Double or Nothing IV - 5/29/2022

[John from Cincinnati]

Moving to another topic, we go to CM Punk hyping the main event:

 

Edited May 29, 2022 by John from Cincinnati

[NoFistsJustFlips]

1 hour ago, Matt D said:

I mean, 1991 babyface Greg Valentine was pretty awesome too:

But it's still more DVDVR awesome than random wrestling fan off the street awesome, so I was putting in some level of distinction there for the guy whose name sort of gives him away and that didn't seem to want to do the legwork. I'm sure as a 9-10 year old in 91-92 I didn't have a lot of use for Valentine either, but then I grew up.

Had a whole thing typed up trying to state my case, but I'm gonna go another way with it lol. If you can find a Prime Time Wrestling match from that era where heel Greg Valentine does more than chin locks & boot stomps I'll give it a go with fresh eyes. But he's got a whole lot to overcome to change my opinion. Including quite a few times of witnessing the dude be a straight up prick to kids he was working on indy shows.

[BrianS81177]

46 minutes ago, Stefanie the Human said:

He struck me more as prime Black Bart, and I mean that as a tremendous compliment.

Great. Now I want to see a promo with Drake yelling "dadgum" about 40 times. Thanks a lot Stefanie.

[EVA]

I guess if I had to give my final wager, I’d say that if MJF is still in Vegas, then it’s very likely they’ll work out a deal for him to appear on the show tonight. However, I think it’s also very likely this will be the last you see of him in AEW for quite some time, possibly ever. You just can’t build anything else around him until this is settled and everybody is happy again, if stunts like this are on the table now.

Edited May 29, 2022 by EVA

[Wyld Samurai]

4 minutes ago, EVA said:

I guess if I had to give my final wager, I’d say that if MJF is still in Vegas, then it’s very likely they’ll work out a deal for him to appear on the show tonight. However, I think it’s also very likely this will be the last you see of him in AEW for quite some time, possibly ever. You just can’t build anything else around him until this is settled and everybody is happy again, if stunts like this are on the table now.

Jeff Jarrett approves this message.

[John from Cincinnati]

21 minutes ago, John from Cincinnati said:

The MJF-Wardlow preview package is private on Youtube. 

Update: They took it down. 

[Matt D]

9 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Had a whole thing typed up trying to state my case, but I'm gonna go another way with it lol. If you can find a Prime Time Wrestling match from that era where heel Greg Valentine does more than chin locks & boot stomps I'll give it a go with fresh eyes. But he's got a whole lot to overcome to change my opinion. Including quite a few times of witnessing the dude be a straight up prick to kids he was working on indy shows.

If you do a chinlock and boot stomp well enough, why would you ever, ever need to do anything else? It’s not what you do, it’s how you do it and how you use it and the story you can tell with it. There’s no middle ground to be found here between you and I, I’m afraid. But I’m happy to move on to the issue at hand. 

[John from Cincinnati]

Meltzer is reporting that as of a few minutes ago, MJF wasn't at the building.

[Kevin Wilson]

TK going to use this as an excuse to delay the whole PPV until after the basketball game ends. Start time is now Midnight.

[Web Conn]

2 minutes ago, John from Cincinnati said:

Meltzer is reporting that as of a few minutes ago, MJF wasn't at the building.

Im telling ya’ll Sabu no showed Three Way Dance in 95 cuz he time traveled to today cuz he had something to do and that’s put Wardlow over.

[Craig H]

1 minute ago, Kevin Wilson said:

TK going to use this as an excuse to delay the whole PPV until after the basketball game ends. Start time is now Midnight.

It’ll be like watching NJPW shows live.

[The Natural]

5 minutes ago, Kevin Wilson said:

TK going to use this as an excuse to delay the whole PPV until after the basketball game ends. Start time is now Midnight.

Edited May 29, 2022 by The Natural

[Wyld Samurai]

20 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

Had a whole thing typed up trying to state my case, but I'm gonna go another way with it lol. If you can find a Prime Time Wrestling match from that era where heel Greg Valentine does more than chin locks & boot stomps I'll give it a go with fresh eyes. But he's got a whole lot to overcome to change my opinion. Including quite a few times of witnessing the dude be a straight up prick to kids he was working on indy shows.

Oh dude. Valentine vs Ronnie Garvin. It's the beeeeessssstttt.

[The Natural]

Feel for the fans and more than anyone, Wardlow if MJF doesn't show up. I don't think he does.

[NoFistsJustFlips]

6 minutes ago, Matt D said:

If you do a chinlock and boot stomp well enough, why would you ever, ever need to do anything else? It’s not what you do, it’s how you do it and how you use it and the story you can tell with it. There’s no middle ground to be found here between you and I, I’m afraid. But I’m happy to move on to the issue at hand. 

There's nothing special or expert about Valentine's chinlocks or boot stomps. Listen I get having exceptional skills and staying in that lane because it's something you excel at. For example all of Lawler's best work are built around his incredible punches and his selling. That's only two things just like Chinlocks & boot stomps in this analogy. But Lawler was creative.. Lawler would give you interesting and new lead ins to spots around his big punches. Valentine was doing those two things not because he did them any better than anyone else, he spammed those two things because he was lazy and creatively bankrupt.

And we may just not agree on this one. That's okay. People can have different opinions and all that. But I just don't rate laziness and lack of creativity high on my scale of work.

[The Natural]

We need a vintage Tony Khan huge announcement!

Edited May 29, 2022 by The Natural

[Wyld Samurai]

4 minutes ago, The Natural said:

We need a vintage Tony Khan huge announcement!

Just as long as he's off his Adderall. He's so kuch more entertaining off his meds.

[The Natural]

 

[MoeCristyV.1.6]

MJF vs Wardlow main events, after Wardlow makes his entrance, the lights go out. End. 

[John from Cincinnati]

3 minutes ago, MoeCristyV.1.6 said:

MJF vs Wardlow main events, after Wardlow makes his entrance, the lights go out. End. 

Credits don't roll right away. Don't stop believing. 

[Ultimo Necro]

I’ve learned more about contract law via MJF and Wardlow than I ever did working in a law office all these years.

[HarryArchieGus]

8 minutes ago, MoeCristyV.1.6 said:

MJF vs Wardlow main events, after Wardlow makes his entrance, the lights go out. End. 

Still better than most of the booking ideas I'm seeing thrown around. Meltzer's throw him in the Main Event and have win the title is worse than most. I'm partial to a spoof of the Twin Peaks Season 2 finale in which Wardlow smashes his head into a mirror, laughs, and says 'where's Maxy?'

[Octopus]

1 minute ago, HarryArchieGus said:

Still better than most of the booking ideas I'm seeing thrown around. Meltzer's throw him in the Main Event and have win the title is worse than most. I'm partial to a spoof of the Twin Peaks Season 2 finale in which Wardlow smashes his head into a mirror, laughs, and says 'where's Maxy?'

This is how you bring in Bray Wyatt. Through Lynchian storytelling. 

[Matt D]

30 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

There's nothing special or expert about Valentine's chinlocks or boot stomps. Listen I get having exceptional skills and staying in that lane because it's something you excel at. For example all of Lawler's best work are built around his incredible punches and his selling. That's only two things just like Chinlocks & boot stomps in this analogy. But Lawler was creative.. Lawler would give you interesting and new lead ins to spots around his big punches. Valentine was doing those two things not because he did them any better than anyone else, he spammed those two things because he was lazy and creatively bankrupt.

And we may just not agree on this one. That's okay. People can have different opinions and all that. But I just don't rate laziness and lack of creativity high on my scale of work.

I grabbed (and uploaded for you; but it'll probably get taken down soon) a random match with Roger Kent and Billy Graham announcing during a random Challenge taping in 88. This is nothing I think I've ever seen before as most Tito vs Valentine matches I've seen are from 87 or earlier. It's a PTW though, as it's bookended by Monsoon and Heenan. He starts the match by getting heat by jawing with the ref about his shinguard that he used to cripple Graham. Then he immediately recoils from Santana and then tries to discount it by screwing with his hair. Then it's right into an arm wringer/wristlock and right to the ropes. More heat. He makes sure to sell the hand after the fact. Tito follows up with an immediate single leg and goes for the shinguard and Valentine spasms all over the place to the ropes and complains.

Then it's time for him to get some stuff so it's a cheapshot knee out of nowhere, some great elbows to the skull and an attempt at chinlock, but it's Santana and we're still in the extended shine so he turns it into a hammerlock and it's back to the ropes for Valentine, getting more heat since he can't escape fairly. Again, he sells the arm and then begs off. He goes for a kick, Santana catches it and he eats some punches and bumps back big and rolls out to stall and get some more heat, looking this way and that to the crowd and having the ref back Tito off, before running around him like he's about to fight. Tito just demolishes him in the corner and they go to break.

We come back to Tito beating the crap out of Valentine, including with a neck whip Perfect style and then a great chinlock that they really work with Valentine flopping around like a fish and Tito gritting his teeth. This has been all Tito so far, but Valentine finally catches him off the ropes. This next section is about Tito ALMOST coming back, which we believe since he was able to during the shine. Valentine misses an axehandle off top to a grounded Tito but he's right back in with a kick. Tito reverses a whip but Valentine gets right out of the way. Then he pulls him out and lays in these great great shots and elbows on the apron. Tito fires back from the apron though and we go right into the finish with Jimmy on the apron during the figure four attempt and Valentine getting Tito from behind, but Muraco coming in to prevent Valentine from getting the figure four (with the shin guard on). Tons of creativity here. Tons of imagination. Selling both while in holds and after them. Some nasty looking shots when he did get to be on top, though it was a lot of stooging overall. He gave Tito a ton. He did a lot. Yes, this was 88 instead of 89, and yes it was Tito, but come on.

Edited May 29, 2022 by Matt D

[John from Cincinnati]

6 minutes ago, Octopus said:

This is how you bring in Bray Wyatt. Through Lynchian storytelling. 

Bray doing spooky swamp BS on a wrestling show: “What year is this?” *lights flicker, high-pitch shriek*