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December 2021 Wrestling Discussion


Kang

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18 hours ago, just drew said:

What have you seen from them in the last year that suggests guys ARE doing more than the minimum?

Ok ok... shit on WWE and the company all anyone wants, but acting like the workers aren't busting ass is just false and pushing a bullshit narrative to prop up the "Burn it to the ground" desire this board had.

 

WWE has a lot of problems, the talent and their "workrate" ain't one of them and it's bullshit to put the issues on them.

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2 hours ago, MonteCarl said:

Took my 7 year old to the WWE House Show last night. He had such a great time, which means I did too. Here's a highlight video of the night, for those interested

 

 

AaaaaaaaDORABLE!

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1 hour ago, Raziel said:

Ok ok... shit on WWE and the company all anyone wants, but acting like the workers aren't busting ass is just false and pushing a bullshit narrative to prop up the "Burn it to the ground" desire this board had.

 

WWE has a lot of problems, the talent and their "workrate" ain't one of them and it's bullshit to put the issues on them.

The way I took his post is that morale is so low that a lot of the roster is just going through the motions. Dolph Ziggler used to be one of the bright spots and a dude that went way above and beyond. Now he's just cashing a check, and trying to do just enough to keep those checks coming in. It's not something to get bent out of shape over. WWE's booking is bad. Really fucking bad. Even with all these releases, there's still a ton of good workers on the roster tho. Now whether they are allowed to showcase it or not is up for debate. It's obvious dudes like Ali & Ricochet are being purposely told to scale it back and not go all out. And if people commenting on that angers you, don't know what to tell ya.

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47 minutes ago, NoFistsJustFlips said:

The way I took his post is that morale is so low that a lot of the roster is just going through the motions. Dolph Ziggler used to be one of the bright spots and a dude that went way above and beyond. Now he's just cashing a check, and trying to do just enough to keep those checks coming in. It's not something to get bent out of shape over. WWE's booking is bad. Really fucking bad. Even with all these releases, there's still a ton of good workers on the roster tho. Now whether they are allowed to showcase it or not is up for debate. It's obvious dudes like Ali & Ricochet are being purposely told to scale it back and not go all out. And if people commenting on that angers you, don't know what to tell ya.

So.. despite evidence to the contrary with multiple hours of TV and PPV's, most of thr roster are lazy coasters cashing checks, got it.

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28 minutes ago, Raziel said:

So.. despite evidence to the contrary with multiple hours of TV and PPV's, most of thr roster are lazy coasters cashing checks, got it.

Yeah that argument seems pretty damn disingenuous when you see Charlotte moonsaulting off the top of the turnbuckle to the floor on an almost monthly basis, or even something so simple and common yet easy to hurt/get hurt on like Big E's splash on the edge of the ring.

You can fault WWE for a lot of things, but suggesting the wrestlers who are still getting badly injured and going full-on in the ring are "coasting" is a bad look

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Artistically frustrated. Learnt all these great techniques for shading, layering, contrasting, chiaroscuro, composition, perspective, et cetera. And then, rather than go out and create the beautiful art that they want to create, that they know how to create, they're handed a paint by numbers sheet and told not to colour outside the lines.

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3 hours ago, AxB said:

Artistically frustrated. Learnt all these great techniques for shading, layering, contrasting, chiaroscuro, composition, perspective, et cetera. And then, rather than go out and create the beautiful art that they want to create, that they know how to create, they're handed a paint by numbers sheet and told not to colour outside the lines.

That's a better way of saying what I meant. I was also just kind of being flippant. I don't actually think WWE workers are sleepwalking through matches. 

 

FWIW, there have been multiple folks released in the last two years who have talked about coasting until their deals came up....

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5 hours ago, AxB said:

Artistically frustrated. Learnt all these great techniques for shading, layering, contrasting, chiaroscuro, composition, perspective, et cetera. And then, rather than go out and create the beautiful art that they want to create, that they know how to create, they're handed a paint by numbers sheet and told not to colour outside the lines.

Perfect post. This demonstrates what I was trying to convey way better than I could. Love it. Thank you for being better at words than I will ever be lol.

 

 

5 hours ago, Raziel said:

So.. despite evidence to the contrary with multiple hours of TV and PPV's, most of thr roster are lazy coasters cashing checks, got it.

That's a disingenuous way to boil down what I said. I stand by what I said. So top rope moonsault = effort in your opinion? Because in my opinion doing a moonsault can be just as lazy and going through the motions as a rest hold. Trust me. I've used moonsaults as filler. Just because it's degree of difficulty is higher than a chin lock, doesn't mean just because you're doing one you're giving your all. Charlotte can sleepwalk through moonsaults I promise you. Same with Big E's splash. A splash is a splash is a splash, apron or not. I believe lazy ass King Kong Bundy did a shit load of them.

We have a difference of opinion here. And that's okay. I do see guys putting in work. But I'm just saying no one is going that extra mile anymore. AJ Style is my favorite worker in WWE. You saying he's working just as hard as he was in 2016 & 2017? Aint no way my man. And why would he. Effort, skill, connecting with the audience, moving merch... none of it matters anymore. No one is allowed to go out and get themselves over. WWE is paint by numbers with the same 10 colors in a 64 million color world.

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5 hours ago, just drew said:

FWIW, there have been multiple folks released in the last two years who have talked about coasting until their deals came up....

Care to name names?  If that’s the attitude they take towards their job, I’d like to know who they are so I don’t accidentally waste time watching them.

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1 minute ago, Tarheel Moneghetti said:

Entitlement?  How so?

Came off as pretty douchey. "So I don't accidentally waste time watching them." 

I have no idea why WWE superstars doing the bare minimum would upset anyone in 2021. I hope everyone under contract there gets the most money for least effort possible. 

 

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Just to add to that, until creative & the office start doing more than the bare minimum why should anyone on the roster? We're all here because we love pro wrestling. But pro wrestling is only at it's best when everyone involved is giving equal effort. Going the extra mile by taking big dumb bumps or beating the shit out of each other when you're feuding over pies in the face seems like asking for a lot to me. When creative starts taking shit serious, then the boys should. But until then, do what's asked of you. Don't do more for them than they're willing to do for you.

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1 minute ago, just drew said:

Came off as pretty douchey. "So I don't accidentally waste time watching them." 

Fair enough.  I shouldn’t have put it like that.  But I’m not really a fan of just collecting a paycheck and not feeling obliged to be a professional.  I don’t expect talent to beat themselves up every night, but I think they’re obliged to go out on a consistent basis and work hard to entertain paying fans.  Fans don’t buy tickets to see you passively aggressively spar with your employer.  At the end of the day, most WWE wrestlers seem to make out well financially.  Most people work harder for less pay.  I don’t think it’s too much to expect AJ or whoever to put their baggage aside long enough to work a 15-min match.

That said, I don’t believe that talent mailing it in is one of WWE’s larger issues.

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I respect that. I would contend that 90+% of WWE's audience is there to see the stars, not the matches. I really think they could go back to an 80's "bump, pose, sell, comeback, pin, wave to crowd" style that served them so well in the past. Guys doing springboard planchas on house shows just seems dumb when you don't know from one day to the next if you have a job...

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No lie, as someone who picked Adon almost all the time when the cousins were throwing down on SF at the arcade, I geeked tfo when Hook debuted on Rampage in what I thought was Adon tribute gear

 

 

 

Edited by Hayabusa
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When AJ came to WWE, he was well known not to be in perfect health and was in his late 30ies. It's 4-5 years later now, he had a few serious injuries he seemingly never fully healed up // tended to. Now he is in a tag team, where he does the major part of the work, so I don't think it's fair to name him as an example for talent phoning it in. 

I really think that most of the WWE talent works TOO hard, pretty much a Modern wrestling problem though, where everyone does almost everything in every match. But no, wrestlers phoning it in is not a WWE problem. 

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I know people like to see a positive in a tragedy, but I'm having a tough time here. 

All the respect in the world for Amanda Huber and all the strength is what I want to provide. 

All of you with kids, family and friends, make sure that they know how you feel about them, it's always worth it. 

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1 hour ago, AxB said:

 

Man, that's fucking heartbreaking. Got me crying. The late, great Mr. Brodie Lee went way too soon. One of my favourites so I always looked to see if Luke Harper was booked on the WWE Live shows I had tickets to. Sadly it wasn't meant to be as the one time he was in April 2016, he suffered a knee injury a few weeks earlier. Love to the Huber Family, special occasions and anniversaries are particularly tough xxx.

Edited by The Natural
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