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JonnyLaw

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    [WWE NETWORK] What Are You Watching?

    in WWE PROGRAMMING

    Posted

    I think this is another sign of the divide between the olds and the whippersnappers: people watching this stuff for the first time and seeing guys like Credible show up as jobbers. I wonder if they know about Aldo Montoya yet. I can't wait for them to see the scrawny ass Hardys as jobbers.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    People are actually faulting Bryan for having the crowd eating out of the palm of his hand.

    If only Bryan didn't have to carry the company on his back for the last 8 months and routinely wrestle twice in one night in captivating matches. Being lower down the card would have afforded him the opportunity to drop in to NXT to wrestle the Regals and Zayns of the world and this voting could look a lot different.

    It isn't faulting him for being over, it just isn't accepting that as proof of being better than Cesaro.

    Also, If I've read mookie's stuff right, Bryan isn't really carrying the company.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    This is what I initially responded to:

    I see the point when people say cesaro is less formulaic etc. but wrestling is best viewed live - people see bryan do the run the ropes -> duck clothesline -> tope sequence on tv, then when wwe is in town they see it live and pop in recognition. All of them.

    This also went on to say that while Cesaro was a better "mechanic", Bryan was unquestionably the star.

    Something being over does not mean it is good, which is where I was going with my reductio ad absurdum. Hogan was unquestionably the bigger star, but would he win over Flair or Macho? No. I find it ironic that many (obviously not all) vocal Bryan supporters are unironically pointing to his position on the card and level of overness as if that was some sort of conclusive proof of de facto greatness. To play armchair shrink, it is almost as if they're getting some sort of personal validation from saying "See, this guy that we touted forever as the best is finally getting recognized by the masses! I was right all along!"

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    No, your argument was "They see Bryan's formulaic comeback on TV, so they when they go to shows, they pop in recognition."  The same thing applied to my examples, as well as stuff like Mick Foley's "Right here, in cheap popsville" schtick or Rock telling someone to stick something up their ass.  

     

    Compare that with the Cesaro Swing.  He sets that up and the crowd pops, because they recognize what is about to happen.  However, it doesn't always happen right away.  Sometimes the person escapes or if it is a tag match, the partner makes a save.  Cesaro builds up the crowd's anticipation for it so that when he finally hits it, it means something.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

     I see the point when people say cesaro is less formulaic etc. but wrestling is best viewed live - people see bryan do the run the ropes -> duck clothesline -> tope sequence on tv, then when wwe is in town they see it live and pop in recognition. All of them.

     

     I see the point when people say cesaro is less formulaic etc. but wrestling is best viewed live - people see bryan scotty 2 hotty rikishi new age outlaws hogan do the run the ropes -> duck clothesline -> tope sequence worm stinkface dX introduction hulk up on tv, then when wwe is in town they see it live and pop in recognition. All of them.

    DVDVR MARCH MADNESS '14: GLOBAL WARFARE

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    Retiring Bryan from our best wrestler tournament because too many people think he's the best wrestler is probably the worst idea I've ever heard. All you'd be doing is setting up a paper champion. LEGITIMACY is the only thing holding March Madness together.

     

    It's less that and more an acknowledgment of his awesomeness, along with recognition that everyone else is playing for second place.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    Some of these arguments are fundamentally circumstantial, and apples-to-oranges.  Cesaro Bryan gets points for not wrestling against stale main event guys/wrestling against other board favorites on NXT, and now he's getting points for what essentially amounts to a lack of exposure.  We've watched Bryan Punk wrestle every week for a year, usually in the main event slot because he's the best, and therefore are completely aware of what he brings to the table.  But Cesaro Bryan is still developing in the main event singles match roll and thus his matches have more capacity for surprise.

     

     

    Said by a CM Punk voter last year.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

     

    If this poll's a rockin, don't come a knockin!

     

    Voting for mah boy D-Bry. I think his best matches were better than Cesaro's, he won the Being John Cena title, worked important matches all year long, convinced a Bella to marry him, AND the "YES" chant went mainstream.

     

    Sums it nicely for me. I was for Bryan winning 2011-2013, it would be something if he doesn't win in his best year.

     

     

    What about this past year makes it better than previous years?  What did he improve upon?  What is he doing now that he didn't do before?    If it is all about the push, then CM Punk should have won in years past, and I'm saying this as someone who voted for Bryan over Punk (I think).

     

    Can a Cesaro voter please direct me to an effective Cesaro promo?

     

    Or a match outside of the Zayn series or Cena matches where he made you care?

     

    Come on, this is just lazy.  Read the threads, as a bunch have been mentioned.  There's the Regal match mentioned, the Kofi match, his Orton match (which I honestly liked better than Bryan's Orton match).  The Regal promo was great, as was his work with Saxton leading up to it.  His promos with Zayn in NXT good.  The clip where he interviewed the NAO that was posted in a prior thread was great.

     

    Plus, pointing to his good matches with Cena as if that is a given lessens the impact of what many people feel was Bryan's best match.  

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    2. He is the best hot tag in wrestling, best comeback in wrestling and best underdog in wrestling.  Cesaro hasn't been put in those spots just yet, but Bryan doesn't get all the cool heel cut off stuff either (which was my favorite thing about Bryan Danielson back in the day).

     

    4.  RUNNING CORNER DROPKICK > EURO UPPERCUT.

     

    Bryan is not an underdog anymore.  The whole weak link storyline was built up as him thinking he was the underdog (much like his followers are doing now) when everyone else knew that wasn't the case.

    Also, they started RAW last night by positioning HHH as the underdog in his match against Daniel Bryan.  Let that sink in for a minute.

     

     

    We are the DVDVR board. We know what wrestling is. It's not something you watch while sipping tea and wearing a top hat. 

     

    Speak for yourself.  I watch wrestling while wearing nothing but a top hat.

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    The HHH/Authority angle, from start to finish, is one of the most satisfying 6+ month storylines in a long, long time.

     

    Daniel Bryan also won the WWE Championship TWICE in the voting period.

     

    He has all the momentum in the world right now and is heading toward one of the ALL TIME biggest pops in the history of the WWE at the end of WrestleMania XXX.

     

    Cesaro, while fucking amazing, is going to have a strong showing in a battle royale.  That's ultimately what we're comparing here.  Cesaro is a good hand, with a lot of potential, but he's a B+ player.  In all seriousness, he's going to be a frontrunner coming into the 2014 voting period (whether Bryan is eligible next year or not), but he's not there yet.  

     

     

    #1 - I've used some hyperbole in my posts, but nothing like saying Bryan's story has been one of the most satisfying 6+ month storylines in a long, long time.  Come on.  It has been a horribly disjointed storyline that is likely to end up with a very satisfying payoff at WM, but it is also seemingly only happening because CM Punk left.  Don't forget the "storyline" somehow had Bryan getting penciled in against Shemus.

     

    #2 - Using Bryan's place on the card as an argument for him is laughable, since he won the past two years against CM Punk, who was even higher on the card than Bryan is now.  Compared to those finals, Cesaro is the one in the Bryan role, and Bryan is in the Punk role.  

    DVDVRMM: THE FINALS~! BRYAN vs. CESARO

    in 2014 MARCH MADNESS (Archive)

    Posted

    It IS on Cesaro that he was only able to get over by using a face spot.  The dude has worked as a heel all year to mediocre heat at best.  

     

    Bryan won last year.  The whole 18 seconds thing at Wrestlemania thing happened when he was a heel.  He couldn't get over as a heel and but still won last year.  Shouldn't hurt Cesaro this year.

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