal sales policies of the pharmacies in Mexico while he was on excursion. Then Shibata comes out and his entrance music is "Looks That Kill" by Motley Crue! I find that really amusing. Later, Dr. Wagner comes out to "Bad Medicine" setting this up as a battle between The Crue and Bon Jovi. In 2002! Giant Singh is aka Great Khali. Not my personal favourite giant wrestler. I believe Black Cat is acting as Hype Man for this team. Which is awesome.
Wagner Jr and Shocker are both accompanied to the ring by a pair of smoking hawt women. For whatever reason, Giant Silva is not.
Perhaps WWE Universe residents primarily remember Silva as an Oddity? I personally revere Bigfoot for his time as a Pride Freakshow Fight mainstay and a member of the Hustle Roster. I think his team with Mark Coleman is probably the pro wrestling tag team that I'd least like to get into a shoot fight with. Or maybe the Colossal Connection.
Shocker looks a bit like, and carries himself like, a Mexican Cody Rhodes. Never noticed that before.
I bet it was an interesting match! The video clears up briefly around the 16-minute mark, when the two giants are in the ring. Which seems unfair to the viewer. But we do get to see Bigfoot Silva do a Superfly Splash onto Singh, which is a very impressive visual. I think the Mostly-Mexican team won with Shocker and The Doctor hitting their big moves in the ring while the giants brawled on the outside. That seems like the right way to book this.
From the tiny glimpses we get of Shibata, he seems to be wrestling nothing like the Shibata that we all know and love now.
Rhino vs Masa Kitamiya
What are the rules for Spelling Rhyno with a "y" or with an "i"?
I like to imagine him going into a coffee shop and saying "It's Rhyno with a 'y'" and they spell it "Rhinoy"
Anyway, the reason I would never pick this for myself is that I have near-zero nostalgia for ECW. I was living in The Czech Republic while that particular revolution was going on. I enjoyed several of the matches I saw when I got into tape trading after returning to Canada, but also found a good deal of it (the general attitude toward women, in particular) pretty off-putting. So ECW has never been 'my thing' in particular.
Though, I mean, Sabu and Cactus and Terry Funk all rule. Obviously.
I am predisposed to like Rhyno because we have the same birthday. He's exactly ten years younger than me. Also he's short and thick. Like me. And Bodyguard. And Quiet Storm. And Kensuke. And Masa Kitamiya. And Jeff Cobb! I wanna make a comeback, wear a Cobb/Rhino type singlet, form a faction of relatively short and thick guys who call ourselves The Choad Warriors.
I am predisposed to like Masa Kitamiya because he's very roughly my size (shorter and more roidy-looking, but close enough) so I can imagine "oh, that's what I might look like in the ring against that guy" while watching him (also feel that way about Kensuke...)
Also, I like that he likes Masa Saito. Good and interesting choice, there.
This match definitely doesn't overstay its welcome. They run into each other full speed, slug each other hard, both of them get to show off their strength and toughness, each of them sells a little for the other (but not too much), Rhino hits a couple of power moves, blocks the Saito Suplex... Then, boom! Gore! And that's all you need, in my opinion.
It's in my beloved furitsu taiikukan so I am a little disappointed the Osaka crowd didn't get more into this one. I think it might have been part of the 2019 N1. Jon Moxley, Jeff Cobb, and Lance Archer were in the G1 that year so as usual, lately, New Japan got more of my attention than NOAH.
I could have seen this live. Too bad. I would really have enjoyed that.
Roadblock vs Goldberg
I was in The Czech Republic during the rise of Goldberg. I went back to Canada for a summer when he and Stone Cold were at their peaks and the Monday Night Wars were in full swing, and I was pleased to see two muscular bald guys with little beards on top of the pro wrestling world!
Nice to have a look back at the beginning of the Goldberg experiment.
Due to my general lack of ECW nostalgia, I had basically no opinion of Roadblock going into this. Now, I have an opinion: He fills a great and unappreciated and sadly often missing role here. An ENORMOUS, physically ugly dude with a bad body who is nimble enough in the ring to (one presumes) believably squash lower card guys and also bump for the guys you want to put over.
(EDIT: I was actually under the impression that Roadblock was the same big guy who was 911 in ECW. Apparently not! Thanks for pointing that out, below, Casey. I am wildly underinformed - and, mostly, disinterested - when it comes to the pro wrestling that was on TV and popular while I was living in Europe).
Roadblock is *ideal* in this role here. Goldberg hitting the jackhammer on this dude is legitimately impressive. And I'd still feel bad for the next lower-card guy that Roadblock got in the ring with even though he was convincingly beaten here. I guess Lance Archer plays a similar role in AEW these days (though Archer has a good body).
Guys like that are super valuable. Matches like this are so much fun.
Thank you, Porksweats! I had a blast watching those. Even the one I couldn't actually see.
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@porksweats in "Honor" of some pretty enjoyable ROH PPV pre-show action, here's some olde schoole ROH full matches featuring A-Pre-W and Before They Were Superstars type interesting/unexpected match-ups. Take your pick!I
As always, no WWE or NXT for ole Gordlow, please. I am kind of in the mood for Big Meaty Men Smashing Meat Hoss Fight Kaiju Battle type action, but I am not going to insist on it, if you had something else in mind.
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Not trying to be controversial here but, in my opinion, that looks like it might be a pretty good couple hours of pro wrestling television.
Also, I think both Hangman vs Neckstrong (a natural match-up) and Mox vs Swerve feature two American wrestlers competing in THEIR HOME COUNTRY of America, not unlike Kenny vs Ego from Collision in Montreal. I bet the local American crowd will be extra pumped up for that!
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On 12/11/2023 at 1:59 PM, Casey said:
You know what? I got some time this week.
Monday morning before I go to bed (I’m at work right now, night shift), I’ll have @The Natural’s reviews up. I’m going to do Undertaker/Mankind: Buried Alive and Mankind/HBK: Mind Games.
And I’m gonna watch every single one of those Bull matches and have them reviewed before Friday. Because she’s my favorite wrestler, you’re one of my favorite posters (believe it or not) and it’s the holiday season. Secret Santo rules the fucking world - until I pair with @Matt D
As for you… Maybe you’ve seen them (most likely), maybe you haven’t. But who cares! I’ll give you some choices, too.
Violent:
Combat Toyoda’s retirement match, versus Megumi Kudo, in an exploding electrified barbwire rope match. One of my very first exposures to joshi and Japanese wrestling in general was watching those FMW tapes they used to sell (in America) with the shitty English commentary. I was captivated. I’m pretty sure this was on one of those tapes. Combat, Megumi and Shark are staples of my teenage wrestling years. I love Megumi Kudo - not as much as Bull, but it’s a close one.
Interesting:
(the link might not embed in the actual post, so… Google it? It’s in this post, I swear!)
Mike Awesome/The Gladiator versus The Great Muta, AJPW 2003.)
Well, it’s interesting to me anyway. I’m a big Mike Awesome mark, but I’ve seen shockingly little of his Japan run that isn’t FMW. I think in the last Santo I gave someone Awesome/Kobashi, so here’s two of my favorite wrestlers way past their prime! That’s fun. At the very least it might be good in a trainwreck sort of way.
Weird:
I know ECW is owned by WWE now, but at this point, they weren’t, so I’m gonna throw it in here. A fancam of Tracy Smothers versus Kintaro Kanemura at a house show in 1999, in Nashville TN. Come on, a weird ass match-up, for a niche promotion, in the middle of the Bible Belt? If that doesn’t qualify I don’t know what does!
Dang, Casey! You didn't just hit the bullseye here. You hit three straight triple twenties.
The Weird: Tracy Smothers vs Kintaro Kanemura
When I request "no WWE or NXT" I DEFINITELY don't mean "No fan cams of house show matches from 1999
It's the insane production "values" and dehumanizing corporate-speak that I am desperate to avoid. That stuff brings out seriously negative feelings in my heart. THIS, on the other hand, is damned near the polar opposite and it sparks nothing but joy for me.
It's an absolute nothing of a match. Eight minutes of OK action, leading to a satisfying clean finish. With Tommy Rich wedged in because presumably a former NWA champion still had some drawing power in that part of America at that point in history. The local Vancouver indie used to bring in Jimmy Snuka to try and draw a few extra eyes, after local TV shut down in the mid-80s. but most people didn't believe it was really him. One of my friends took a Superfly Splash and swears it was the stiffest thing he ever felt in a wrestling ring. Anyway, Rich and his beer gut trying to find something to do during the match is enough reason for joy.
But the real joy comes from Tracy Smothers and Kanemura each doing the one thing that they do best. With Smothers, it's jack-jawing with the crowd and flipping double birds and just 100% being the MAXIMUM touring veteran heel journeyman there to show the young boys how it's done. And with Kanemura it's recklessly hurling around his dumpy body (in his goofy ring gear) and either crushing his opponent or badly hurting himself. Also trying to sneak out a win with a quick roll-up. And it's just that and nothing else for eight minutes. And it's glorious. What a weird match-up indeed, and it goes EXACTLY how you'd expect, exactly how it should.
The Interesting: Great Muta vs The Gladiator
I am pretty sure these two guys could also have a pretty great 8-minute match where they both stick to the things they do well. This match is NOT that. I also think they could have pulled of a "poor man's Hansen vs Kobashi" type of Kings Road match; but I guess, based on this one match, that 2003 was during a time when Mutoh tried to change AJPW into a style like the Fire Pro version of New Japan Strong Style, where you HAVE TO start out with several minutes of mat wrestling and limb work before getting to the high flying and big bombs? And, oh boy, Muta and Gladiator are NOT suited to several minutes of mat wrestling and limb work. Awesome looks completely lost more than once in the early going. Eventually they meander into the "OK, enough of that, let's go!" portion of the match and it gets GLORIOUSLY interesting. Muta hits a bunch of crazy Shining Wizard variations, including one off the back of one of the dudes at ringside (which leads to Awesome doing a blood-spurting blade-job) and a couple more while Gladiator is sitting on the top turnbuckle. And Awesome out-does Kintaro Kanemura by absolutely heaving himself on a dive to the outside where he over-shoots Muta, who does nothing to catch or protect him. Then Awesome totally botches an attempt at a top rope powerbomb (or something) and Muta spits the mist into his bloodied face with absolute contempt.
This is a legitimately TERRIBLE match, full of sound and fury signifying nothing, and I really had a good time watching it. No fooling. There was a bunch of stuff that legitimately popped me, and it got me thinking about wrestling nostalgia in a way I'll try to sum up at the end of this (already too long) post.
The Violent: Megumi Kudo vs Combat Toyoda
I think this match should be required viewing for all Death Match wrestlers.
In a 2020 Secret Santo, I was given the Kudo vs Kandori barbed wire match, and my thoughts then were pretty similar. Maybe all pro wrestlers should study some Megumi Kudo matches. Kudo vs Shinobu Kandori might be the best barbed wire match, and THIS might be the actual Best Exploding Whatever Death Match. Ever.
It's obvious, but it's true: There are only four big explosion/wire spots in the whole match, but each one is EARNED, each one is BUILT TO, and so each one is INVESTED WITH MEANING.
It's a legitimately GREAT match, like the Nakano tag that Curt gave me. There are moments that are hard to watch and moments that are legitimately moving, and moments that are BOTH OF THOSE THINGS SIMULTANEOUSLY.
Examples:
Moving: It's Toyoda's retirement match. Both competitors talk about that before the match and it's subtitled, so we can all get goosebumps. Toyoda comes out to WILD THING, to honour Atsushi Onita. During the match, the camera cuts to Onita several times, and he is clearly overwhelmed with emotion.
Hard to watch: Even more than the explosions, even more than both women bleeding heavily from their upper arms... the last two big head drops that end the match are just as nasty as it gets.
Both, simultaneously: The fourth and final explosion/wire spot is Kudo leaping backward into Toyoda's arms and both women tumbling into a huge explosion, together.
In the aftermath, both women are selling like they are on death's doorstep. Kudo gets carried out on a stretcher. Onita carries Toyoda out on his shoulders so the crowd can show their appreciation for all she has given them. She collapses at Onita's feet.
The match is also structured perfectly and each woman plays her role perfectly. But it the combination of violence and emotion that makes this match a true classic.
It's too tough to sum up my thoughts on nostalgia succinctly. I'll try to do a deep dive in the Navel Gazing thread eventually.
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Casey, after really getting into the Bull tag that Curt gave me in Week One, I wanna take advantage of getting paired with our resident Bull Nakano Expert this week, and get your informed opinion on one of these sub-30-minute Nakano title matches. 100% your choice, which one, whether it's one you know well and have strong opinions on or one you are somehow not yet familiar with. I would just like to read your take.
For me, I prefer a weird, interesting, or violent match to a Meltzer/Keith *****+ "great" match, but really any non-WWE, non-NXT YouTube wrestling video you think I might enjoy or you'd like my take on would be fine, please & thank you.
Now that's a bunch of Bull!
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11 hours ago, Infinit said:
That's so cool!
Going to Japan and having beers with @Gordi the former AEW fan is near the top of my bucket list
There have been at least three people from here or SC or PWO who have made it out to Osaka for drinks and wrestling and it was ALWAYS a GREAT time. Ohtani's Jacket, who helped me out with advice when I was moving here, The Cobra 2, who has become one of my closest friends in real life, and Dangerous A, who co-wrote the EXCELLENT Scott Norton book and who came over with the Osaka Holiday Paradise crew. I am probably forgetting somebody obvious, too. There have been a LOT of wrestling/drinking parties over the past 14 years.
Of course it's fun to hang out and talk wrestling, etc, with fellow wrestling nerds. But,so far, it's always been even more fun than you'd imagine. And so far my Japanese wrestling friends have always gotten along with and enjoyed meeting my gaijin wrestling friends. And I'd love to keep that streak going.
I imagine we'd have a great time, Infinit.
Really, if anyone who can drink without being a dick makes it out to Osaka/Kyoto/Nara and wants to hang, send me a pm. Preferably well ahead of time. (If you don't drink, wrestling and food might still be do-able).
Sadly, Osaka Pro no longer runs daily shows, so there's no guarantee...
There are shows almost every day in Tokyo, but it's generally too far and too expensive for me. Will probably head there for a G1 final or Dome or Budokan show one day. And a Korakuen show is 100% on my bucket list.
Anyway, the invitation is open, and sincere.
(at Bodybar with Cobra 2)
10 hours ago, Curt McGirt said:1. Sick Kingston shirt
2. Can you explain Japanese style Chinese food? I get the feeling you have before but refresh my memory. (Then again, I'm only familiar with American-style Chinese food, which tends to be a bunch of thick gloppy corn starch-based sauces on fried meats)
Japanese style Chinese food might be my single favourite genre of food. Generally it's not deep fried, and generally there are no gloopy gloppy sauces. Though, the two pictures I posted are of deep fried chicken and tofu in gloppy spicy sauce
The spice is a lot milder than "real" Chinese food, and the dishes are lighter than American style. The sauces are never overly sugary. Fried gyoza (potstickers/dumplings) fried rice, shrimp in (mild) chili sauce, tan tan men (spicy sesame taste noodle soup) and shredded beef with green peppers and onions are all mainstays.
And I was REALLY happy they had that shirt in my size.
Might be fun to go to Oshyo Gyoza or Kemuri and Flower one day with a DVDVR crew!
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Another excellent bonenkai (year-end party) all you can drink and Japanese style Chinese food, with my old drinking buddy Asian Coogar and a bar-full of friends. Including some wrestlers, like Tachibana, Moriya (ex-FUCK, whom I met at the Nepalese rooftop BBQ party), and Taiyoto Kamen (whom I maybe last drank with at A-Toys MMA bar in 2015). It's always great to see everyone and I was very happy to hear my name shouted out joyfully again and again, by my old drinking friends. The food was excellent, the beer and umeshu flowed like wine, three hours passed like ten minutes. I am one lucky prick. Also, the Gee! Store around the corner from the back-alley party location had a neato t-shirt in my size.
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That was pretty close to my Platonic ideal of an hour of AEW television. Thanks for throwing me a bone, AEW! It's been a while since I felt like you booked a show specifically for me and nerds like me.
A Dragon main event is an ideal main event. A stiff nasty intense Dragon fight against a guy who can really go is a level above ideal. That was gorgeous. Exceeded my ridiculously high expectations.
And we also got an Abadon match! And they were fighting someone with an indie/Japan background!
One tiny niggle: usually I am pretty good at seeing the threads that connect two wrestlers. For example, Mercedes Martinez vs Willow Nightingale is Car vs Tree, which makes sense since sometimes cars hit trees. But Spooky Witch vs Undead Zombie? I am struggling to find any connection there.
A speed/agility vs size/power match! Plus, toss in a Japanese guy! Right up my alley.
And, yeah, I'm with Curt. That opening match was tremendously enjoyable. Is it possible Cassidy has grown into being the third-best seller among AEW's male wrestlers? Dragon and Mad King are in class of their own right now. Morton/Kikuchi/Yamazaki/Xavier Woods tier. But Orange was tremendous today.
I LOVE how they are showing the attrition of the competitors in the C2. I think Orange paved the path there, in AEW, selling the cumulative damage of his many title defences.
LOVED Daddy and Rick a Boney on commentary today!
Was overjoyed that it was pretty much all wrestling and ZERO overwrought Sports Entertainment on today's show.
And tonight, it's the annual year-end all-you-can-drink plus Chinese food party in Deep Osaka Namba with Cooger and about 40 of our friends! So, a pretty good day of wrestling for ole Gordlow here. An early Christmas present, if you weel.
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10
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A Sincere and Well-Intended Open Letter to AEW
in ALL ELITE WRESTLING
Posted · Edited by Gordi the former AEW fan
So true! And I have some time to kill right now (my family is busy flying kites at grandma's house in Wakayama, where they didn't even feel the earthquake. Meanwhile, I was in the gym here when it hit. Thankfully myself and the only other guy there were both between sets when it hit. Whole building was SHAKING. Could have been seriously injured if either of us was under a heavy load. By coincidence, his family lives in Niigata, near the epicentre. He called them and they were all OK in the immediate aftermath. I am afraid to look online and read about tsunami damage).
Let's talk about the game! That'll be a fine distraction.
I am going to go through the whole roster, looking at their status w/r/t Fight Forever. Also commenting on how fun it is to play with their character in game. Which will totally reveal my biases, none of which should be surprising.
As massively, wholeheartedly disappointed I am in how AEW/Yukes/Whomever is handling adding new content to Pay Forever I still enjoy the game a lot in terms of just playing matches to kill time on the train or whatever.
MJF: NOT on the roster page! In the game. VERY fun to play with due to unique beg-off and ring-punch animations.
Samoa Joe: World Champion. NOT in the game. BUT they did add two-colour shorts to the game! So it may be possible to make a Joe CAW that slightly resembles him if you squint, now. Sadly, I suspect the reason that the CAW suite is completely ass is that they want to force people to buy their downloadable characters. Which is too "Late Stage Capitalism" for this particular grandpa, and a big part of why I changed my user name here.
Toni Storm: Woman's World Champion. Looks like you'll be able to pay extra to download her soon. Also looks a LOT like the paid downloadable Toni Storm will NOT be Timeless Toni Storm but will be at least a year out of date.
Julia Hart: TBS champion. NOT in the game.
Big Bill: Tag Champ. NOT in the game.
Ricky Starks: Tag Champ. Actually in the game! Social media in-game is @starkmanjones, which tickles me.
Orange Cassidy: International Champ. One of the best things about the game due to unique "sloth style" animations which you can also use for CAWs by earning points in Story Mode. Which is fun, to have, say, Misawa do hands in pockets stuff.
Christian: TNT Champ. Actually in the game. No turtleneck, though
The Acclaimed: Trios Champs. You have to pay extra to download them. Also, if you pay for them you get a (pretty bad) version of the new Dynamite arena. If you only paid full price for Fight Forever, you don't get the new arena. Count me among the people who like AEW way less because of that bullshit move.
Daddy Ass: Trios Champ. NOT in the game.
Eddie Kingston: Triple Crown Champion. My favourite guy to play as. Second wrestler and first guy I completed the "defeat 50 COM opponents" challenge with. You get 10,000 "AEW cash" for beating that challenge! I now have, quite literally, over 7,000,000 AEW cash in the game with literally NOTHING left to spend it on. That's not a joke. Which is, figuratively, a fucking joke. Also none of his three belts are available in the game. Backfist is his only finisher in the game, sadly. He also only gets one special move. Kind of underpowered.
Hook: FTW Champ. You have to pay extra to download him. I imagine he'd be really fun to play as. Word is, you don't get his actual theme. I might be tempted to buy the Hookhausen pack if you did.
Aaron Solo, Action Andretti: Not in the game.
Adam Cole: In the game. Has a unique entrance. Fun to play against.
Edge: Not in the game. Fine by me.
Adam Page: In the game. It's fun to try and hit the Buckshot.
Alex Reynolds: Not in the game. (Henceforth: NITG or nitg)
Andrade: In the game! Not even the most ironic one, by far.
Angelico, Cool Hand, Ogogo, AR Fox, Ari, Austin Gunn, Bandido, Kaun, Cutler: NITG
Brian Cage: Fun to play as. Fun to play against.
Brody King is NOT in the game. Dammit. Neither is Buddy Matthews.
Bryan Danielson: EXTREMELY fun to play as. Also one of the best things about the game. There's a secret challenge where if you wen the men's world title 20 times with a wrestler you unlock nifty gold attire. So I did 40 title matches alternating Bryan/Kingston wins and unlocked it for both of them. Then Dustin/Sting Orange/Darby Archer/Hobbs... Then I did it with Shida/Stat and the woman's title but that didn't unlock anything. So I did another series with them alternating men's title wins. Then Yukes or someone screwed up the implementation of that secret challenge so they just unlocked gold attires for everyone. Which maybe should have been frustrating but it was a fun way to kill time on the train so no big deal.
FTR: Have to pay extra.
Jericho: Fun to play as. Got some new attires for free! It's pretty obviously pre-strict-diet Jericho, which is kind of amusing.
Fallen Angel, Colt, Colten, Claudio: NITG. I made a half-decent Claudio CAW. He's fun to play as.
Best Friends: Fun to play as, though the tag AI is total ass. Trent got a free haircut update! He's, I think, the ONLY character with more than one haircut option. More of that, please! Abadon could really use a hairdo update, for example.
Danhausen: See: Hook.
Daniel Garcia is NOT in the game. Dammit.
Top Flight: NITG
Darby: In the game. Great fun to play as. Skateboard stuff is really amusing. Also one of the true highlights of playing this game.
Dralistico: NITG
Dustin: Tremendously fun to play as Dustin.
Righteous, All Ego, Griff, Private Party: NITG
EVIL UNO IS NOT IN THE GAME EVEN THOUGH HE HELPED CREATE AND PROMOTE IT
Jack Perry: Jungle Boy is in the game. Out of date, but fun to play as. JE have a great tag team entrance animation.
Hager, Lethal, Switchblade Jarrett, Johnny TV: NITG
Hardyz: Jeff is free, you have to pay extra for Matt. And the game CONSTANTLY gives you challenges where you have to play as Matt. I
John Silver: VERY fun to play as. You can unlock Brodie Lee. I made a DO team and gave them the JE entrance with Silver riding in on Brodie's shoulders. It makes me smile every time, which is not often because the tag AI is, sadly, total ass.
Oh yeah: JADE CARGILL IS IN THE GAME
She is fun to play as, AWESOME to play against. Still not the most ironic one.
CODY AND PUNK ARE BOTH IN THE GAME!! Those are the most ironic ones. Both of them get special entrance animations. I used Cody's for my Rey Rey CAW. Who's that slowly rising from the stage? It's likely I am a shitty person, because I LOVE playing against Punk in Lights Out and Exploding Barbed Wire matches and making him bleed buckets. Possibly that's the very best thing about the game, in my book.
And, yes, the game still challenges you to win matches as Punk or Jade. Regularly.
If I remember correctly, you also have to unlock Cody. Which was one of the first things I did after getting the game. You can also unlock Owen, which is pretty great. His character is a BLAST to play as. Violent Dustin vs Cody blood matches are also as fun as you'd expect (if you expect they'd be very fun).
Mox: Cool special entrance, which my Claudio CAW also uses. Fun to play as or against.
Jose, Woods, Juice, Shibata: NITG
Kenny: AWESOME to play as. Has a ton of finishers and special moves. Spamming Snap Dragons is an easy way to rack up high scores. Big contrast between overpowered Kenny and underpowered Kingston, but both are great to play as.
You have to pay extra for Limitless, dammit. I made a decent CAW for him. SUCK IT, PAY FOREVER! For WHATEVER reason he is bundled in a download with The Bunny.
Killswitch: Luchasaurus is in the game. And we got a FREE black outfit for him.
Kip, Komander, Konosuke, Kota, KO'R, Aussie Open: NITG. I made an EXCELLENT Ibushi CAW. There are a handful of guys where obviously they don't mind if you want to make a CAW of them. Ibushi is one of those guys. You can even put kinesio tape on his shoulder! Incredibly fun to play as Ibushi. Made a Golden Lovers team. Too bad about the AI.
Archer: Great fun to play as.
Big Shotty, Tiga Style, Luther: NITG. It might tempt me if we got Luther in the Toni Storm pack, but as I said it does not look like we are getting Timeless Toni.
Malakai: In the game. Fun to beat up on. His theme music rules!
Mark Briscoe is NITG, dammit!
Neither is Mark Sterling.
Young Bucks: Very Fun. I think I have already covered the tag AI issues. Their double team moves look amazing when you manage to hit one.
Daddy Magic, Kingdom, Sydal, Nakazawa, Santana,Ortiz: NITG
Miro: Fun to play as or against. Seems shorter, in the game. Looks great in the gold gear.
Brodie Lee: Unlockable. Makes me happy and sad at the same time, to play as him.
Negative One and Nicky Boy are NITG, dammit!
PAC is fun to play as or against.
Parker Boudreaux is NITG. HUGE dealbreaker for a lot of people, obviously.
The Big Paul is unlockable and it's hard to unlock him and satisfying when you do. Too much fun to play as him in Casino Battle Royale mode.
Lucha Bros: See: Young Bucks. Fenix in ladder matches is too much fun. Unfortunately, tag ladder matches aren't possible
PRETTY PETER IS NITG! WTF, AEW & YUKES! DO YOU HATE MONEY?!?!
Hobbs is underpowered but awesome to play as, like Kingston. Looks amazing in the gold gear. Still has the Team Tazz look in the game.
I made a good Preston Vance CAW. You can find CAW formulae online. Most of them are at least OK.
Neither Swerve nor Nana are in the game.
QT, Roddy: NITG. QT is still on the roster page.
Roosh: NITG. Dammit.
Sammy is in the game but he has a RIDICULOUS haircut. It's bad enough that I almost never use him.
Satnam, Serp, Sonjay, The Captain, Stoke, Stu, Butcher, Blade, Toa, Nese: NITG
Scorp is fun. I got my first seven-star match in a Lights Out match with him.
Sting is awesome!
Wardlow has lots of singlet options. Not sure why, but he isn't that fun to play as. He's challenging to play against, as are many big meaty men because of the Unyielding Poise skill which makes them impervious to strikes until you wear them down. It's one of the best skills to give your CAWs! Wardy still has the man-bun in-game
Yuta and Ospreay are NITG. Yet.
Abadon is one of my favourite wrestlers to play as. They could use an image update, in the game. Still have red hair here.
ANNA! is in the game. Dark Order colours.
You can unlock Aubrey as a wrestler and she's also a ref. I think you can make her ref her own match, but I don't want to check now. Rick Knox is the other ref.
Athena and Emi are NITG, dammit!
Britt has some of the best attires in the game. Winning with the lockjaw is satisfying.
Diamante, Harley: NITG
Shida is the first wrestler I beat the 50-win challenge with. Unfortunately, her Katana finisher is hopelessly glitched. They said they patched it, but it still doesn't land on Switch. Still has her FAR superior old entrance theme here.
HAYTER IS NITG, DAMMIT! Neither is Kierra.
Stat is GREAT to play as. Still an alien, too! And she does the nose boop!
Neither Leyla nor Leila is in the game. Hirsch's excellent theme music is, though.
Madison, Maria, Mercedes, Marina: NITG
Nyla is really fun to play as. Hitting the draping diving knee drop is satisfying.
PVZ: NITG
Penelope, Rebel, Velvet: NITG
Riho and Ruby are both fun enough to play as or against.
Saraya, Serena, Skye: NITG
Tay is VERY fun to play against.
Taya & Saraya: NITG. Fine by me.
Rosa is fun to play as or against. Violent blood matches between her and Britt are fun.
WILLOW IS NOT IN THE GAME!!! DAMMIT!!!
Magical Girl is BY FAR the most fun wrestler to play as! THE best thing about the game.
The other at-least OK CAWS I have been able to make: Eddie Guerrero, Naito, Shinsuke, Okada, Jeff Cobb, WALTER, Sheamus, Abdullah, Hansen, Brody, MVC, Bulldogs, Harts, ZSJ, Ospreay, and Morishima.
I also made deliberately weak CAWS of Hogan, HHH, HBK, and Orton to beat up on when there's a hard difficulty challenge, or just for shadenfreude and giggles.
Lights Out matches are the easiest way to crank out high scores. Particularly if you use the thumbtacks.