Friday Night Dynamite - 6/18/2021

[eikerir]

Underrated moment of the night is Hangman smoothly avoiding talking about Kenny by praising the rest of the Dark Order including 5’s new jacket which is alright.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

I know I'm likely gonna be in the minority, but I actually really dig Kenny and Don as '80s ski movie heels. The interrupting with the shitty little golf cart horn cracked me up. 

 

 

[Wyld Samurai]

2 hours ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I know I'm likely gonna be in the minority, but I actually really dig Kenny and Don as '80s ski movie heels. The interrupting with the shitty little golf cart horn cracked me up. 

 

 

Likewise. I love the Kenny / Don heeling. It's some of the best stuff I've seen in decades outside the ring. Nakazawa is also just perfect in his role!

 

[EVA]

4 hours ago, caley said:

I like Jungle Boy well enough, but he seems wary on the mic and I don't think he's taking the title quite yet (

Yeah, I’m a big Jungle Boy proponent from way back, but while he has been increasingly excellent in the ring, his progress in pretty much every other department has been a flat line for two solid years now.  He has negative charisma outside the ring.  I feel like calling his promo style “aloof” is being generous.  And what does it even mean that he’s “Jungle Boy” besides the hair and the gear?  I don’t know.  And I’m pretty sure he doesn’t either.  

This is all stuff he’s got to figure out before he’s ready to be the guy.  They’ve been working very hard to Weekend at Bernie’s him through the build up to this title match, and doing an okay job of it, but your world champ has to have a pulse.

[eikerir]

6 hours ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I know I'm likely gonna be in the minority, but I actually really dig Kenny and Don as '80s ski movie heels. The interrupting with the shitty little golf cart horn cracked me up. 

 

 

I love it, he had me cracking up when he started talking about the knuckle sandwiches he brought to the picnic.

[A_K]

7 hours ago, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I know I'm likely gonna be in the minority, but I actually really dig Kenny and Don as '80s ski movie heels. The interrupting with the shitty little golf cart horn cracked me up. 

 

 

No - it’s perfect for him. Since he took the belt I’ve again & again & again rounded back to a Kurt Angle-like goof reign as being a good fit; a nerd & a technician, who has a streak of cowardice in some contexts but backed into the corner will fight to the death. The worst Omega is the pompous, serious-without-irony Omega. The same went for the Bucks, really. This is Ok

[Bryan]

20 hours ago, Kev said:

I thought the opener was fine as a novelty, like Hager getting the win in his environment. Generally liked the chaotic post-match, although the Sammy run-in, complete with theme song, was a bit off. I like the subtle teases of Wardlow as ‘actually a decent dude’ for when the inevitable face turn comes.

Handicap was good and, again, nice logical booking, although like everyone else I’m wondering what’s the next step here, I suppose that’s a good thing though.

OC vs. Bononi was fun. Perfect wrestling as variety show stuff. I can’t really put my finger on what it is, but Statlander has added something to the Best Friends act, and they continue to be the most likeable thing in AEW for me.

I quite liked the goofy Kenny segment in the moment, but it feels misplaced for the heel world champ. See Miro for someone who can say goofy shit while still coming off totally legit as a character, but Kenny feels like he’s role-playing 80s comedy villain.

Hardy’s act just comes off very minor league to me, just not believable. Bunny is dreadful also. In theory, I like that they’re playing off their history with this little feud for Christian, but Hardy is someone I don’t think offers much anymore (at least on screen).

Thought Brock looked decent enough, that whole thing was fine, nothing  more to really say on it.

I hope the Andrade interview being solo signifies more of a loose association with Vickie (e.g. she doesn’t actually appear with him). Not keen on them teasing another surprise, just let the surprise be a surprise.

Hart is very green but thought that match was solid. It probably shouldn’t be significant but I appreciate the simplicity of them booking the more experienced wrestlers to have advantages over the rookies so there’s a clear hierarchy being built.

Nothing about this Nyla Brit setup is working for me. Transitioning Brit into a tweener role also feels increasingly like it could be a misstep. If your unlikeable heel is your most over face then you need better face characters.

If Penta isn’t going to be heel then they should really ditch Abrahantes.

With the new gimmick and him going for a grizzled vet, mercenary thing, Kazarian could do with dropping some of his more high-flying and convoluted stuff. He’s a weird one for me in that he always hits his ‘athletic spots’ perfectly well, but for some reason they never actually look good. I kind of feel the same way about Nick Jackson. Is it just me or is this a thing? I’d use something like ‘forced/false athleticism’ to describe it.

Abrahantes is the best part out of the Pentagon character outside the ring, imo. 

I agree with pretty much agree with everything else you said.

The criticism of the “MMA” match not looking realistic enough is amusing to me. Since on this same show everyone waited outside the ring to catch Orange Cassidy while the Best Friends took a good minute to get him up. Literally everyone could have gotten into the ring to stop it. Talk about unrealistic. Never mind this promotions fans take 90lb Marko Stunt seriously as a wrestler.

I guess people have so much more respect for MMA than pro wrestling that they have higher standards for worked MMA matches?

The striking sucked but the striking sucks in all pretty much all American modern wrestling matches these days.

But I liked the finish and thought they did a pretty good job of making Wardlow look strong in a losing effort. Also, they way he inserted wrestling moves in the match was pretty good. I was pretty impressed with him running into that hurricanranna. If that was a real move you could perform on someone without their cooperation, I think that would be how it would work.
 

 

[scatterheart]

Kenny's brand of comedy is super fun and amusing for a European Champion.

[Big Z]

I've enjoyed the Don Callis/Kenny Omega characters and generally have liked their promos. Also, very much enjoying the Young Bucks/Brandon Cutler dynamic (with the Bucks forcing him to turn to the dark side with them). My issue with their matches, especially with Omega, in finding the right formula between heel chicanery and blatant, elongated interference with multiple men (like the ending of the Omega-Moxley match at Revolution). Well timed, occasional interference from a manager/second still works in any era of wrestling. To reference New Japan, I think that Jay White and Gedo have it down well whereas Evil singles matches are almost unwatchable these days with Dick Togo's way too liberal participation. It should where the heels show enough skill to where you think they do not necessarily need the help. yet still rely on the help in key moments to mostly push them over the top (at least for the top of the card guys like Omega and the Bucks). I think that Omega's title match at Double or Nothing was much improved because the interference was contained to select moments that helped advance the story, yet he snuck out in the end thanks to just his physical actions.

[Goodear]

2 hours ago, Bryan said:

The criticism of the “MMA” match not looking realistic enough is amusing to me. Since on this same show everyone waited outside the ring to catch Orange Cassidy while the Best Friends took a good minute to get him up. Literally everyone could have gotten into the ring to stop it. Talk about unrealistic. Never mind this promotions fans take 90lb Marko Stunt seriously as a wrestler.

I guess people have so much more respect for MMA than pro wrestling that they have higher standards for worked MMA matches?

The striking sucked but the striking sucks in all pretty much all American modern wrestling matches these days.

Have you ever watched like a sitcom do professional wrestling and thought just how wrong it almost always looks and feels? It almost always seems to me like someone taking a very surface level understanding of professional wrestling and in attempting to translate it to a different audience, they make it look 'fake' which is amazing since it's already fake to begin with (sitcom wrestling loves them some airplane spins let me tell you). I would say that in this instance, trying to do fake MMA looked really wrong in a similar manner. 

 

[DangerMark]

Someone included a Hurricanrana in the old Pride FC game for the PS2 so I, for one, am prepared to accept them in my MMA matches.

[Casey]

It's weird that people still complain about Marko Stunt, since he's basically a glorified mascot for the Jurassic Express at this point, hasn't won a meaningful match in WELL over a fucking year - and when he does win a match, it's usually in tag matches, and going over either enhancement talent, or people nobody cares about like Cutler, Luther, etc. I don't even really care for Stunt in the ring, but it's such low hanging fruit that complaints about him seem really dumb at this point, especially with how they're using him. It'd be one thing if he was the one challenging Kenny Omega in two weeks for the title, but instead he's getting wins on Dark over indie dudes or getting squashed by bigger guys/people they want to push.

I mean, really, without going back to watch it, can you tell me how much offense he got in against Santana, Ortiz and Guevara in their six man tag over a year ago? No? Then who cares about how realistic it looks when he gets offense in against someone, since nobody is going to remember shit like that in a few weeks (much less a year plus later).

Also the MMA thing sucked and Cassidy/Bononi was way better. Even though they committed the cardinal sin of Jim Ross' idea of wrestling, where they do dives to the outside and everyone waits around (oh no).

[Infinit]

29 minutes ago, DangerMark said:

Someone included a Hurricanrana in the old Pride FC game for the PS2 so I, for one, am prepared to accept them in my MMA matches.

Didn't someone once hit a hurricanana in a Pride match?

[Eoae]

I do find Stunt's spots too obviously contrived (maybe cooperative is a better word), but, yeah, he's not pushed very hard and I honestly find him mostly entertaining with the Jurassic Express.  Maybe less so on his own.

I'd much rather watch Stunt doing obviously-assisted huracanranas and tilt-a-whirl headscissors than watch Dom Mysterio doing contrived lucha spots designed for someone a lot shorter, fwiw.

Edited June 20, 2021 by Eoae

[DreamBroken]

I liked the MMA fight, felt like a cool unique concept and a nice something different. A good Hager specialty match specific to him that could be used sporadically. Thought the handicap match was a really great Darby performance. Loved Brock Anderson's DDT counter and thought he looked very good for his first match, great gear. Fun main event, liking Kazarian being in the top mix. Definitely looking forward to things ramping up a bit again with the Saturday special and then finally returning to the regular Wednesday slot. 

[Guest Jimbo_Tsuruta]

On 6/20/2021 at 8:49 AM, Zakk_Sabbath said:

I know I'm likely gonna be in the minority, but I actually really dig Kenny and Don as '80s ski movie heels. The interrupting with the shitty little golf cart horn cracked me up. 

 

 

Don't think you are. Being a smarmy, sleazy goof fits him better than if he tried to come off as cool or tough.

Edited June 21, 2021 by Jimbo_Tsuruta

[DangerMark]

11 hours ago, Infinit said:

Didn't someone once hit a hurricanana in a Pride match?

I think so. I've been trying to google it but no luck working out exactly who. Looking through movesets on GameFAQs but I don't think it's a complete list of fighters. It was definitely available for the Create-a-Fighter mode because, well, guess.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

3 hours ago, Jimbo_Tsuruta said:

Don't think you are. Being a smarmy, sleazy goof fits him better than if he tried to come off as cool or tough.

Yeah, apparently I was way off on that one! Pleasantly surprised to see how much others are enjoying their act.

[Bryan]

On 6/20/2021 at 4:10 PM, Casey said:

It's weird that people still complain about Marko Stunt, since he's basically a glorified mascot for the Jurassic Express at this point, hasn't won a meaningful match in WELL over a fucking year - and when he does win a match, it's usually in tag matches, and going over either enhancement talent, or people nobody cares about like Cutler, Luther, etc. I don't even really care for Stunt in the ring, but it's such low hanging fruit that complaints about him seem really dumb at this point, especially with how they're using him. It'd be one thing if he was the one challenging Kenny Omega in two weeks for the title, but instead he's getting wins on Dark over indie dudes or getting squashed by bigger guys/people they want to push.

I mean, really, without going back to watch it, can you tell me how much offense he got in against Santana, Ortiz and Guevara in their six man tag over a year ago? No? Then who cares about how realistic it looks when he gets offense in against someone, since nobody is going to remember shit like that in a few weeks (much less a year plus later).

Also the MMA thing sucked and Cassidy/Bononi was way better. Even though they committed the cardinal sin of Jim Ross' idea of wrestling, where they do dives to the outside and everyone waits around (oh no).

I can recall Stunt kicking out of Penta’s  package pile driver, and I only brought him up because him wrestling is the fakest thing I’ve seen in wrestling.

And in the context that people were criticizing the worked MMA match for not looking real enough but are okay with other incredibly fake things. Including the Orange Cassidy catapult into the waiting arms of the jobbers that took forever to perform.

It’s just weird to me and kind of funny that people can shit on a worked MMA fight for not looking real enough and then in the same breath defend a comically contrived dive spot in which everyone is clearly cooperating with each other just to perform the spot.

[Zakk_Sabbath]

46 minutes ago, Bryan said:

I can recall Stunt kicking out of Penta’s  package pile driver, and I only brought him up because him wrestling is the fakest thing I’ve seen in wrestling.

And in the context that people were criticizing the worked MMA match for not looking real enough but are okay with other incredibly fake things. Including the Orange Cassidy catapult into the waiting arms of the jobbers that took forever to perform.

It’s just weird to me and kind of funny that people can shit on a worked MMA fight for not looking real enough and then in the same breath defend a comically contrived dive spot in which everyone is clearly cooperating with each other just to perform the spot.

I don't know man, setting matters. If you're gonna do the whole Lions Den thing, it's not my cup of tea, but at least let me see some UWFi shit. And truthfully, I didn't think this was even that bad as far as these kinds of matches go, but I just hate it in my wrestling personally. Even my girlfriend, who's new to wrestling within the last few years, made the comparison of "Did they not watch the Brawl 4 All thing on Vice?" And the Wardlow jumping off the cage spot seemed like straight up gif bait.  

[zendragon]

The Wardlow jumping off the cage was a reference to an actual MMA fight, a few of the spots where lifted from MMA such as Wardlow hitting the Matt Hughes slam. I thought the whole thing was okay. Dig that they referenced Wardlow having a win under Pro Wrestling rules so now each man has a win under specialty.

Kinda surprised they are having MJF Sammy this early. I figured that was the big money match, and with ten guys in the feud you could have held off on it for a while by running different match combinations.

Looks like they are turning Brit face which is also surprising, but I would like to see Shida slowly turn heel by becoming obsessed with regaining the belt. which she never defended infront of the fans

[zendragon]

On 6/18/2021 at 10:14 PM, The Natural said:

Hoping to see Tay Conti in an AEW MMA Rules Cage Fight with her judo. Conti vs. Ikaru Shida in MMA regulated garb, gloves and barefoot. Conti vs. Thunder Rosa in that cage perhaps? Be fun to get Dr. Britt Baker training vignettes akin to Jeff Jarrett MMA in a build towards having one.

Britt having to train MMA for Thunder Rosa could be really fun

[Technico Support]

The simulated MMA match was fun in a goofy way.  Smartly booked with Wardlow getting a hell of a shine before losing to a superior MMA guy.  Cool moment with the almost fist bump before the run-in, continuing the Wardlow slow-build turn.  I've been watching a lot of Paradigm's UFWI-style matches so I didn't enjoy this as much, but those matches and this are apples and oranges and this was fine for what is was.

Brock Anderson has a weird build and/or his tights were too big for him.  Also baby blue is not a good color for tights when you're a dude who sweats a lot.  It looked like he'd pooped his pants by the end of the match.

I enjoyed the Omega/Jungle Boy segment a lot.  Omega and Callis are fun as a this arrogant, bumbling heel unit who are still dangerous come matchtime.  Him kicking Nakazawa out of the golf cart was tremendous.

I'm more partial to the Toronto Fairmont than the Four Seasons.  I won't tell you about the time I accidentally lounged around in the kids' pool looking like a predator.

I liked the main but I agree these sports entertainment bullshit interference wins are going to catch up with AEW eventually.

JR introduced Andrade as "Andrade the Idol," only to be corrected in a heel manner, a fun way to cover up the fact that he clearly can't pronounce "el idolo."

The PnP/FTR package was great but I'm not sure I'm into repositioning them as tough rednecks who came from nothing.  Those kind of guys would tolerate MJF for about two minutes.

Just keep feuding Best Friends with the Wingmen.  That was awesome.

I loved the Page/Dark Order segment.  So wholesome.  Some guy here was saying they should have Miro destroy and break up  the Dark Order because that would get him SO MUCH HEAT BRO which is all kinds of a nutty thing.

Very cool for Eddie to lay out in that promo and not bring his A game so Kazarian could look good.  

LOOOOOL @ JR indignantly asking "WHEN DID HE BECOME THE MACHINE GUN?????"  Like, probably 15 years ago, you senile old coot.  Maybe learn about the people you're supposed to talk about for a living.  Put some semblance of time in instead of coasting and cashing checks because you were lucky enough to work for the top company during a hot period and got famous.  Have a little pride in your work.  Damn.

Handicap matches are always stupid unless it's a monster beating two jobbers to show what a monster he is.  That's it.

That was the cleanest, most sparsely-populated toolbox I've ever seen.  It takes me 10 minutes to find the fucking pliers and Page found the wirecutters in 5 seconds.

Miro is awesome.

Liberty?!?!?  LOOOOOL Cody's going to be one of those parents who pierces his daughter's ears before she's 3.

 

Edited June 22, 2021 by Technico Support

[Log]

I turned on Dynamite Friday, and I saw the cage set up and I immediately thought, "I don't like this."  I don't like anything in pro wrestling that does the "this part isn't like the rest of the show, it's real" stuff.  I don't want to see a "real" fight on a show with Orange Cassidy.  

That said, I ended up liking the match.  They did a pro wrestling match in that cage, IMO.  It made sense that Hager got the win in his "environment".  I like it when wrestlers have a specialty and they almost always succeed with it.  

[Go2Sleep]

JR screaming "He just hit a 60 year old man... With Parkinsons!" was his best commentary in AEW. Reminded me of when he'd go super over the top for HHH's heel antics in 99.

Apropos of nothing, I also found myself thinking how funny it would be to make him call a random tag with Christian Cage and Adam Page vs. Ethan Page and Brian Cage.